Baptist dads case for faith alone

[accitenor]

I personally do not take any protestant claim seriously. Protestant “faiths” are incorrect in their major claims. All protestant sects during the Reformation were founded by MEN with personal agendas. Modern sects - it is estimated that there are over 8,000 protestant sects - may even be founded by “Christians” who can’t get a regular job.(Edited)
However, I firmly believe that a good Protestant - of any sect - if he/she follows his perceived obligations properly, and obeys the Ten Commandments properly, can be saved.
(Edited)

 

[Teufelhunde]

There are many passages in the bible that refer to good works, faith, and the bible. All of these combined, but most of all being in the state of grace, is required to enter heaven. I am grateful for Father Reid’s answer. It helps me in my understanding of where good men awaited the sacrifice of Our Lord. I won’t make specific quotes but I know without grace on our soul we will surely go to hell. One of the ways to ensure we die in the state of grace, is to receive the sacraments, go to confession (if we are in the state of sin), and help others get to heaven; both by doing the corporal and the spiritual works of mercy. By doing good works, I believe it helps strengthen our faith, keeping us away from sin and at the same time assisting others know and love God, so they too may obtain the beatific vision. I am not all the learned in many things, but by being a marine for 21 years and very close to death on several occasions, I did learn that praying the rosary daily, praying throughout the day as you perform your daily tasks, performing the things Christ mentioned in the beatitudes, and any other ways of doing good, in order to stop you from falling into sin, helps. I never amounted for much in this life, but I hope to be a saint one day. God love you all
(Edited)

 

[simspt]

My Baptist dad is using the good thief on the cross to show faith alone and says that justified is different than saved. Heres what he said

"Not a mention of “works”. Your “good works”, that “justifies” us, is how we are to live after being “saved”.That is why we are "justified by “good works”, not “saved” by “good works”; not “justified” by “Grace, through faith”, but “saved” by “Grace, through faith”.

Perhaps, we should consult the highest authority there is. In the Gospel according to St. Luke, while Jesus was being crucified, one of the thieves beside Him said “Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom”. (Luke 23:42, King James version) The reply of the dying Jesus was,“Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise.” (Luke 23:42, KJv) Jesus did not say ‘Sorry, you had no Good Works’, nor did he say ‘You won’t die here, I’ll give you another year to do enough Good Works to justify you for salvation’. Jesus accepted the sinner’s simple declaration of faith and gave him salvation."

How can I respond to this?

I would recommend he go over the G of John regarding salvation. Hint>> it has something to do with obeying commandments.

 

[jokerswild180]

The Church and Lutherans already figured this whole justification/salvation thing out in 1999:
vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/chrstuni/documents/rc_pc_chrstuni_doc_31101999_cath-luth-joint-declaration_en.html

 

[WT1]

Well, I’d say for starters that the thief had no time to perform good works; they were all about to be crucified. The thief did what he could before he died, and all that he had time for was faith.

Actually if you read the scripture the thief defends Christ, from the other thief, before Christ tells him that he is saved so in theory the thief performed a good work first.

Good works and grace are symbiotic and you can’t separate them. You can’t have grace without the desire for good works and good works typically lead to the desire for grace.

The Grace vs Works argument is the biggest tragedy in the Christian faith in that it has been incredibly divisive for absolutely no reason.

 

[Frankenfurter]

The Church and Lutherans already figured this whole justification/salvation thing out in 1999:
vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/chrstuni/documents/rc_pc_chrstuni_doc_31101999_cath-luth-joint-declaration_en.html

That’s a great link!

I bet the Baptist will find it surprising that the Vatican says (in union with the Lutherans) that:

19.We confess together that all persons depend completely on the saving grace of God for their salvation.

I’ll bet that once you show him this quote from the Vatican that he will realize his understanding of Catholic faith was wrong. A lot of Baptist seem to think that Catholics are going around trying to buy their way into heaven by doing ‘works’.

The trick here is going to be gently letting your Baptist Dad know that he simply has got some wrong information concerning the Catholics. A very common thing actually.