Being Catholic in College

[TheTrinitySaves]

Is it a sin to not properly defend your faith? People have questioned and debated me over my beliefs in college and I feel like a lose all my arguments when defending the faith. How do I defend the faith better. My friend compares us to Westboro, and my other friends says he won the arguement when we debated why I thought it was vastly different. My friend said Catholics were responsible for millions of death. I said they were not and once again my other friends said I lost the arguement when my friend brought up the crusades. My friend said Catholics support Child molestation, I said they did not and again I lost the arguement according to my onlooking friends who are all non religious. How do I defend the faith and convince my friends in the power of the Lord and his glory? How do I bring them closer to god. And am I commiting sins by not properly defending the faith?

(I know I had another thread but I did not want to start a new topic so I began this one)

 

[Trident_H]

No, you’re not being a bad Catholic by dropping the ball now and then. Defending the faith isn’t your job. Living the faith is. Far more people are won over by a steady, quietly good, honest, dependable, upright, friendly, helpful, caring Catholic than one who can argue them into a corner any day.

The points in blue that anyone without real interest in the faith can score against you just by lazy associations are rarely worth your effort to try to defend anyway.

But if you feel like it? Here’s a few thoughts to tie down those arguments.

“Just like Westboro”

A: “If we were all like Westboro, then what they’re doing wouldn’t be so shockingly newsworthy. But I guess you knew that, right?” Smile and wink.

“The Crusades”

A: “Do you know what started the Crusades? Do you know what stirred that up? Let’s see…do you think they were started because we were living with a really nice, gentle, peaceful, and passive group at our doorstep? Or do you think it might have been an aggressive pushy one? Eh, who cares. Islam won’t let you bash religion for long anyway.”

“priests molesting children?”

A: “Yeah, that’s really a terrible thing when that happens. It sort of gets in the way of the other set of priests in the high 90s percent-wise who spend their whole lives encouraging all of us to be good. Good thing we don’t shut down the hospital when 1 doctor abuses a patient, hey?” Shrug and move on.

Well you get the idea.

Good luck!

Peace.

-Trident

 

[joeybaggz]

QUOTE=TheTrinitySaves;14413340

And am I commiting sins by not properly defending the faith?

No you’re not. And you will probably find it to be true that college age young adults in large numbers are living in that time of their lives when religion and faith are not only NOT of primary importance, but actually opposed to the contemporary lifestyle chosen by many. It is in their interest to ridicule and reject the truth, especially when it doesn’t validate their actions.

And, throughout your life, after your college years, you’ll continue to find many who attack the faith and refuse to listen to honest and reasonable positions put forth by people of faith. That never stops.

A previous poster made a great suggestion. Live the faith, Find a life in truth that will make you a person to be respected, admired, and sought after because of the goodness you show forth simply by living that faith. People who are really important, will gravitate to a person who joyfully lives out the Catholic faith.

Shalom

 

[youngsterat16]

like others had said, it’s ok if you are not able to depend these arguments. It’s hard being a Catholic because you know and they just can’t understand. You understand how things are false but don’t know the reason why.

you may not be able to defend yourself right away because they are jsut throwing things at you without your preparation. Lawyers know ahead of time the case they are making and can anticipate the accusations that will be thrown at them. They are being unfair because you can’t prepare yourself. If a professor told you to give a presentation about why the earth is round right on the spot, no prior preparation, you probably wouldn’t be able to do it. It’s an unfair demand,

What you can do is take the opportunity in your spare time to do research on their certain questions. You can make the argument that they aren’t being fair in throwing questions and expecting you to be able to answer them all. Turn it around if they persist by asking them to back their claims.

The crusades may have been Catholic PEOPLE believing that their purpose for killing was just under God. Those are humans bounds my mistakes who were Catholic, but that is not what the Catholic church is. It was not the Church’s fault but merely men.

You can argue that Catholics aren’t the only one who killed for their faith. What about the Romans who killed millions of Catholics? the early ages of Catholicism followers of Jesus were persecuted. Hitler and killing millions of Jews. Alexander the Great, Genghis Kahn, King Henry the eighth, Not just religions but other groups of people cause killing too. You can even through current events of today with ISIS.

i’m not going to go into arguing those other throws at you right now because it is late as i type this and I have school tomorrow. my advice though, so you can better defend your faith, try researching on common arguements against the catholic faith and how to defend those. The more you read the better you can defend yourself.

you always have us here in the forums to help you answer questions they ask you. They just don’t understand, The Catholic church is pretty strange

 

[Dorothy]

It sounds like those you whom you are trying to defend the Catholic faith to do not really want to hear your side. We don’t have to be well-schooled in apologetics if we are not so inclined. And, when people do not want to hear your side it is best to let it go. I don’t see that as sin at all. You can pray for them.

Sin is across the board, in all faiths. The fact that there is sin in the Catholic Church does not take away from the fullness of truth that our Lord Jesus Christ taught us. We have everything we need…prayer and sacraments…to follow the Lord as we ought.

May the Lord have mercy on us all.

Peace,

Dorothy

 

[Beryllos]

Don’t give up, but also don’t go looking for occasions to debate or argue. It sounds like a tough crowd, and a very judgmental crowd too, keeping score and telling you that you “lost.”

What year are you (and your friends) in college?

 

[MT1926]

God does not expect us to do the impossible. Just the fact that you are here and bringing up this question tells me you are living the faith. I sure wish this forum was here 25 years ago when I was in college.

As for your so called friends. I would simple say to them…“If you are honestly seeking God’s truth on these matters I am willing to take my free time to research and find you the true historical and Biblical facts to your questions. If your only intentions are to use me as a sounding board to throw your unkind remarks at, then we all have more important ways of spending our free time. God Bless.”

If their answer is yes bring your questions here to form a well thought out answer before getting back to them… If their answer is no, move on it’s not worth your time, they wouldn’t believe the truth if it hit them in the face.

There is no sin and no shame in saying I don’t know but I know where I can find you an answer and get back to you.

God Bless

 

[goout]

You do the best you can without losing the peace of Christ. Sometimes you have to know when to walk away from a no-win situation.

That being said, rhetorical skills are an asset to debate.
Learn how to use analogies that your listener can relate to.
Logic is an asset. Most colleges offer courses in logic. (the arguments you just detailed are illogical).
Know the Church’s teaching and the philosophy behind it. Secularists will dismiss scripture, so you must know philosophy and natural law etc…

These are the grounds your opponents think they are standing on, but they are standing on un-reasoned quicksand, and you can use the very disciplines in which they claim expertise to vaporize their arguments.

 

[CB_Catholic]

I would also add to what has been said that if you choose to engage in this, you must also insist that if they bring up accusations or whatever, they are the ones bound to do honest research and prove their point. But you must also do your homework and know when they are using biased or prejudiced sources. If they refuse, refuse to engage. If they accuse, it is incumbent upon them, not you, to provide adequate proof, not just somebody’s bias against the Church.

 

[edwest2]

There are a number of organizations that may be helpful to you and others reading this.

ccmanetwork.org/new-page-4

Remember, those questioning your faith sometimes know as much or more about your faith than you do.

amazon.com/Stay-Catholic-College-Christopher-Kaczor/dp/B006UEYGT6

Do not worry about this because you will meet different people, and some will only have questions and not actually be against the faith. Ask God for guidance. And if you don’t know something, tell them you’ll get back to them on it. Then look it up.

Ed

 

[Catholic1954]

Is it a sin to not properly defend your faith? People have questioned and debated me over my beliefs in college and I feel like a lose all my arguments when defending the faith. How do I defend the faith better. My friend compares us to Westboro, and my other friends says he won the arguement when we debated why I thought it was vastly different. My friend said Catholics were responsible for millions of death. I said they were not and once again my other friends said I lost the arguement when my friend brought up the crusades. My friend said Catholics support Child molestation, I said they did not and again I lost the arguement according to my onlooking friends who are all non religious. How do I defend the faith and convince my friends in the power of the Lord and his glory? How do I bring them closer to god. And am I commiting sins by not properly defending the faith?

(I know I had another thread but I did not want to start a new topic so I began this one)

Knowing your faith is the best way to defend it. Read and be very familiar with the Catechism. You are only “loosing” arguments with these friends because they so. You will find that there are many people in this life who consider themselves right and everyone else is wrong, not matter what. It is pointless to try and debate people like that, you will never change their minds and in this case, get them to listen to your side. It is better to pick your battles and engage when it will do the most good. You can try demanding that they show you creditable proof of the their statements, but you probably won’t get it. Just because you aren’t getting anywhere with these friends, doesn’t mean you aren’t doing a good job defending the faith. Good job!

 

[JanetF]

You might enjoy this article and find it helpful when debating others…

fratres.wordpress.com/2008/06/24/redemption-comes-through-the-jews-jewish-businessman-sam-miller-whaps-anti-catholic-bias-in-news-media-full-text/

 

[CatholicSpirit]

TheTrinitySaves: It seems you and I live in the same world, where “facts” are expected to be provided in order for us to go about our day. I have many other things to say, but, there is an organization that argues often that some of the sex scandals were homosexuality and not pedophilia. It’s a good idea to start there and to explain the stigma associated with our church is from a handful of priests that sinned and sadly, different sins by other priests made it look like a higher number than it actually is. I honestly believe priests should not be jailed on US soil, the Vatican is sovereign and priests should go there when facing scandals. The US is not honoring it’s alleged “separation of church and state” to avoid church affairs, but permits it to authorize satanism. It is a broken system, and I’m sure God knows it. Feel free to message me if you need to talk to someone else who has suffered religious persecution in the US as a Catholic. God bless!

 

[Ernie07]

Is it a sin to not properly defend your faith? People have questioned and debated me over my beliefs in college and I feel like a lose all my arguments when defending the faith. How do I defend the faith better. My friend compares us to Westboro, and my other friends says he won the arguement when we debated why I thought it was vastly different. My friend said Catholics were responsible for millions of death. I said they were not and once again my other friends said I lost the arguement when my friend brought up the crusades. My friend said Catholics support Child molestation, I said they did not and again I lost the arguement according to my onlooking friends who are all non religious. How do I defend the faith and convince my friends in the power of the Lord and his glory? How do I bring them closer to god. And am I commiting sins by not properly defending the faith?

(I know I had another thread but I did not want to start a new topic so I began this one)

Hi TrinitySaves,

Like everyone else has said, not defending your faith well is certainly not a sin. Desiring to do so actually shows your courage because it’s not easy!! Here’s some advice for whatever it’s worth…

Your friends are bringing up non-doctrinal issues which are, in my opinion, the hardest to defend…without first acknowledging that the Catholic Church is The Church built and protected by Jesus. Whether it’s The Crusades, priest scandals, contraception, gay marriage…without accepting first the authority of the Catholic Church it’s going to be more difficult, not impossible, but more difficult. So you need to say something like, “I understand your concerns about ABC, and I’ll answer your question, but can I ask you a very quick question myself before we begin, “Jesus said that He would build His Church and protect it from the gates of hell” (Mt 16:18). Who is that Church today?” They may squawk about changing the subject, but ask them to please indulge you for a few minutes. If we believe Jesus’ promise then 1 Church has been protected since 33 A.D. and is still protected today. This will form the foundation for all of your responses defending the faith and it can be done in a few steps:

1. Help them to compare Christianity of today with that in the first 800 years of the Church. Many “churches” today with multiple versions of the truth whereas in the Church of the first 800 years there was just 1 “denomination”. And make sure you tell them this wasn’t the Catholic church, but rather the Christian Church. If they start talking about “the hidden church” while you use facts I’m sure your non-religious friends will point out the absurdity of their argument…seriously, in hiding for 1500 years? Seriously!?
2. Then explain how The Church made decisions back then. On serious issues of faith and morals they called Councils. The authority of these Councils can be proven by the excommunications meted out and by saying what was truth and what was anathema. Those that were excommunicated surely disagreed with the Church’s ruling, but the key is that NO ONE QUESTIONED The Church’s authority to do so.
3. We know positively that their rulings or decrees are the truth not because of their great intellect or even their faith, but because Jesus said so. Since there was just 1 Church that even claimed to be apostolic (again, not Catholic, but Christian) then we’re left with two options…either this 1 Church taught the truth or they taught error meaning Jesus failed to protect His Church. Who as a Christian is going to stand up and say that Jesus failed in anything? He can’t!! He’s God! Therefore we are assured that this one single universal Church taught the truth.
4. That Church is the Catholic Church. We know this because every single decree made by this early Church are still the beliefs of the Catholic Church today. Not one decree has been renounced by a subsequent Church Council! It is the only church that can state that there is an unbroken chain of beliefs dating back to the apostles. You can look up all of the Councils of the Church in the first 800 years and find beliefs in the Eucharist, Mary as Mother of God, Mary ever-virgin, infant baptism, 73 book Bible, venerating statues. If it was true back then, then it is the truth now. I use Councils rather than the quotes of early Church Fathers because I have had anti-Catholics use their quotes to their advantage. Then I’m back to the “my interpretation is better than yours” debate which so many times is fruitless. The Councils are the collective belief rather than individual…much more effective in my opinion.

So to summarize: Single universal Church of the first 800 years which Jesus said He would protect, decisions were truthful and authoritative, and that Church is the Catholic Church. Once that has been established then you can discuss the non-doctrinal issues. Don’t shy away from some of the bad things in the Catholic Church’s history. Admit that although the Church has been protected by error related to faith and morals it isn’t immune to bad decisions and individual evil. People individually still do bad things. All the more amazing that the Catholic Church hasn’t taught heresy in all its years. Yes, some very close calls, but in the end protected from doing so by Jesus.

Hope this helps. If you want to talk in detail just send me a private message or continue the dialogue publicly on this thread.

-Ernie-

 

[otjm]

Is it a sin to not properly defend your faith?

Last time I checked, there were 10 commandments; I don’t recall it being one of them…

People have questioned and debated me over my beliefs in college and I feel like a lose all my arguments when defending the faith.

There is the first problem. We are called to evangelize. That word does not mean “debate”. and there is an old rule: “Never argue with a fool; an observer may not be able to tell which is which.” Perhaps a bit harsh, but the essence is true.

How do I defend the faith better.

Live it. Actions speak louder than words.

My friend compares us to Westboro, and my other friends says he won the argument when we debated why I thought it was vastly different.

There is a difference, often vast, between “friend”, and “acquaintance”. You may be confusing the two.

"My friend said Catholics were responsible for millions of death. I said they were not and once again my other friends said I lost the arguement when my friend brought up the crusades.

Your friend exaggerates to an extreme. Body counts didn’t really start until the Vietnam War. And how many deaths did the Islamists cause as they attempted to conquer Europe and the Holy Land?

My friend said Catholics support Child molestation, I said they did not and again I lost the argument according to my onlooking friends who are all non religious.

If you want to wander down that path, you need to learn some statistics, as well as learn what the Church has done to prevent further child abuse; and some statistics as to the amount of child abuse, for example, among school districts, and among families. again, why are you arguing?

You are young and letting yourself get dragged into arguments under the guise of defending the faith. The people you are arguing with are not interested in truth; they are interested in showing they are right and you are wrong, and truth has little to do with it.

Arguing is not defending the faith. The arguments you are getting into are not about the faith; they are about peripheral issues. And the more you allow yourself to get sucked into arguments, the more they are going to feel they are right and feel you are just stupid.

You are not stupid; but you are more than willing to take their bait. A fish is not caught if it does not open its mouth. You might consider the point.

I am sure you are like almost everyone - you want to be liked. I will reiterate: there is a vast difference between acquaintances and friends. You might start there.