Before Mass today

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Magnum_V8

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as we (my family) were getting to pray the Divine Mercy Chaplet, like we always do, I thought it’d be nice to ask this older lady to join in, because nobody else joins us.

During this time, the choir was practicing and other parishoners were chit-chatting with each other, the usual pre-Mass abuses.

Well, my mother asked the older lady, who is a long time acquaintance of the family, and the lady said, “No, we can’t do that, the choir is singing.” Then she went on walking around the church gabbing with other people. In the meantime, the choir stopped practicing and conversations grew louder. Then we prayed it anyway.

I’ll admit, it was hard to forget about the older lady saying that. The entire first half of the mass I prayed silently, “Jesus, enter spiritually into my heart and grab hold of my attention.” The mass got much better for me.

How could this lady say “we can’t do that” when the church is a place for prayer, not socializing? And if it were really about disrespecting the choir, wouldn’t walking around and chit-chatting be disrespectful too?
 
Magnum_V8 said:
as we (my family) were getting to pray the Divine Mercy Chaplet, like we always do, I thought it’d be nice to ask this older lady to join in, because nobody else joins us.

During this time, the choir was practicing and other parishoners were chit-chatting with each other, the usual pre-Mass abuses.

Well, my mother asked the older lady, who is a long time acquaintance of the family, and the lady said, “No, we can’t do that, the choir is singing.” Then she went on walking around the church gabbing with other people. In the meantime, the choir stopped practicing and conversations grew louder. Then we prayed it anyway.

I’ll admit, it was hard to forget about the older lady saying that. The entire first half of the mass I prayed silently, “Jesus, enter spiritually into my heart and grab hold of my attention.” The mass got much better for me.

How could this lady say “we can’t do that” when the church is a place for prayer, not socializing? And if it were really about disrespecting the choir, wouldn’t walking around and chit-chatting be disrespectful too?
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Well you said the choir was practicing. So, in fact, saying the Chaplet out loud would not be appropriate and it would be rude to interfere with the Choir, who were preparing for Mass.

The Chaplet of Divine Mercy is a private devotion, not a community devotion and the Mass always has priority over it.

Jim
 
The choir has practices during the week before Mass. The GIRM strongly encourages sacred silence before Mass. Yes, praying the chaplet of Divine Mercy aloud does not sound like sacred silence, but neither is loud conversation and choir practice. Of the two, which is more respectful?

Secondly, I’ve already talked to a priest about this. Not my pastor, but a priest of another church. He strongly suggested I continue doing it, aloud, with hopes that it may inspire more spirituality in preparation for Mass.

Are you saying the Chaplet of Divine Mercy is forbidden from being said as a community, which consists of four members of my family? Yeah, right. “For the sake of his sorrowful passion, have mercy on US and the whole world.” Private or communal, its proper either way.

I think its rude for the choir to be disruptive of my prayer habits in preparation for the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.
 
JimR-OCDS said:
Well you said the choir was practicing. So, in fact, saying the Chaplet out loud would not be appropriate and it would be rude to interfere with the Choir, who were preparing for Mass.

The Chaplet of Divine Mercy is a private devotion, not a community devotion and the Mass always has priority over it.

Jim
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The time before Mass is for quiet reflection and prayer to prepare for Mass. Choir practice should be at another time.
 
Group prayer if silent is ok, but if you are saying the chaplet outloud, it is not ok to disrupt others who may be preparing for Mass in another way. Singing of the choir is ok, they are singing sacred songs to enhance your prayers, not interfere with them or overriding them.
 
Although choirs practice during the week, they need to warm up before mass. It would be great if they had a separate rehearsal room in which to do that, but many parishes cannot afford the extra space and piano or organ.
 
Magnum_V8 said:
as we (my family) were getting to pray the Divine Mercy Chaplet, like we always do, I thought it’d be nice to ask this older lady to join in, because nobody else joins us.

During this time, the choir was practicing and other parishoners were chit-chatting with each other, the usual pre-Mass abuses.

Well, my mother asked the older lady, who is a long time acquaintance of the family, and the lady said, “No, we can’t do that, the choir is singing.” Then she went on walking around the church gabbing with other people. In the meantime, the choir stopped practicing and conversations grew louder. Then we prayed it anyway.

I’ll admit, it was hard to forget about the older lady saying that. The entire first half of the mass I prayed silently, “Jesus, enter spiritually into my heart and grab hold of my attention.” The mass got much better for me.

How could this lady say “we can’t do that” when the church is a place for prayer, not socializing? And if it were really about disrespecting the choir, wouldn’t walking around and chit-chatting be disrespectful too?
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My opinion -

If the choir is trying to “warm-up” to sing its best during Mass, then there isn’t any problem with it singing before Mass. People shouldn’t be “chatting”, however. They should either pray, sit silently, examine their conscience (if there is confession), or go outside if they want to chat (hopefully about religious topics…).

Catholig
 
My fault…my choice of words in some aspects has been misleading. Allow me to correct myself.

Praying the chaplet aloud: not screaming at the top of my lungs, just vocal enough so that my family can hear what I’m saying, follow along and provide the appropriate responses.

Choir practicing: singing a little bit of one song ten minutes prior to Mass, then the cantor calls out instructions, followed by chatter about cruise trips and vacations, for example. Could the choir not get warmed up before the bulk of the people show up? And it doesn’t help that the choir is situated on the altar.

Hope this cleared it up.

Rebecca, their warming up is in no way an attempt to be beneficial to our preparation for the Mass.

I absolutely support silence before Mass, even if it means we would have to stop saying the chaplet “aloud.” (see prior definition) But why should I be silent in prayer when a chaotic environment surrounds me?
 
Br.Rich_SFO said:
The time before Mass is for quiet reflection and prayer to prepare for Mass. Choir practice should be at another time.
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Depends on how early we’re talking. 15 minutes, then perhaps.

However, like most people who volunteer at parishes these days, time is limited and often music ministries can’t get together during the week. Also, they’re often just running through songs they already know, but need to refresh themselves and prior to Mass is the only time they can do it.

Jim
 
Magnum_V8 said:
My fault…my choice of words in some aspects has been misleading. Allow me to correct myself.

Praying the chaplet aloud: not screaming at the top of my lungs, just vocal enough so that my family can hear what I’m saying, follow along and provide the appropriate responses.

Choir practicing: singing a little bit of one song ten minutes prior to Mass, then the cantor calls out instructions, followed by chatter about cruise trips and vacations, for example. Could the choir not get warmed up before the bulk of the people show up? And it doesn’t help that the choir is situated on the altar.

Hope this cleared it up.

Rebecca, their warming up is in no way an attempt to be beneficial to our preparation for the Mass.

I absolutely support silence before Mass, even if it means we would have to stop saying the chaplet “aloud.” (see prior definition) But why should I be silent in prayer when a chaotic environment surrounds me?
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The choir getting together for warm up and fellowship is part of being in the ministry. Who are you to say they can do it another time and place?

Sorry, but I’m with the choir on this point. You can certainly pray the Chaplet at home, or even after Mass.

The parish is a community. Being such, various activities which make up a parish, require work and cooperation from everyone.

Jim
 
Magnum_V8 said:
I think its rude for the choir to be disruptive of my prayer habits in preparation for the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.
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quite right, they should rearrange their schedules to suit your private use of the Church. have you asked the choir if there is not another time they could practice? have you asked your pastor to ask the congregation for quiet time before and after Mass? having a chip on your shoulder about this issue will not lead to a spirit of devotion and penitence, which the Chaplet should be fostering, nor will it help you assist at Mass in the proper spirit.
 
I now understand why I’m seeing parishes with no music ministry.

People who do the music for the most part in my area at least, are volunteers.

People in the music ministry must get fed up with the barrage of complaints. The music is too new, too old not up to date, too slow, too fast, we shouldn’t allow guitars, flutes violins or base fiddles.

Luckily when I played, the majority of the people thanked us for playing. When we broke up, because of people moving away, the people expressed their sorrow and prayed for another group to take our place.

I can’t imagine ever being in a music ministry at some of the parishes I hear about in this forum. It must be a form of penance for these people to work in.

Jim
 
How wonderful it is that you and your family prepare for Mass in such a beautiful way, and how sad it is for that lady that she didn’t join in and gain many graces as a result during Mass by preparing for it with the Divine Mercy Chaplet. The choir should be practising on another day, not immediately before Mass distracting people who are trying to pray. They should be showing some respect towards the Blessed Sacrament. :gopray2:
 
Rebecca_New said:
Group prayer if silent is ok, but if you are saying the chaplet outloud, it is not ok to disrupt others who may be preparing for Mass in another way. Singing of the choir is ok, they are singing sacred songs to enhance your prayers, not interfere with them or overriding them.
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I agree with this.
If your family wants to do a group prayer, you can each whisper under your nose. Since you sit or kneel close together, by whispering, you still can hear each other and keep the same pace, but it won’t disturb others.

Saying that since others are chatting anyway, so you can pray out loud (understand your definition of loud), is like to say since all others have inappropriate behavior, so can you.

I try always to see things from a different perspective. If I have complaints in my heart of another person, I try to re-exam if it is actually a problem in my own heart. This is a good practice to work on virtues - be more understanding, be more objective, be more loving, demand more of self than of others.

We are all learning all the time. Take every opportunity to learn about self is a good way to form a better self.
 
wow! sounds like some folks are getting a little hot under the collor over this!

This is an interesting subject because I find myself with a similar problem. I sing in the choir occationally, but due to a recent helth issue, I have taken temporary leave from the choir. I’ve seen it from both sides. We sing at the 8 am mass and a warm up is very important because you have to get the morning crud out of your air way so you can really sing a good interance hymn.

Now that I’m in the congragation, though I can find the music distractiong because like the OP, I like to get in a chaplet of devine mercy before mass starts. What I have started to realize is while the music can be a distraction, at least it is church music and if you let it, it can be a nice back ground to your prayer. The problem is what’s going on when they are not singing. People chatting away and up in the choir section, there are micraphones that are sometimes on and I can hear every word some people are saying. People talking about football and all sorts of other things. I have decided that there is very little I can do. I would like to make it my goal, when I return to the choir next year, to incourage other people to be silent and reverent when we are not warming up. Also, in my morning prayer, I have started to ask God to increase the reverence in His church. Dedacate your chaplet to this task if it means so much to you. Also, keep trying to get others to join you. if you get a large enough crowd praying before mass, people will maybe step outside to chat out of respect for your prayer time. One can only hope.

I’ll pray for your church if you’ll pray for mine.
 
I agree that there really shouldn’t be chatting going on prior to mass. The choir on the other hand is a different story. Many choirs are volunteer. They might give 2-3 hours of their time one night a week to practice. Sunday mornings, a choir director will make sure that their voices are properly warmed up and then will quickly run through some music that they might have still had some trouble with or just to refresh their memories, since many volunteers in choir don’t know how to read music. Some churches have a practice room where they can run through the music and warm up prior to the mass. Other churches don’t have that luxury, so they can only do it in the choir loft or choir section of the church.

That all said, when our practice room under the chapel became unbearable to stay in (a lot of sewer gases), the choir had to do their practice and warming up in the choir loft of the cathedral. They couldn’t do it prior to 10:30 since a mass was still going on in the chapel, so they had to wait till the end of the mass (understandably so) and gave themselves about 15-20 minutes to quickly run through things and warmed up. The they would stop about 10-15 before mass would begin so that people would have silence to pray. They now have a new room to practice in, so that is not a problem any longer.
 
Regarding the chatting. I once attended a church where the pastor encouraged LOTS of talking prior to mass. For me it was distracting because I couldn’t concentrate on my prayer since people tend to talk loud and then the echo in the church enhances the sound. But for me, too much chatting noise sometimes panics me especially when I need quiet time. (I come from a very large and very loud family, and I’m one of the quiet ones.)

The pastor of this church and some of the members would look down on those who were too “old-fashioned” in their way of prayer. (I wasn’t one of the vocal ones who preferred quiet prayer time.) I remember one congregant saying she was so happy that this new pastor was making the church and mass feel more like a Baptist service. “That’s what this church needed!” Wow! I knew I couldn’t stay there any longer.
 
My only problem with the choir was the lady’s statement, that we can’t pray the Divine Mercy Chaplet because the choir was practicing. Church music as a backdrop for prayer is beautiful. But why do they have to practice so close to the beginning of Mass, when most of the people are ushering in? And on top of that, the quick practice degenerates into loud, idle chit-chat.
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JimR-OCDS:
You can certainly pray the Chaplet at home, or even after Mass.
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The last time I checked, church was a completely acceptable place to pray and worship.
 
IMHO, choir music is perfectly fine and acceptable and in fact can be very helpfully spiritually uplifting, though personally I prefer silence.

Praying the Rosary and/or Chaplet before Mass is personally wonderful to me, … at the same time I can understand and empathize with people who may prefer even more silence than I do to prepare for Mass. Of course, it should be understood that the choir and the community prayers should not be competing with each other … the pastor should decide which of these two activities should happen when, or the pastor could opt of course for silence.

Mindless chattering about mundane topics is not okay when others are silently preparing for Mass, especially in the presence of the tabernacle containing the Blessed Sacrament. Those who feel the need to talk can be considerate and take their conversation where it will not bother others.

~~ the phoenix
 
Magnum_V8 said:
My only problem with the choir was the lady’s statement, that we can’t pray the Divine Mercy Chaplet because the choir was practicing. Church music as a backdrop for prayer is beautiful. But why do they have to practice so close to the beginning of Mass, when most of the people are ushering in? And on top of that, the quick practice degenerates into loud, idle chit-chat.

The last time I checked, church was a completely acceptable place to pray and worship.
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It is. However, before Mass there is going to be normal human activity with respects to the music ministry.

I guess I’m spoiled because our church is open 24/7. People can go in and pray anytime they want. Besides, we also have an adoration chapel nearby, which is separate from the Church.

Jim
 
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