Becoming a Catholic - major barriers

[LNR]

Hello, I’ve been considering becoming a Catholic for a while and am finding it very challenging. I come from a mixed-denomination background - some of my family come from an old Catholic family of saints and priests. Some are Calvinists of various types.

Now the Calvinists are very open to immediate baptism (I’m unbaptized) - a very flexible approach, whereas my local priest wants me to work through months of tuition on the church, which I find bizarre, considering I’ve always been a Christian, albeit an unbaptized Christian. I read the bible, and so on, almost every day, so don’t need an “introduction” or even tuition - I know what there is to know.

Also, I am rather hermit-like in my worship - I prefer reflection alone (and indeed know a hermit within the Catholic Church). Sunday worship in my local church is almost all female (the husbands and families don’t tend to turn up) and feels more like a coffee morning over anything spiritual - something that comes from habit for many - and there’s gossip, and so on, so I refuse to attend - which, again, upsets the priest. I always attended worship when I lived near a Catholic Cathedral because there was none of that small-community awfulness.

So I can’t meet the requirements of my priest and am tempted to become a Calvinist instead. It all seems rather odd, considering the local Catholic community is falling in number - the only people in church are female old age pensioners and there’s little new blood entering the church. Surely the church needs to be more open to receiving the unbaptized? The decision to enter the church is significant enough. Your thoughts and guidance would be welcome.

 

[Eruvande]

I would gently suggest that if you are seriously considering becoming a Calvinist because of the difficulties you have shared, that you don’t actually know as much as you perhaps think you do about the Catholic faith. It’s very different to Calvinism, ime. Go along to the classes your priest is suggesting, and have an open heart. You might find yourself surprised.

 

[LNR]

I would gently suggest that if you are seriously considering becoming a Calvinist because of the difficulties you have shared, that you don’t actually know as much as you perhaps think you do about the Catholic faith. It’s very different to Calvinism, ime. Go along to the classes your priest is suggesting, and have an open heart. You might find yourself surprised.

I think I do though - I’ve been bought up going to church and surrounded by priests and nuns. within my family circle. It is very much my tradition - you should see my library! Very much within the Irish church, too. It’s just my parents wanted me to make up my mind, when ready. I take your point re: Calvinism - very different in some ways, yet with plenty of common ground.

 

[jmr_1985]

The Priest wants to make sure you are properly formed in the faith. He is asking no less of you than any other person entering the Church. This is a tradition that dates back to the early days of the Church. People used to wait years for Baptism and First Communion.

To Catholics, the Eucharist is the source and summit of our faith. This is not the case with Calvinist. Further, Calvinist teaching is different on the role of Baptism. It takes time to understand the sacraments. Thus, the class is important.

Waiting is no fun. Believe me, I waited a year and a half before I could enter the Church but there is a purpose behind it. It is humbling and makes you appreciate the sacraments that much more.

The Catholic faith is the fullness of Christian revelation. Don’t give it up because you aren’t willing to wait for a year or less.

 

[Jon_S_1]

I think I do though - I’ve been bought up going to church and surrounded by priests and nuns. within my family circle. It is very much my tradition - you should see my library! Very much within the Irish church, too. It’s just my parents wanted me to make up my mind, when ready. I take your point re: Calvinism - very different in some ways, yet with plenty of common ground.

Going through RCIA is a beautiful thing. I did it for 2 years! And I was baptized already!

It’s not just about learning, it’s about growing your faith, opening yourself to Gods grace, and joining with the church community.

 

[JRKH]

Hello, I’ve been considering becoming a Catholic for a while and am finding it very challenging. I come from a mixed-denomination background - some of my family come from an old Catholic family of saints and priests. Some are Calvinists of various types.

Now the Calvinists are very open to immediate baptism (I’m unbaptized) - a very flexible approach, whereas my local priest wants me to work through months of tuition on the church, which I find bizarre, considering I’ve always been a Christian, albeit an unbaptized Christian. I read the bible, and so on, almost every day, so don’t need an “introduction” or even tuition - I know what there is to know.

Also, I am rather hermit-like in my worship - I prefer reflection alone (and indeed know a hermit within the Catholic Church). Sunday worship in my local church is almost all female (the husbands and families don’t tend to turn up) and feels more like a coffee morning over anything spiritual - something that comes from habit for many - and there’s gossip, and so on, so I refuse to attend - which, again, upsets the priest. I always attended worship when I lived near a Catholic Cathedral because there was none of that small-community awfulness.

So I can’t meet the requirements of my priest and am tempted to become a Calvinist instead. It all seems rather odd, considering the local Catholic community is falling in number - the only people in church are female old age pensioners and there’s little new blood entering the church. Surely the church needs to be more open to receiving the unbaptized? The decision to enter the church is significant enough. Your thoughts and guidance would be welcome.

I will offer two things for you to ponder…humility/discipline and the effect of you personal presence.
The first, discipline speaks to humility and obedience. You believe you know all that is necessary…yet perhaps you don’t know as much as you think. There is great advantage to being obedient to your pastor - to the one that God has placed in this position of authority. It teaches humility - something that we ALL need from time to time.

The second is the effect your personal presence can have in the Church community.
You complain that mass is full of older women who perhaps do not act as Christian as they ought…So how is this to change, if younger people, male and female, do not introduce new blood into the congregation?
You are seeking a “ready made” and safe, comfortable place that you can just slot into instead of taking up the challenge of actually BEING the change that you want to see.

As for being more private and - shall I say - mystical in your devotional tendencies, I can identify with this as I am also drawn to the more mystical approach. Yet - precisely BECAUSE I am so drawn, I feel it necessary to be at Church - to pray and to praise God and to be a good example to my fellow parishioners - some of whom are more holy than I originally thought.

As to the matter of the protestant - Calvinist - community.
There is nothing good in Calvinism that cannot also be found in Catholicism. However there is good in Catholicism that cannot be found in Calvinism…Namely the Eucharist.
The Calvinist community cannot offer you the REAL presence of Christ in the Eucharist.

I pray that you consider these points carefully

Peace
James
I pray that you consider this carefully…

 

[without]

Also, I am rather hermit-like in my worship - I prefer reflection alone (and indeed know a hermit within the Catholic Church).

You are probably already doing it right… why do you feel the need to be Catholic?

[Matthew 6]
{6:1} “Pay attention, lest you perform your justice before men, in order to be seen by them; otherwise you shall not have a reward with your Father, who is in heaven.
{6:2} Therefore, when you give alms, do not choose to sound a trumpet before you, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the towns, so that they may be honored by men. Amen I say to you, they have received their reward.
{6:3} But when you give alms, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing,
{6:4} so that your almsgiving may be in secret, and your Father, who sees in secret, will repay you.
{6:5} And when you pray, you should not be like the hypocrites, who love standing in the synagogues and at the corners of the streets to pray, so that they may be seen by men. Amen I say to you, they have received their reward.
{6:6} But you, when you pray, enter into your room, and having shut the door, pray to your Father in secret, and your Father, who sees in secret, will repay you.
{6:7} And when praying, do not choose many words, as the pagans do. For they think that by their excess of words they might be heeded.
{6:8} Therefore, do not choose to imitate them. For your Father knows what your needs may be, even before you ask him.
{6:9} Therefore, you shall pray in this way: Our Father, who is in heaven: May your name be kept holy.
{6:10} May your kingdom come. May your will be done, as in heaven, so also on earth.
{6:11} Give us this day our life-sustaining bread.
{6:12} And forgive us our debts, as we also forgive our debtors.
{6:13} And lead us not into temptation. But free us from evil. Amen.
{6:14} For if you will forgive men their sins, your heavenly Father also will forgive you your offenses.
{6:15} But if you will not forgive men, neither will your Father forgive you your sins.
{6:16} And when you fast, do not choose to become gloomy, like the hypocrites. For they alter their faces, so that their fasting may be apparent to men. Amen I say to you, that they have received their reward.
{6:17} But as for you, when you fast, anoint your head and wash your face,
{6:18} so that your fasting will not be apparent to men, but to your Father, who is in secret. And your Father, who sees in secret, will repay you.
{6:19} Do not choose to store up for yourselves treasures on earth: where rust and moth consume, and where thieves break in and steal.
{6:20} Instead, store up for yourselves treasures in heaven: where neither rust nor moth consumes, and where thieves do not break in and steal.
{6:21} For where your treasure is, there also is your heart.
{6:22} The lamp of your body is your eye. If your eye is wholesome, your entire body will be filled with light.
{6:23} But if your eye has been corrupted, your entire body will be darkened. If then the light that is in you is darkness, how great will that darkness be!
{6:24} No one is able to serve two masters. For either he will have hatred for the one, and love the other, or he will persevere with the one, and despise the other. You cannot serve God and wealth.
{6:25} And so I say to you, do not be anxious about your life, as to what you will eat, nor about your body, as to what you will wear. Is not life more than food, and the body more than clothing?
{6:26} Consider the birds of the air, how they neither sow, nor reap, nor gather into barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not of much greater value than they are?
{6:27} And which of you, by thinking, is able to add one cubit to his stature?
{6:28} And as for clothing, why are you anxious? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they neither work nor weave.
{6:29} But I say to you, that not even Solomon, in all his glory, was arrayed like one of these.
{6:30} So if God so clothes the grass of the field, which is here today, and cast into the oven tomorrow, how much more will he care for you, O little in faith?
{6:31} Therefore, do not choose to be anxious, saying: ‘What shall we eat, and what shall we drink, and with what shall we be clothed?’
{6:32} For the Gentiles seek all these things. Yet your Father knows that you need all these things.
{6:33} Therefore, seek first the kingdom of God and his justice, and all these things shall be added to you as well.
{6:34} Therefore, do not be anxious about tomorrow; for the future day will be anxious for itself. Sufficient for the day is its evil.”

 

[pianistclare]

I agree with what Jon has said…I will add, that the Sacraments of Initiation are not some kind of card that you get punched, and bingo, you’re a member!
Everything worth doing take time, study, and effort.
The priest wants you to have a full experience, not just open the door and say “you’re in!”
Part of being a follower of Christ means interacting with the flock. Being the hands and feet of Christ. Some are called to contemplative prayer, others are called to witness and work. The bottom line is, conversion of heart if a personal experience, but it does happen in community, with community, and through the community.
Even the Apostles submitted to the authority of Peter, and certain they were eyewitnesses to the works of the Lord.
Really pray about it.
It matters little what others do. To Christ, it matters what you will do.
The Church has the true presence in the Eucharist. How could anyone decided, that anything else is just good enough?
God bless you, be assured of our prayers.

 

[Kal2012]

Going through RCIA is a beautiful thing. I did it for 2 years! And I was baptized already!

It’s not just about learning, it’s about growing your faith, opening yourself to Gods grace, and joining with the church community.

Yep - I was baptized already and had to do RCIA too.

Also, just because you think you know everything there is to know, trust me, you don’t. I was really surprised at how much I learned.

The part that I enjoyed about RCIA was that I was able to meet others who were interested in joining the church as well.

RCIA is a time of reflection and questioning. It’s always made clear throughout the process that at the end of the RCIA we don’t have to convert. It is a choice and a choice we must take seriously because we are committing ourselves to being Catholic. So, there are specific reasons why the priest may seem like he’s discouraging you. He’s not. He’s making you think about whether this is something you really want to do or not.

It’s not like becoming a member of a non-denominational church where you take a few membership classes and “wow - now you are a member of the church”. The process is a lot more contemplative and thoughtful and slow…

 

[spedteacherita]

The Priest wants to make sure you are properly formed in the faith. He is asking no less of you than any other person entering the Church. This is a tradition that dates back to the early days of the Church. People used to wait years for Baptism and First Communion.

To Catholics, the Eucharist is the source and summit of our faith. This is not the case with Calvinist. Further, Calvinist teaching is different on the role of Baptism. It takes time to understand the sacraments. Thus, the class is important.

Waiting is no fun. Believe me, I waited a year and a half before I could enter the Church but there is a purpose behind it. It is humbling and makes you appreciate the sacraments that much more.

The Catholic faith is the fullness of Christian revelation. Don’t give it up because you aren’t willing to wait for a year or less.

May I ask why, when we baptize babies, it is within a few weeks of birth, why are not adults also are not allowed to be baptized rather than waiting until they understand? If someone professes their faith in our Triune God wouldn’t it be prudent for them to be baptized sooner than later? The rest can be done while going to RCIA or any church’s membership classes (we Lutherans do the same thing). The Holy Spirit could be working wonderful things within that person.

 

[7_Sorrows]

The Priest wants to make sure you are properly formed in the faith. He is asking no less of you than any other person entering the Church. This is a tradition that dates back to the early days of the Church. People used to wait years for Baptism and First Communion.

To Catholics, the Eucharist is the source and summit of our faith. This is not the case with Calvinist. Further, Calvinist teaching is different on the role of Baptism. It takes time to understand the sacraments. Thus, the class is important.

Waiting is no fun. Believe me, I waited a year and a half before I could enter the Church but there is a purpose behind it. It is humbling and makes you appreciate the sacraments that much more.

The Catholic faith is the fullness of Christian revelation. Don’t give it up because you aren’t willing to wait for a year or less.

well said.

 

[benotagoat]

You are probably already doing it right… why do you feel the need to be Catholic?

[Matthew 6]
{6:1} “Pay attention, lest you perform your justice before men, in order to be seen by them; otherwise you shall not have a reward with your Father, who is in heaven.
{6:2} Therefore, when you give alms, do not choose to sound a trumpet before you, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the towns, so that they may be honored by men. Amen I say to you, they have received their reward.
{6:3} But when you give alms, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing,
{6:4} so that your almsgiving may be in secret, and your Father, who sees in secret, will repay you.
{6:5} And when you pray, you should not be like the hypocrites, who love standing in the synagogues and at the corners of the streets to pray, so that they may be seen by men. Amen I say to you, they have received their reward.
{6:6} But you, when you pray, enter into your room, and having shut the door, pray to your Father in secret, and your Father, who sees in secret, will repay you.
{6:7} And when praying, do not choose many words, as the pagans do. For they think that by their excess of words they might be heeded.
{6:8} Therefore, do not choose to imitate them. For your Father knows what your needs may be, even before you ask him.
{6:9} Therefore, you shall pray in this way: Our Father, who is in heaven: May your name be kept holy.
{6:10} May your kingdom come. May your will be done, as in heaven, so also on earth.
{6:11} Give us this day our life-sustaining bread.
{6:12} And forgive us our debts, as we also forgive our debtors.
{6:13} And lead us not into temptation. But free us from evil. Amen.
{6:14} For if you will forgive men their sins, your heavenly Father also will forgive you your offenses.
{6:15} But if you will not forgive men, neither will your Father forgive you your sins.
{6:16} And when you fast, do not choose to become gloomy, like the hypocrites. For they alter their faces, so that their fasting may be apparent to men. Amen I say to you, that they have received their reward.
{6:17} But as for you, when you fast, anoint your head and wash your face,
{6:18} so that your fasting will not be apparent to men, but to your Father, who is in secret. And your Father, who sees in secret, will repay you.
{6:19} Do not choose to store up for yourselves treasures on earth: where rust and moth consume, and where thieves break in and steal.
{6:20} Instead, store up for yourselves treasures in heaven: where neither rust nor moth consumes, and where thieves do not break in and steal.
{6:21} For where your treasure is, there also is your heart.
{6:22} The lamp of your body is your eye. If your eye is wholesome, your entire body will be filled with light.
{6:23} But if your eye has been corrupted, your entire body will be darkened. If then the light that is in you is darkness, how great will that darkness be!
{6:24} No one is able to serve two masters. For either he will have hatred for the one, and love the other, or he will persevere with the one, and despise the other. You cannot serve God and wealth.
{6:25} And so I say to you, do not be anxious about your life, as to what you will eat, nor about your body, as to what you will wear. Is not life more than food, and the body more than clothing?
{6:26} Consider the birds of the air, how they neither sow, nor reap, nor gather into barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not of much greater value than they are?
{6:27} And which of you, by thinking, is able to add one cubit to his stature?
{6:28} And as for clothing, why are you anxious? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they neither work nor weave.
{6:29} But I say to you, that not even Solomon, in all his glory, was arrayed like one of these.
{6:30} So if God so clothes the grass of the field, which is here today, and cast into the oven tomorrow, how much more will he care for you, O little in faith?
{6:31} Therefore, do not choose to be anxious, saying: ‘What shall we eat, and what shall we drink, and with what shall we be clothed?’
{6:32} For the Gentiles seek all these things. Yet your Father knows that you need all these things.
{6:33} Therefore, seek first the kingdom of God and his justice, and all these things shall be added to you as well.
{6:34} Therefore, do not be anxious about tomorrow; for the future day will be anxious for itself. Sufficient for the day is its evil.”

Why do you call yourself atheist , and not agnostic ?

 

[benotagoat]

I think I do though - I’ve been bought up going to church and surrounded by priests and nuns. within my family circle. It is very much my tradition - you should see my library! Very much within the Irish church, too. It’s just my parents wanted me to make up my mind, when ready. I take your point re: Calvinism - very different in some ways, yet with plenty of common ground.

I think in most cases the better question would be ,why do most natal catholics know almost nothing about their faith ,cannot talk about it ,and take no interest in pursuing knowledge . This site exists because people are not getting what they need in their parishes ,and never have .

 

[Mousey]

I think in most cases the better question would be ,why do most natal catholics know almost nothing about their faith ,cannot talk about it ,and take no interest in pursuing knowledge . This site exists because people are not getting what they need in their parishes ,and never have .

Most huh! Where do you get that tidbit of information.? What study do you base that on? No this site exist because of the misinformation put out by people who know nothing about the faith and think they do.

 

[pianistclare]

May I ask why, when we baptize babies, it is within a few weeks of birth, why are not adults also are not allowed to be baptized rather than waiting until they understand? If someone professes their faith in our Triune God wouldn’t it be prudent for them to be baptized sooner than later? The rest can be done while going to RCIA or any church’s membership classes (we Lutherans do the same thing). The Holy Spirit could be working wonderful things within that person.

You have your mom and dad there to bring you to Mass and teach you?

 

[pianistclare]

I think in most cases the better question would be ,why do most natal catholics know almost nothing about their faith ,cannot talk about it ,and take no interest in pursuing knowledge . This site exists because people are not getting what they need in their parishes ,and never have .

That’s not the case in the U.S.
Nobody is ever finished learning about the faith.

 

[spedteacherita]

You have your mom and dad there to bring you to Mass and teach you?

Sorry, Clare, not understanding what your question means. When I joined the LCMS church I had to wait to be baptized - after going thru the church membership class.

I had been confessing that I believed in God the Father, Son and Holy Spirit so I didn’t understand then nor do I now why I had to wait to be baptized. I understanding waiting for taking Holy Communion because I needed to know what was special about it and learn what to do if I had unconfessed sin or issues with a fellow Christian so that I did not take it unworthily.

Why wouldn’t anyone want to baptize a person sooner rather than later.

Thanks and God bless!!

Rita

 

[spedteacherita]

That’s not the case in the U.S.
Nobody is ever finished learning about the faith.

Absolutely true!! Well said!

 

[pianistclare]

Sorry, Clare, not understanding what your question means. When I joined the LCMS church I had to wait to be baptized - after going thru the church membership class.

I had been confessing that I believed in God the Father, Son and Holy Spirit so I didn’t understand then nor do I now why I had to wait to be baptized. I understanding waiting for taking Holy Communion because I needed to know what was special about it and learn what to do if I had unconfessed sin or issues with a fellow Christian so that I did not take it unworthily.

Why wouldn’t anyone want to baptize a person sooner rather than later.

Thanks and God bless!!

Rita

What I mean is, that we baptize as infants because it’s the parent’s responsibility to raise their children in faith. However, if, for whatever reason, a person is not baptized and is now grown, or above the age of reason at least, one would certainly benefit from the study to fully understand what they are undertaking, since no one has previously explained it to them.
That’s what I mean.

 

[Jon_S_1]

May I ask why, when we baptize babies, it is within a few weeks of birth, why are not adults also are not allowed to be baptized rather than waiting until they understand? If someone professes their faith in our Triune God wouldn’t it be prudent for them to be baptized sooner than later? The rest can be done while going to RCIA or any church’s membership classes (we Lutherans do the same thing). The Holy Spirit could be working wonderful things within that person.

Once they express a desire for baptism they are covered by their faith in the power of baptism should they die while waiting. We call it baptism of desire. When adults enter the church, they are baptized and confirmed and receive first Eucharist. So there is a lot to it.

Also becoming Catholic is seen as a life long commitment and so a time of preparation and discernment is important. In the early church people often waited about 3 years.

The process is hard for everyone on the outside to understand. It was for me too. But I wouldn’t have traded my RCIA experience for anything and that’s what the vast majority describe as well.