Beggars IN Church

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El_PAso

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Hi,
I’m not sure where to post this so will start here.

I recently started going to an inner city parish. There are a couple beggars who hang out in front of the church and now are going inside before Mass and asking for money while one prays.

Now I have a great deal of compassion for these two as they have other obvious issues and are not just pan handlers. A couple days ago one came up to me as I was praying the Rosary and said “I’m hungry”, how could I refuse but feel like I encouraged the behavior of intruding on a place of prayer.

One habitually hung out in the back most pew and would grab at you but now more bold.

Now both of them are going up to various people just before Mass in the Church and asking for money….

It’s difficult because “as you treat the least of your brothers…” But in the Church?

I don’t want to be hard hearted and will easily give some money to each out side but am baffled as to how to approach this. Just say “no” or kind of scold them to take it outside? Is this even my place?

Thanks,
EP
 
I would definitely not give to panhandlers inside of a church. A good rule of thumb is, never give anything to anyone who is the least bit rude or predatorial. You shouldn’t have the slightest guilt about turning away such people, and doing so loudly if necessary. Anyone who would stoop to that level is almost certainly a crackhead or a heroin addict who’s classless and brazen enough to troll the pews looking for an easy mark. Christ himself would probably violently chastise such a person.
 
In the church itself? Prodding people? Now that’s aggressive.

We have to love all men, but loving people doesn’t mean giving them whatever they want or letting them walk all over us–or all over our holy religion. Beggars have to respect boundaries, too. They may not know better, but that doesn’t mean we should leave them in their ignorance. In fact, instructing the ignorant is a work of mercy.

As is giving alms, but like all good deeds, it should be guided by prudence. Indiscriminately to give money to people who ask could be, in the end, the least charitable thing to do. What if they are an addict desperate for their next fix? Our Lord does say give to him who asks, but he also says to be wise as serpents.
 
El_PAso said:
Hi,
I’m not sure where to post this so will start here.

I recently started going to an inner city parish. There are a couple beggars who hang out in front of the church and now are going inside before Mass and asking for money while one prays.

Now I have a great deal of compassion for these two as they have other obvious issues and are not just pan handlers. A couple days ago one came up to me as I was praying the Rosary and said “I’m hungry”, how could I refuse but feel like I encouraged the behavior of intruding on a place of prayer.

One habitually hung out in the back most pew and would grab at you but now more bold.

Now both of them are going up to various people just before Mass in the Church and asking for money….

It’s difficult because “as you treat the least of your brothers…” But in the Church?

I don’t want to be hard hearted and will easily give some money to each out side but am baffled as to how to approach this. Just say “no” or kind of scold them to take it outside? Is this even my place?

Thanks,
EP
Click to expand...
I’ve given to beggars in church in Mexico, but I have noticed it became for a time a HUGE problem to a point one church blew up a letter in the newspaper which said NOT to give to panhandlers, to call the appropriate authorities, instead. Here, it suggested calling DIF.

We had a lot of drunks and drug users that hung out around the churches. It got to the point we had several incidents with mentally ill homeless people coming in. One vomited once in church, slept it off there. He’d go up even to the altar.

Once, he spat and spat and spat both in front of the church and inside, in front of the Blessed Sacrament, went to punch somebody. He took the church books, tried to sell them for a peso!

I have noticed the police have had to be called in.

I would NOT encourage this practice.

Do NOT give to people in church. Church is for church, not for begging.
 
Thanks,

@Josiah. I do give outside the church.

@ “the rest” These two are not crack addicts and have obvious mental issues and I have no qualms offering what I have to each OUTSIDE the church.

But yea these two have taken to going up and down the aisle requesting money and being on the verge of aggressive. Not moving on when refused etc….

Thanks,

EP
 
Oh yeah, one homeless man once took my stuff. I had my missal and recycling that I left. He tried tearing up my missal. My recyling was nothing of value! 😉

A nun got them back for me, told me not to leave my stuff unattended. However, I was trying to do the Stations of the Cross and found it hard to lug my stuff around.

Again, I repeat, do not get this started. There needs to be a line, and beggars need to beg outside of church, not inside.
 
We had people who would come in, and they took it to the next level, began saying as we were in adoration, “I am collecting for such and such a cause…please give”.

It interrupts the prayer time. We can’t get serious prayer done with all these guys coming and going, not interested in praying, just money, and many have addiction problems. If you give to those, your money very well might go for alcohol and drugs, anyway.
 
We have had some of our churches here seem more like a circus. I notice they have had the police there, and since that time, finally we can go to mass without having incidents every single time.
 
Josiah, there are some very bad people out there. I don’t think anyone is procrastinating, it just is what it is. Someone truly in need will accept help that is not only in the form of money.

Our parish had several incidents with the same women and her 2 small children standing outside of the church, before and after mass, holding a sign that read “Lost my job, need money to feed my children.” Our priest told her she couldn’t stand outside and solicit but the parish would be more than willing to help her with donations of food etc, which she declined. Upon her return the following week, she became very aggressive with the parishioners that refused to give her money, the police were called, found out it was a scam, and she never returned. Our pastor told us not to give anyone money begging outside of the church. If a person is really in need all they need to do is knock on the door and ask for help.
 
Catie59 said:
Josiah, there are some very bad people out there. I don’t think anyone is procrastinating, it just is what it is. Someone truly in need will accept help that is not only in the form of money.

Our parish had several incidents with the same women and her 2 small children standing outside of the church, before and after mass, holding a sign that read “Lost my job, need money to feed my children.” Our priest told her she couldn’t stand outside and solicit but the parish would be more than willing to help her with donations of food etc, which she declined. Upon her return the following week, she became very aggressive with the parishioners that refused to give her money, the police were called, found out it was a scam, and she never returned. Our pastor told us not to give anyone money begging outside of the church. If a person is really in need all they need to do is knock on the door and ask for help.
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Appalled by comments here. Our parish always has poor coming to the door. We keep grocery bags with food that parishioners fill to hand out. There are several parishioners that help the needy and get them connected to services, etc.

All are welcomed here.
 
Casilda said:
Appalled by comments here. Our parish always has poor coming to the door. We keep grocery bags with food that parishioners fill to hand out. There are several parishioners that help the needy and get them connected to services, etc.

All are welcomed here.
Click to expand...
Of course all are welcomed but not to do as they please!

Parishes have or should have distinct missions, catechesis, charity, Eucharist and personal worship come to mind. The Church itself should be a house of prayer, not a lecture hall or center. it is a sacred place to escape somewhat from the world and pray.

I don’t pass out business cards or enlist other forms of help within the Church and actually refrain from doing so on the premises but will speak to a friend AFTER Mass OUTSIDE the chapel if I have “business” to discuss.

This paris is small and really squeezed in city blocks so no parish hall or actual place to let yourself in.

I think this and other local parishes have had trouble as the few I visited offices of when I arrived have security between the receptionist and the public.

Anyway, I think there should be a clear separation and I will pray to handle it as gently and kindly as possible if approached while praying again. Literally yesterday I was knelling with eyes closed praying the Rosary and one tapped me on the shoulder for money! It’s frustrating….But actually helps center my prayer and count my blessings.

Poor souls…pray fro them!

EP
 
El_PAso said:
Hi,
I’m not sure where to post this so will start here.

I recently started going to an inner city parish. There are a couple beggars who hang out in front of the church and now are going inside before Mass and asking for money while one prays.

Now I have a great deal of compassion for these two as they have other obvious issues and are not just pan handlers. A couple days ago one came up to me as I was praying the Rosary and said “I’m hungry”, how could I refuse but feel like I encouraged the behavior of intruding on a place of prayer.

One habitually hung out in the back most pew and would grab at you but now more bold.

Now both of them are going up to various people just before Mass in the Church and asking for money….

It’s difficult because “as you treat the least of your brothers…” But in the Church?

I don’t want to be hard hearted and will easily give some money to each out side but am baffled as to how to approach this. Just say “no” or kind of scold them to take it outside? Is this even my place?

Thanks,
EP
Click to expand...
First, being a can of chunky soup with you. Or gloves, or socks, or cereal, and . A list to local resources.

Second, tell the priest, deacon, or usher. The authority figures can direct the person to a facility that can help.
 
Casilda said:
Appalled by comments here. Our parish always has poor coming to the door. We keep grocery bags with food that parishioners fill to hand out. There are several parishioners that help the needy and get them connected to services, etc.

All are welcomed here.
Click to expand...
I don’t think anyone here was suggesting that we shouldn’t help the poor and downtrodden to the best of our abilities; this thread was about highly aggressive and predatory people who hang out inside churches and prey on people praying. There’s no one, no matter how drunk, high or mentally ill, who doesn’t know that that’s extremely rude and out of line. This is coming from someone who gives money to homeless people on a daily basis.
 
El_PAso said:
Hi,
I’m not sure where to post this so will start here.

I recently started going to an inner city parish. There are a couple beggars who hang out in front of the church and now are going inside before Mass and asking for money while one prays.

Now I have a great deal of compassion for these two as they have other obvious issues and are not just pan handlers. A couple days ago one came up to me as I was praying the Rosary and said “I’m hungry”, how could I refuse but feel like I encouraged the behavior of intruding on a place of prayer.

One habitually hung out in the back most pew and would grab at you but now more bold.

Now both of them are going up to various people just before Mass in the Church and asking for money….

It’s difficult because “as you treat the least of your brothers…” But in the Church?

I don’t want to be hard hearted and will easily give some money to each out side but am baffled as to how to approach this. Just say “no” or kind of scold them to take it outside? Is this even my place?

Thanks,
EP
Click to expand...
Generally, what I said at my old parish was something like, “Would you like to sit with me at Mass? Then I can introduce you to Father ___ afterwards and he can help you.” The priests were far more capable than I was of knowing what resources and connections to offer, and were better at handling the situation so that the people got the help that they needed.
 
Casilda said:
Appalled by comments here. Our parish always has poor coming to the door. We keep grocery bags with food that parishioners fill to hand out. There are several parishioners that help the needy and get them connected to services, etc.

All are welcomed here.
Click to expand...
Not sure what you are appalled at. The fact that the person in front of the church was a known thief and became aggressive with the parishioners? All are very welcome at our parish and we give to all. Is it o.k to have someone physically harm parishioners?
 
Casilda said:
Appalled by comments here. Our parish always has poor coming to the door. We keep grocery bags with food that parishioners fill to hand out. There are several parishioners that help the needy and get them connected to services, etc.

All are welcomed here.
Click to expand...
That is much different than giving money to panhandlers. That is what Catholics should be doing. Not giving them money, which is only at best a bandaid solution.
 
Unfortunately I think its become normal for junkies to know priests will give money to them no questions asked, at our parish, we even have homeless people coming up to the priest right after he is walking down the aisle from completing a mass!!! they know what time to be there to get the money, and the priest tells them to follow him over to the rectory and he doles out the money.

I dont know how much he is giving them though, im assuming around $50-100.each.

This has become a normal occurrence at many local parishes, so i do think some of the local drug users have taken advantage of this, but I dont think we can judge all of them based on a few. I know this has upset some members of our church, but the senior priest continues to do this and says he will not stop, so they better get used to it!

Whether they go buy drugs or go get something to eat is just something we cannot know or predict, have to leave that part to God, but it should not make anyone stop giving though, its not up to us how they use the money, only that they currently need money, if they use it for a fix, so be it, maybe that will be the time they recognize they need help? Or would people prefer some of these people rob local pharmacies or stores to get the money? Either way, they are going to find a way to get the money they need, better that no violence is involved imo.
 
The next time a beggar approaches you inside a church you can gently tell them that you can help them, but when you are both outside the church building, out of respect for our Lord’s house, which is a house of prayer. You’d be best to take this question of yours to a holy and learned traditional priest, as I am not sure that I have given you the advise that is most pleasing to our Lord. I honestly don’t think it is right to encourage begging INSIDE of a church, only outside of a Church. God bless you.
 
We should welcome beggars in Church but not begging.

I think we are fortunate in our parish to have quite a few people who work with charity organizations that help the homeless and those suffering from addiction. So there is usually someone around to take care of a situation like this.

What they do is to try to get them to open up about their problems and then help them get in touch with an agency that can offer them practical help. This seems to weed out the fakes and it doesn’t really cost anything aside from a bit of time.

Maybe there would be some support in your parish to setting up a group like this?
 
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