Be Tolerant at ground Zero

[KathleenGee]

This place was going to be named the Cordoba Mosque…and we now all know what happened to the non-Muslims during the Sharia compliant occupation of Spain by Islam.

This crowd wanted the Cordoba mosque site to start on September 11…and to say this is no conquest symbol?

One of the top imams in the world wrote a public letter to the Pope and said many Muslim imams in the world felt doing this in NYC was wrong…and that the attack at the World Trade Center was not an attack against Christianity but against America as the world economic top power. So the attacks were economic…and to place this Cordoba building at the economic center of the world was indeed a statement of conquest.

Please please please do not listen to the flower power words of these Islamacist characters in New York…check out their Marxist/socialist supporters or with those affluent and powerful Americans who are in secret clubs that use Islam symbols and facilitated this group…do not listen to what they say…they will see you as fools anyway…but watch what they do and who they associate with…and their history of how they treat our people once they are here — suing, intimidation, money laundering…fraud.

September 11 means something to the Islamicist militants…do a search and find out yourselves on what this means to them, and what September means to them in general.

The Muslim Brotherhood – contemporary Militant Islam – that comes out of Babylonia thousands of years ago and is continually at war…be it through Islam or as the former spirit of Amalek – this evil entity just declared war on America in September…the month of Mary, Mother of Sorrows.

There are the Muslims of Mecca who are peaceful. Then there are the Muslims of Medina who worked to take over our holy places, the source of the origin of our beliefs…now many Christians are being forced to flee the Holy Land…is this what Christ warned about in Scriptures…?..I don’t know. But I am also hearing as of last night that the South Sudan which is Christian, has been suffering Muslim atrocities for many years and now are facing the Arabs and their possible liquidation.

This is genocide…but it is in the name of Allah, of God the creator…this is not God but sheer evil.

Now my exit from this thread…

 

[Patrick_Joshua]

I think the Muslim community should have respect, nevermind American’s to show religious tolerance for Islam, It’s nothing about religious tolerance here.

Certain Muslims in the name of Islam killed thousands of people, then a mosque is getting built years after, why do the Muslim community not show sympathy and respect, and build it somewhere else?

It’s like a Nazi flag getting put down on a Jewish grave.

My personal opinion is if the Mosque is built, it will have alot of troubles in the aftermath.

 

[Publisher]

“Mosque being built”??? The mosque is already in existence and has been for years…they wish to remodel it…it is not at “ground zero”…it is two New York blocks away from “ground zero”.

 

[Publisher]

Dear Friend dianaiad:

I have heard Muslims say that there is no insult intended. I can’t say that they mean otherwise. When someone tells you they have a stomach ache, you can’t say that they don’t. I would offer that the intent is up to the people doing the building. How we react is up to us. Let me be specific. I have read the New Testament and I take it that Christians are followers of Jesus. To me that makes the response simple, because I think Jesus gave examples in His own life. For instance, my sense is that the crowning with thorns wasn’t just an insult. It was a very painful insult. It was also a lesson. The fact that He took this treatment wasn’t s sign of weakness or a call to Christians to be doormats. It was a call to have our minds and energy fixed on what is infinitely more than the cares of who wins or loses in the passing distractions of this world. If we are unable to learn the lessons from His actions, at least through imitation we could move through this world with the dignity and grace that comes from only within, and transcends the activities around us. I would humbly offer that our spiritual development isn’t served well by getting caught up in such disputes, and at minimum, it lacks the dignity we are capable of achieving. How can we lose, by following the examples given by Jesus?

Your friend
Sufjon

Friend, you speak my mind.

 

[SnakeMauler]

It’s because Muslims are typically none white and people are scared of offending none whites but people will defecate on Jesus with no second thoughts in a public school.

 

[hamba2han]

Since there was a mosque/(prayer room) at the 17th floor of the WTC which was used by Muslims working in the twin towers before it became Ground Zero, if Americans wish to restore Ground Zero to what it was before the Sept. 11 attack, then a mosque/(prayer room) needs to be built in the Freedom Tower that is being constructed on Ground Zero.

And since Muslims pray 5 times a day, I would think that the World Trade Center housed more Muslim prayers than the prayers of any other faith.

How’s that for hallowed ground?

 

[Sufjon]

Certain Muslims in the name of Islam killed thousands of people, then a mosque is getting built years after, why do the Muslim community not show sympathy and respect, and build it somewhere else?

It’s like a Nazi flag getting put down on a Jewish grave.

Hi Patrick Joshua: I would hesitate to get too caught up in Islamophobia. Did you know that all terrorists in the United States are Muslim…except for the 94% that aren’t? According to the FBI, the breakout is as follows:

Latino: 42%
Extreme left wing groups: 24%
Others: 16%
Jewish extremists: 7%
Islamic extremists: 6%
Communists: 5%

A list of each individual act can be found on the FBI website: fbi.gov/publications/terror/terrorism2002_2005.htm

If there are millions of Muslims in the US committed to killing us, I am interested in your thoughts on their apparent lack of initiative or terrorist enthusiasm in comparison with other ethnic, religious and ideological groups.

PS: Regarding the comment on the Nazi flag, the Nazi’s happened to take a very important symbol from my faith and turned it into a sign that will be forever associated with evil. Why do most people not know that? Because we don’t dwell on it. Why do we not dwell on it? Because It’s what’s inside you that’s important, not someone else’s insult to you. Who is hurt by the insult? The person issuing the insult, the person who lives a life unreachable by insult? Be the latter and not the former, grasshopper

Your friend
Sufjon

 

[catsrus]

originally posted by Patrick Joshua
Certain Muslims in the name of Islam killed thousands of people, then a mosque is getting built years after, why do the Muslim community not show sympathy and respect, and build it somewhere else?

It’s like a Nazi flag getting put down on a Jewish grave.

Amen!!!
My “tolerance” for these transparent button pushing shenanigans by the muslim community is wearing verrrryyyy thin.

 

[John_Paul_Jones]

Now friend…don’t muddy the water with facts!!!

Do you mean these facts:
wikipedia:

The September 11 attacks (often referred to as September 11th or 9/11) were a series of coordinated suicide attacks by al-Qaeda upon the United States on September 11, 2001. On that morning, 19 al-Qaeda terrorists hijacked four commercial passenger jet airliners.[2][3] The hijackers intentionally crashed two of the airliners into the Twin Towers of the World Trade Center in New York City, killing everyone on board and many others working in the buildings. Both buildings collapsed within two hours, destroying nearby buildings and damaging others. The hijackers crashed a third airliner into the Pentagon in Arlington, Virginia, just outside Washington, D.C. The fourth plane crashed into a field near Shanksville in rural Pennsylvania after some of its passengers and flight crew attempted to retake control of the plane, which the hijackers had redirected toward Washington, D.C. There were no survivors from any of the flights.

Nearly 3,000 victims and the 19 hijackers died in the attacks.[4] According to the New York State Health Department, 836 responders, including firefighters and police personnel, have died as of June 2009.[4] Among the 2,752 victims who died in the attacks on the World Trade Center were 343 firefighters and 60 police officers from New York City and the Port Authority.[5] 184 people were killed in the attacks on the Pentagon.[6] The overwhelming majority of casualties were civilians, including nationals of over 70 countries.[7] In addition, there was at least one secondary death – one person was ruled by a medical examiner to have died from lung disease due to exposure to dust from the World Trade Center’s collapse.[8]

 

[JHow]

Hi Patrick Joshua: I would hesitate to get too caught up in Islamophobia. Did you know that all terrorists in the United States are Muslim…except for the 94% that aren’t? According to the FBI, the breakout is as follows:

Latino: 42%
Extreme left wing groups: 24%
Others: 16%
Jewish extremists: 7%
Islamic extremists: 6%
Communists: 5%

A list of each individual act can be found on the FBI website: fbi.gov/publications/terror/terrorism2002_2005.htm

If there are millions of Muslims in the US committed to killing us, I am interested in your thoughts on their apparent lack of initiative or terrorist enthusiasm in comparison with other ethnic, religious and ideological groups. …

A quick reading of the FBI document supports the case that islamic terrorism is particularly dangerous. Have a look at the casualty list. With the exception of 1995 (McVeigh), the bloodiest years are 1993 and 2001. Your statistic above is skewed by counting events in Puerto Rico (the most terror-prone area), hence the Latino flavor of terrorists. Further, the FBI is drawing a distinction between domestic and international terrorism. These are domestic numbers. When they intercept a guy in Amsterdam trying to take a bomb onto a US-bound plane, where do think that incident gets counted? How about Khobar towers? USS Cole? Embassy in Dar Es Salaam, or Nairobi? You also did not consider the incidence of muslims in the population of US and Puerto Rico, which if lower than 6%, would indicate that they are over-represented among the ranks of terrorists (not sure on the incidence, mind you, but you can’t just drag out a number without looking at what lies behind it).

To your point about millions of muslims, however, all the numbers here are small. The incident list includes kooks like Eric Rudolph - one guy. Sept 11th was perpetrated by 19 guys (who knows how much backup they had?). Terrorism doesn’t need millions of people. I’m not sure a “terrorists-per-square-mile” number is meaningful, anyway.

Islamic terror is organised, enjoys the support of overseas governments, organizations, and, yes, many muslim people (no one here failed to notice the pictures of muslims dancing in the streets in the mideast on 9/11). And, it is tied to a particular religion. None of this is “phobia”.

 

[dianaiad]

Since there was a mosque/(prayer room) at the 17th floor of the WTC which was used by Muslims working in the twin towers before it became Ground Zero, if Americans wish to restore Ground Zero to what it was before the Sept. 11 attack, then a mosque/(prayer room) needs to be built in the Freedom Tower that is being constructed on Ground Zero.

And since Muslims pray 5 times a day, I would think that the World Trade Center housed more Muslim prayers than the prayers of any other faith.

How’s that for hallowed ground?

I agree with you; a prayer room should be built in the Freedom tower. WE should build it.

As for your last claim about there being more “Muslim prayers than the prayers of any other faith…”

Now I understand why you can’t see the problem.

 

[hamba2han]

I agree with you; a prayer room should be built in the Freedom tower. WE should build it.

As for your last claim about there being more “Muslim prayers than the prayers of any other faith…”

Now I understand why you can’t see the problem.

If someone sincerely extends a hand of friendship, then whose fault is it if the other person views that extended hand to be a slap in the face?

This community center project was a non-issue when it was first announced and once this election season is over, then I expect that public opinion against this project will change just as quickly as it did when the politicians and the media got their cue from people like Pamela Geller and Robert Spencer and started to fan the flames to further their own agenda.

Public opposition against the project cannot last long once the politicians and FOX News leave the scene.

 

[dianaiad]

If someone sincerely extends a hand of friendship, then whose fault is it if the other person views that extended hand to be a slap in the face?

This community center project was a non-issue when it was first announced and once this election season is over, then I expect that public opinion against this project will change just as quickly as it did when the politicians and the media got their cue from people like Pamela Geller and Robert Spencer and started to fan the flames to further their own agenda.

Public opposition against the project cannot last long once the politicians and FOX News leave the scene.

Perhaps.

Doesn’t make it any less insulting. (shrug)

You have exposed your own opinion in the matter, and I will most certainly view all future posts from you with that knowledge in mind. Have a nice evening.

 

[Sufjon]

A quick reading of the FBI document supports the case that islamic terrorism is particularly dangerous. Have a look at the casualty list. With the exception of 1995 (McVeigh), the bloodiest years are 1993 and 2001. Your statistic above is skewed by counting events in Puerto Rico (the most terror-prone area), hence the Latino flavor of terrorists. Further, the FBI is drawing a distinction between domestic and international terrorism. These are domestic numbers. When they intercept a guy in Amsterdam trying to take a bomb onto a US-bound plane, where do think that incident gets counted? How about Khobar towers? USS Cole? Embassy in Dar Es Salaam, or Nairobi? You also did not consider the incidence of muslims in the population of US and Puerto Rico, which if lower than 6%, would indicate that they are over-represented among the ranks of terrorists (not sure on the incidence, mind you, but you can’t just drag out a number without looking at what lies behind it).

To your point about millions of muslims, however, all the numbers here are small. The incident list includes kooks like Eric Rudolph - one guy. Sept 11th was perpetrated by 19 guys (who knows how much backup they had?). Terrorism doesn’t need millions of people. I’m not sure a “terrorists-per-square-mile” number is meaningful, anyway.

Islamic terror is organised, enjoys the support of overseas governments, organizations, and, yes, many muslim people (no one here failed to notice the pictures of muslims dancing in the streets in the mideast on 9/11). And, it is tied to a particular religion. None of this is “phobia”.

Trust me, if Muslims on a large scale were out to get us, we’d have a huge problem on our hands. Our country would look like what we did to Iraq by now. Speaking of Iraq, don’t we Americans look kind of dangerous to the civilized world? We were attacked by 19 Saudis and took it out on well over 100,000 Iraqis. You know, you can argue this stuff with me until you turn blue, but I will never understand the sense in any of it. I choose no part in any of it. I extend my hand in friendship to all, and if it’s rejected or if I get hurt or injured for it, I am still the happier for what I did.

Your friend
Sufjon

 

[CHESTERTONRULES]

Trust me, if Muslims on a large scale were out to get us, we’d have a huge problem on our hands. Our country would look like what we did to Iraq by now. Speaking of Iraq, don’t we Americans look kind of dangerous to the civilized world? We were attacked by 19 Saudis and took it out on well over 100,000 Iraqis. You know, you can argue this stuff with me until you turn blue, but I will never understand the sense in any of it. I choose no part in any of it. I extend my hand in friendship to all, and if it’s rejected or if I get hurt or injured for it, I am still the happier for what I did.

Your friend
Sufjon

Americans sacrificed lives and treasure to liberate Iraq from a brutal and tyrannical regime that had systematically tortured and killed the population for decades.

You preferred Saddam?

 

[Bob_Aliano]

I’ll tolerate a Mosque at Ground Zero when there is an open, active Catholic Cathedral in every Islamic Capital and the congregations are left to worship in peace. Until then, not so much.

 

[jfmarm81]

I have read the posts on this thread and didn’t want to get involved, but I must. On 9/11/01, we all witnessed a tragic event. As tragic as it was for all, I watched my godmother murdered on national television. Do you know what that feels like? Can you even imagine the horror of everytime they replay the planes hit, and the towers fall, seeing someon you love die over and over again? Because I know how it feels. Over nine years later, I still know how it feels.
This imam, if he truly wants to make a peaceful gesture, could move the mosque/center just a bit further away. A piece of one of the planes fell through that building. It IS ground zero, for all technical purposes. I am a 9/11 family member. I have nothing against Muslims or Islam or peace or the mosque. But I DON"T want it THERE…it’s that simple.
If America goes and destroys the Dome of the rock, and then, in a symbol of peace, of course, decides to build a Christian or Catholic CHurch there, would you be offended? You shouldn’t, because after all, whose fault is it if you take an hand extended to shake as a slap in the face, right? If Germans, in a symbol of peace, make a Nazi Center next to the site of old concentration camps, why should the Jewish people be offended…after all, if they say it’s a peaceful gesture, then it must be true.
This rests on common sense-is it sensible to offend the many who are agaisnt this by claiming peace or is it sensible to move it a few blocks further away??

 

[dianaiad]

Trust me, if Muslims on a large scale were out to get us, we’d have a huge problem on our hands.

A statement like this makes me wonder just what you would call ‘a huge problem.’ You realize that we entered World War II after an attack that took about half as many lives as the bombing of the World Trade Center did, right?

Heaven help us if we ever did start having what YOU think a ‘huge problem’ is.

 

[RebeccaJ]

I have read the posts on this thread and didn’t want to get involved, but I must. On 9/11/01, we all witnessed a tragic event. As tragic as it was for all, I watched my godmother murdered on national television. Do you know what that feels like? Can you even imagine the horror of everytime they replay the planes hit, and the towers fall, seeing someon you love die over and over again? Because I know how it feels. Over nine years later, I still know how it feels.
This imam, if he truly wants to make a peaceful gesture, could move the mosque/center just a bit further away. A piece of one of the planes fell through that building. It IS ground zero, for all technical purposes. I am a 9/11 family member. I have nothing against Muslims or Islam or peace or the mosque. But I DON"T want it THERE…it’s that simple.
If America goes and destroys the Dome of the rock, and then, in a symbol of peace, of course, decides to build a Christian or Catholic CHurch there, would you be offended? You shouldn’t, because after all, whose fault is it if you take an hand extended to shake as a slap in the face, right? If Germans, in a symbol of peace, make a Nazi Center next to the site of old concentration camps, why should the Jewish people be offended…after all, if they say it’s a peaceful gesture, then it must be true.
This rests on common sense-is it sensible to offend the many who are agaisnt this by claiming peace or is it sensible to move it a few blocks further away??

I am sorry for your loss, and appreciate your post.

 

[JHow]

Trust me, if Muslims on a large scale were out to get us, we’d have a huge problem on our hands. Our country would look like what we did to Iraq by now. Speaking of Iraq, don’t we Americans look kind of dangerous to the civilized world? We were attacked by 19 Saudis and took it out on well over 100,000 Iraqis. You know, you can argue this stuff with me until you turn blue, but I will never understand the sense in any of it. I choose no part in any of it. I extend my hand in friendship to all, and if it’s rejected or if I get hurt or injured for it, I am still the happier for what I did.

Your friend
Sufjon

I won’t turn blue arguing with you. You addressed nothing in my post.

The danger from islamic terrorists is real, and clear to anyone who looks at it fairly (including peaceful muslims). Despite your assertion to the contrary, many non-muslims believe that islamic terrorism enjoys the tacit approval of, or at least a blind eye from the “millions” of muslims throughout the world. Non-muslims would be reassured if they heard more from peaceful muslims denouncing islamic terror, and if conversations with them did not include veiled threats (i.e., “believe me, if muslims were out to get us, we’d have a huge problem…”).