Baptist Confession of Faith

[johnshelby]

well, i’ve said a number of times that the Baptist church
didn’t have a CCC to look to…

well, seems as happens ( a lot ), i was wrong… lol

i came across this site, anyone who is interested in studying
what the beliefs of this particular Baptist denomination are
might find it interesting… i haven’t read it all yet, but i will again
emphasize, not all demoninations of Baptists believe the same…

reformedreader.org/ccc/1689lbc/english/1689econtents.htm

 

[neophyte]

Interesting.

Chapter 1 appears to be almost word for word a copy of the Westminster Confession.

Chapter 14 also, except that they removed the troublesome word “sacraments” and added some bit about the “faith” of temporary believers is different in nature from “saving faith”. Hmm, does this mean that mere “believing” is insufficient?

Looks like they were trying to plug the holes.

 

[Contarini]

The Confession is adapted from the Congregationalist Savoy Confession, which is in turn an adaptation of Westminster.

Edwin

 

[johnshelby]

neophyte:

Interesting.

Chapter 1 appears to be almost word for word a copy of the Westminster Confession.

Chapter 14 also, except that they removed the troublesome word “sacraments” and added some bit about the “faith” of temporary believers is different in nature from “saving faith”. Hmm, does this mean that mere “believing” is insufficient?

Looks like they were trying to plug the holes.

i guess the temporary believers, are the ones who “lose their
salvation”… they are just saying they never really had it…

 

[johnshelby]

Contarini:

The Confession is adapted from the Congregationalist Savoy Confession, which is in turn an adaptation of Westminster.

Edwin

Hi Edwin…

according to their forward, this predates the Westminster by some time… “These early Baptists were conscious that the 1644 Calvinistic Baptist Confession predated the 1646 Presbyterian Confession and the 1658 Congregationalist Confession.”

i’m assuming the 1646 Presbyterian Confession is the the
Westminster…

 

[trumpet152]

johnshelby:

i guess the temporary believers, are the ones who “lose their
salvation”… they are just saying they never really had it…

That’s the typical defense. Not very convincing though…

 

[RyanL]

trumpet152:

That’s the typical defense. Not very convincing though…

Especially when you consider that they teach that those who never really had it can fool themselves into thinking they did, and then they teach absolute assurance of the believer. Very odd.

God Bless,
RyanL

 

[Matt14]

Yep, the old OSAS catch-22.

In science, I think they call it an untestable hypothesis.

 

[johnshelby]

Matt14:

Yep, the old OSAS catch-22.

In science, I think they call it an untestable hypothesis.

“if he lost it, he never had it, but he didn’t know it, just thought
he knew it”…

something like that?? lol

 

[Contarini]

johnshelby:

Hi Edwin…

according to their forward, this predates the Westminster by some time… “These early Baptists were conscious that the 1644 Calvinistic Baptist Confession predated the 1646 Presbyterian Confession and the 1658 Congregationalist Confession.”

i’m assuming the 1646 Presbyterian Confession is the the
Westminster…

That’s the First London Confession. The text to which you provided a link is the Second Confession, first written in 1677 and approved in 1689.

And yes, the 1646 Confession is Westminster.

Edwin

 

[Matt14]

“if he lost it, he never had it, but he didn’t know it, just thought
he knew it”…

something like that?? lol

That’s exactly it. Strange how Jesus says a good tree will bear good fruit, but many denominationalists will say a man can walk like a Christian and talk like a Christian, and claim Christ, but if he ever departs from the faith, “he wasn’t really a Christian.”

Completely untestable.

I’m not catholic, but I’ve debated many a denominational protestant on the eternal security issue, and that’s a general fall-back position.

 

[johnshelby]

Contarini:

That’s the First London Confession. The text to which you provided a link is the Second Confession, first written in 1677 and approved in 1689.

And yes, the 1646 Confession is Westminster.

Edwin

ok, it said that the first one was never really signed or officiated
or something, for fear of reprisal…

thanks…

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

johnshelby:

well, i’ve said a number of times that the Baptist church
didn’t have a CCC to look to…

well, seems as happens ( a lot ), i was wrong… lol

i came across this site, anyone who is interested in studying
what the beliefs of this particular Baptist denomination are
might find it interesting… i haven’t read it all yet, but i will again
emphasize, not all demoninations of Baptists believe the same…

reformedreader.org/ccc/1689lbc/english/1689econtents.htm

Is the 1689 Confession ?​

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

johnshelby:

well, i’ve said a number of times that the Baptist church
didn’t have a CCC to look to…

well, seems as happens ( a lot ), i was wrong… lol

i came across this site, anyone who is interested in studying
what the beliefs of this particular Baptist denomination are
might find it interesting… i haven’t read it all yet, but i will again
emphasize, not all demoninations of Baptists believe the same…

reformedreader.org/ccc/1689lbc/english/1689econtents.htm

answers.com/topic/1689-baptist-confession-of-faith - Historical background (with many links)

fordham.edu/halsall/mod/1644baptists.html - The Baptist Confessions of 1644 & 1655 [the Westminster Confession was adopted by the Scottish Church in 1647]

reformerkev.esmartweb.com/savoy.html - Appendix to the Savoy Declaration of 1658 (on which the Confession of 1689 is in part based)

The Westminster Confession - bible-researcher.com/wescon01.html

Annotated Edition. With Introduction, Bibliography, Scripture references, and notes showing all changes to the Confession made in the Savoy Declaration and by Presbyterian churches in America.

Introduction and Bibliography - bible-researcher.com/wescon01.html#intro

• Annotated Text of the Confession (1647)
• Annotations to the Confession
• Appendix A: Major Changes of the Savoy Declaration (1658)
• Appendix B: Major Changes of the PCUSA (1788-1958)
• Appendix C: Major Changes of the UPCUSA and PCUS (1958-1983)

The links can be found on the page

The Savoy Declaration itself seems not to be on-line ##

 

[Zooey]

Matt14:

That’s exactly it. Strange how Jesus says a good tree will bear good fruit, but many denominationalists will say a man can walk like a Christian and talk like a Christian, and claim Christ, but if he ever departs from the faith, “he wasn’t really a Christian.”

Completely untestable.

I’m not catholic, but I’ve debated many a denominational protestant on the eternal security issue, and that’s a general fall-back position.

What makes me crazy, is if you try to back it up a little, and ask, suppose that person had died before he left the faith?
I have never been able to understand that part…probably http://bestsmileys.com/clueless/4.gifbecause there is no answer.
He could have been living a good Christian life for the past 30 or 40 years…But there is always the argument that he never really believed.

 

[johnshelby]

answers.com/topic/1689-baptist-confession-of-faith - Historical background (with many links)

fordham.edu/halsall/mod/1644baptists.html - The Baptist Confessions of 1644 & 1655 [the Westminster Confession was adopted by the Scottish Church in 1647]

reformerkev.esmartweb.com/savoy.html - Appendix to the Savoy Declaration of 1658 (on which the Confession of 1689 is in part based)

The Westminster Confession - bible-researcher.com/wescon01.html

Annotated Edition. With Introduction, Bibliography, Scripture references, and notes showing all changes to the Confession made in the Savoy Declaration and by Presbyterian churches in America.

Introduction and Bibliography - bible-researcher.com/wescon01.html#intro

• Annotated Text of the Confession (1647)
• Annotations to the Confession
• Appendix A: Major Changes of the Savoy Declaration (1658)
• Appendix B: Major Changes of the PCUSA (1788-1958)
• Appendix C: Major Changes of the UPCUSA and PCUS (1958-1983)

The links can be found on the page

The Savoy Declaration itself seems not to be on-line ##

well… and you are just now showing me all this?? lol

thanks…