Bede Griffith and the divine feminine

[jeannetherese]

The Church has never quite understood the role the Holy Spirit plays in creation. It is true that spirit does not have gender - male or female. However, when the Holy Spirit enters matter, it becomes the Mother - mother earth, mother nature, the Goddess. The Church has not recognized that yet (it thinks the Holy Spirit spends its time helping people write books or correct doctrine, but actually its main function is giving birth to and nurturing creation).

All this will be cleared up when the Christ returns and explains it to us.

This doesn’t make sense to me as I think about The Holy Spirit overshadowing Our Lady so that Our Lord is conceived.

 

[openmind77]

This doesn’t make sense to me as I think about The Holy Spirit overshadowing Our Lady so that Our Lord is conceived.

The Holy Spirit may have overshadowed Mary to facilitate the conception also.

But I was talking about its role in the creation of the world. The Holy Spirit is in fact the Mother of the Universe.

 

[Michael_Mayo]

dialogue is the only remedy for interreligious and interracial conflicts? Most people who are practicing true religion are kind and humble caring for widows and orphans.That encompasses most faiths. What this commission seems to not understand is that it is religious extremists who merely use religion as a platform for their agenda who are the problem and who probably would not be interested in dialogue anyway. Go ask Isis.

Are you saying these monastics are not kind and humble and care nothing for widows and orphans. Religious communities have charisms. Contemplative communities general do very little outreach and instead focus on the interior life, which is why it makes sense for contemplatives of different religions to engage in dialogue.

I don’t think this commission is interested in attempting dialogue with extremists who show no interest, but rather, seek out like minded souls in other religions. They do exist. Not all Muslims are extremists. And we all do not have to look at other faiths with religious imperialist eyes.

 

[Elizium23]

Trimurti is the name of the figure/statue that represents the three Gods. Murti mean ‘idol’ or statue.

It doesn’t real work as a name for the concept of three main Gods. But I am sure I can come up with something else that will not confuse you.

So Wikipedia and Webster’s dictionary are wrong and mūrti is not Sanskrit for “shape” or “form”?

 

[openmind77]

So Wikipedia and Webster’s dictionary are wrong and mūrti is not Sanskrit for “shape” or “form”?

I think wikipedia says Murti is Sanskrit for an Image. Could be ‘form’ but I would not say ‘shape’.

In any case it does not quite work to use it as a term for God (though it can represent one as an image/idol).

Actually, I think I will refer to the three main Hindu Gods in the future as the ‘Hindu Triad’. It does not have the same ring as ‘Trinity’ but it sort of works after capitalizing triad.

 

[cjforJesus]

Are you saying these monastics are not kind and humble and care nothing for widows and orphans. Religious communities have charisms. Contemplative communities general do very little outreach and instead focus on the interior life, which is why it makes sense for contemplatives of different religions to engage in dialogue.

I don’t think this commission is interested in attempting dialogue with extremists who show no interest, but rather, seek out like minded souls in other religions. They do exist. Not all Muslims are extremists. And we all do not have to look at other faiths with religious imperialist eyes.

My point went over your head entirely.I said the commission itself states one reason for interreligious dialogue is to remedy something that they are NOT addressing.

Having an ashram in India or nuns chanting mantras and doing yoga is not going to stop what the commission claims its aim is! Inter religious dialogue is not the remedy for hatred or extremism.

Learning about other people and why they worship in a certain manner is not wrong but it will not solve the conflicts the commission is citing. It stated that the dialogue is to be the remedy when the people who are interested in dialogue are already doing charitable works.

The second aim of the commission appeared to be an attempt to unite all faiths under the broad banner of mysticism.

 

[SteveVH]

I am not saying that Hindu and Christian beliefs are exactly the same, but it is wrong to say that a divine incarnation does not fit into Hindu theology.

Agreed. There is common ground on which a discussion might begin. But, as you have acknowledged, the two faiths do not mean the same thing when they speak of Jesus, and therefore cannot mean the same thing when speaking of “divine incarnation”.

And Hindus also believe that these divine incarnations are from the second Person of the Hindu Trinity. If there is another divine incarnation tomorrow, Hindus would not have to change any of their theology (or ‘fashion a figure of their own’) to fit the new incarnation in either.

Well, that sounds very convenient, but not very reassuring. How can you be sure that you are following the truth if the truth is yet to be revealed? And correct me if I am wrong but the Hindu “Trinity” is comprised of three gods (polytheism) as opposed to three Persons in one God (monotheism). So the fact that there are three is purely incidental with no connection to the Christian Trinity whatsoever.

Thanks.

Steve

 

[cjforJesus]

I think wikipedia says Murti is Sanskrit for an Image. Could be ‘form’ but I would not say ‘shape’.

In any case it does not quite work to use it as a term for God (though it can represent one as an image/idol).

Actually, I think I will refer to the three main Hindu Gods in the future as the ‘Hindu Triad’. It does not have the same ring as ‘Trinity’ but it sort of works after capitalizing triad.

So it appears I was correct in stating the Christian concept of Trinity would have to be totally dismantled to accept the Hindu doctrine. In addition I am very aware how integral the concept of reincarnation is to Hindu philosophy. One God out of many deciding to incarnate multiple times would seem pretty close to reincarnation though.It is the same entity going through multiple births whereas Jesus had one birth and one mother whom Catholics love and respect.She is the Blessed Virgin Mary.

 

[Michael_Mayo]

My point went over your head entirely.I said the commission itself states one reason for interreligious dialogue is to remedy something that they are NOT addressing.

Having an ashram in India or nuns chanting mantras and doing yoga is not going to stop what the commission claims its aim is! Inter religious dialogue is not the remedy for hatred or extremism.

Learning about other people and why they worship in a certain manner is not wrong but it will not solve the conflicts the commission is citing. It stated that the dialogue is to be the remedy when the people who are interested in dialogue are already doing charitable works.

The second aim of the commission appeared to be an attempt to unite all faiths under the broad banner of mysticism.

Befor tackling extremism one has to first have insight into the religion. What better way than dialogue?

 

[openmind77]

Agreed. There is common ground on which a discussion might begin. But, as you have acknowledged, the two faiths do not mean the same thing when they speak of Jesus, and therefore cannot mean the same thing when speaking of “divine incarnation”.

Well, that sounds very convenient, but not very reassuring. How can you be sure that you are following the truth if the truth is yet to be revealed?

Thanks.

Steve

I think the only difference is that Hindus don’t believe that these divine incarnations are unique (we have been around for thousands of years). While Christians believe that Jesus was the ‘first and only begotten Son’, Hindus believe these divine incarnation occur periodically when the world needs a Savior and so God (Vishnu) decides to incarnate as a human.

Each incarnation (or Avatar as we call them) reveals more of the truth. Does not mean the previous revelation was false, it was sufficient truth for that time , just as much as humanity could understand/handle at that time.

As time passes more and more of the truth will be revealed as new incarnations of God (Vishnu) take place.

Religious knowledge is a lot like science, we still don’t know the entire truth, but that does not mean what we know is not true.

 

[cjforJesus]

I think the only difference is that Hindus don’t believe that these divine incarnations are unique (we have been around for thousands of years). While Christians believe that Jesus was the ‘first and only begotten Son’, Hindus believe these divine incarnation occur periodically when the world needs a Savior and so God (Vishnu) decides to incarnate as a human.

Each incarnation (or Avatar as we call them) reveals more of the truth. Does not mean the previous revelation was false, it was sufficient truth for that time , just as much as humanity could understand/handle at that time.

As time passes more and more of the truth will be revealed as new incarnations of God (Vishnu) take place.

Religious knowledge is a lot like science, we still don’t know the entire truth, but that does not mean what we know is not true.

In Catholicism that would be considered heresy. It is part of revealed truth that God sent His ONLY begotten Son.In addition Jesus said HE is the truth.

I dont think you realize how offensive you are to Christians when you come to a Catholic forum trying to convince others that one of MANY gods decided to reincarnate multiple times and one of those was Jesus Christ.

 

[cjforJesus]

Befor tackling extremism one has to first have insight into the religion. What better way than dialogue?

Because the beliefs of extremists often diverge from the beliefs of passivists even when professing the same faith. LIke I stated before those who cause the conflicts are not even interested in dialogue.

 

[openmind77]

openmind77;12999944:

I think the only difference is that Hindus don’t believe that these divine incarnations are unique (we have been around for thousands of years). While Christians believe that Jesus was the ‘first and only begotten Son’, Hindus believe these divine incarnation occur periodically when the world needs a Savior and so God (Vishnu) decides to incarnate as a human.

Each incarnation (or Avatar as we call them) reveals more of the truth. Does not mean the previous revelation was false, it was sufficient truth for that time , just as much as humanity could understand/handle at that time.

As time passes more and more of the truth will be revealed as new incarnations of God (Vishnu) take place.

Religious knowledge is a lot like science, we still don’t know the entire truth, but that does not mean what we know is not true.

In Catholicism that would be considered heresy. It is part of revealed truth that God sent His ONLY begotten Son.In addition Jesus said HE is the truth.

I dont think you realize how offensive you are to Christians when you come to a Catholic forum trying to convince others that one of MANY gods decided to reincarnate multiple times and one of those was Jesus Christ.

Well, I am sorry you are offended. But I am not trying to convince you of anything. Just telling you what we believe.

Also it is not one of MANY Gods, it is one of the THREE MAIN Gods who incarnates.

 

[cjforJesus]

Well, I am sorry you are offended. But I am not trying to convince you of anything. Just telling you what we believe.

Also it is not one of MANY Gods, it one of the THREE MAIN Gods who incarnates.

Personally I do not care what you believe as it is your free will. This is a Catholic forum and we expect charity from those who visit. In effect what you are doing is blaspheming God .I already explained to you how offensive it is yet you persist.

 

[Michael_Mayo]

Because the beliefs of extremists often diverge from the beliefs of passivists even when professing the same faith. LIke I stated before those who cause the conflicts are not even interested in dialogue.

Do you see any value in such dialogue whatsoever?

 

[SteveVH]

I think the only difference is that Hindus don’t believe that these divine incarnations are unique (we have been around for thousands of years). While Christians believe that Jesus was the ‘only begotten Son’, Hindus believe these divine incarnation occur periodically when the world needs a Savior and so God (Vishnu) decides to incarnate as a human.

Truth is not dependent upon whether or not one believes it, openmind, and it is not dependent upon how long one has believed what they believe. There are still people who worship the sun, for crying out loud. Christianity has been around for thousands of years as well (two to be exact) and has rejected polytheism and reincarnation since day one.

It seems to me, however, that if you are going to incorporate “Jesus” into your faith that you should listen to what he, himself, claimed to be. Where do you get your information concerning Jesus? I would suggest reading about him from witnesses to his life, death and resurrection.

Each incarnation (or Avatar as we call them) reveals more of the truth. Does not mean the previous revelation was false, it was sufficient truth for that time , just as much as humanity could understand/handle at that time.

As time passes more and more of the truth will be revealed as new incarnations of God (Vishnu) take place.

Religious knowledge is a lot like science, we still don’t know the entire truth, but that does not mean what we know is not true.

And that would be a major difference. We believe that Jesus is God’s final revelation of himself to mankind; the culmination and fulfillment of all prophecy. We believe he is God’s only Word. The entire purpose of Christ’s coming to earth was to bring about, once again, the union of God with man. Jesus, in his very nature(s), is the union of God with man. If one is in union with God what more could he possibly hope to attain from another subsequent to Jesus? What truth could surpass Truth himself? I hope you can see where I coming from here. If Jesus was not who he claimed to be then believe whatever you want. If he is who he claimed to be then you should pay close attention.

Peace.

Steve

 

[openmind77]

Personally I do not care what you believe as it is your free will. This is a Catholic forum and we expect charity from those who visit. In effect what you are doing is blaspheming God .I already explained to you how offensive it is yet you persist.

I don’t understand.

You don’t want me tell you what I believe? You are saying it is uncharitable to say what I believe on this forum?

 

[SteveVH]

Also it is not one of MANY Gods, it is one of the THREE MAIN Gods who incarnates.

And how is that not “many gods”? More than two is many and you have three “main” gods which implies that there are still more gods who are lesser gods.

 

[cjforJesus]

Do you see any value in such dialogue whatsoever?

The inter religious dialogue that someone here is attempting now is only adding to the rift and causing me to realize how different Christians and Hindus really are.I would rather see similarities but when I am told that my Lord and Savior is just some random god that decided to come and help humanity over and over and over again that is totally offensive.It is no different than Theosophy. I do not wish to seek dialogue with a Theosophist either .I know what they think about Jesus too that he was just an ascended master.

 

[openmind77]

…It seems to me, however, that if you are going to incorporate “Jesus” into your faith that you should listen to what he, himself, claimed to be. …

We may be going off topic here, But just to let you know, I do believe in everything that Jesus himself has to say and claims to be.