Civil Affairs just isn’t about Afghanistan and Iraq though. Was that where my husband was sent? Yep. But its not JUST a side bar or tactic to the mission in Afghanistan or a combat mission or tactic Civil affairs soldiers are also in other parts of the world as well, such as Haiti, Kosovo, and Somolia.And I’m now a military lawyer who lived in Kabul doing Post-conflict Rule of Law Development and Training (though I used to be a line officer). Regardless, as a matter of foreign policy our military intervention in Afghanistan is violent diplomacy and self-defense.
Our primary mission is not to make life better for the Afghans. That’s military tactic that’s a nice side benefit for the people of Afghanistan. But we’ve never cared about protecting them, improving their lives, or bringing democracy to a repressed population.
If we cared about that we’d have been in Afghanistan after the Soviets left. And we be in about 50 other countries today.
This is what we care about: Capturing and/or killing Islamic Terrorists and denying them a base of operations from which to plan and carry out attacks against the United States (and to some extent our allies).
We’re not there to build schools for girls, build roads, and encourage women to cast off their burquas and go to medical school. Occasionally, we sell that to our troops . . . and it’s an absurd lie that should be almost entirely transparent. When we do stuff that looks like that, it’s because we feel it will hurt our enemies and/or help our allies in the Afghan Government. Don’t confuse it with altruism.
Our mission in Afghanistan isn’t a humanitarian mission.
Pax,
OA
Absolutely !Yes it’s not always easy.
But don’t we also…and perhaps more importantly, as Catholics,…need young men and women whose moral code is formed first by the teachings of the Church, and only second by the nation/state?
I was in SAC too (KC-135 navigator), and indeed the motto was “Peace Is Our Profession,” but whenever we were deployed to SEA (often), the standing joke was “and war is just a hobby.”I served in the USAF in the Strategic Air Command (SAC), now defunct and replaced by, if I recall correctly, the Global Strike Command.
The motto of SAC was: “Peace Is Our Profession.” I always viewed the motto as a little ironic for a command which had the ability to deliver nuclear weapons anywhere in the world within 30 minutes. Yet, during the cold war, the motto worked. By scrupulously maintaining a credible nuclear deterrent capability, nuclear war was avoided. We won the cold war. I’m a little worried now, because it appears our deterrent capability is a little diminished in the absence of SAC, and a weaker deterrent makes war more likely.
After much thought, you are belittling my husband’s duty. You only see one way of defeating our enemies and that’s by either killing them or capturing them. You see civil affairs as a side note, instead of seeing that it could very well be another way of dealing with the threats of terrorists. Making people more self sufficient and independent from the terrorists in their country is another way of fighting against terrorism. If people do not have to turn to the terrorists for their survival, they are provided more opportunities to choose peace instead of terror.Please don’t be offended - I’m not belittling your husband’s duty.
This is what I’m saying: We sent our military to Afghanistan to win a war. Our primary purpose for sending them there had nothing - absolutely nothing - to do with making life better for Afghans. Part of our military strategy in our struggle against Islamic Terrorists is stability operations, which includes what your husband and I did. For example, projects that make life better for noncombatants.
But don’t confuse a tactic with a mission. Our purpose for being in a country that most of America can’t find on a map has everything to do with the 3000 people killed on 11 September 2001, and nothing to do with the fact that we wanted to do something good for the suffering Afghan people.
Your husband - and I - were/are supporting elements in our nation’s goal of capturing and/or killing terrorists and denying them command and control and and base of operations.
That’s the truth . . . and it’s not bad.
I feel very good about what little I was able to do to help the Afghans. As should your husband. That was a very wonderful side-benefit to our participation in a military operation.
I’d be very surprised if your husband disagreed with anything I’ve written about the reason we sent our military to Afghanistan and why we continue to operate there. It’s not because we want to do something nice for less fortunate people.
Pax,
OA
Someone writing on the Missile Forums recounted an incident regarding an inspection from a general officer touring one of the Minuteman missile launch control centers. The SAC emblem along with the motto “Peace is Our Profession” was painted on a blast door. Beneath it someone had added “War is Only a Hobby.” The person giving the tour was upset at the addition and figured to be reamed out by the general. But the general liked it.I was in SAC too (KC-135 navigator), and indeed the motto was “Peace Is Our Profession,” but whenever we were deployed to SEA (often), the standing joke was “and war is just a hobby.”
I agree with everything you just wrote (except that you think I’m belittling your husband). I must have been very unclear in my earlier writing if you somehow came to the conclusion that I don’t value civil affairs. After all, I also value my contribution, which was rule of law development for the betterment of average Afghan citizen. Indeed, I spent my entire time there working with the Afghan Ministry of Interior, the US Embassy, and the Afghan police . . . .After much thought, you are belittling my husband’s duty. You only see one way of defeating our enemies and that’s by either killing them or capturing them. You see civil affairs as a side note, instead of seeing that it could very well be another way of dealing with the threats of terrorists. Making people more self sufficient and independent from the terrorists in their country is another way of fighting against terrorism. If people do not have to turn to the terrorists for their survival, they are provided more opportunities to choose peace instead of terror.
I did talk to my husband about this, many many conversations after he decided to change his MOS. He truly believes that civil affairs will make a big difference in our war on terror. He doesn’t disagree that we sent troops into Afghanistan to fight our enemies, but he does disagree that the only way to do that is through more violence. Other methods of fighting terrorism and making this world a safer place for all should be given as much consideration as resorting to killing people. If he didn’t believe that, he’d never have gone back to active duty or taken a job with the DOD to continue training troops in civil affairs or be considering other jobs with other government agencies that continue working to make places in this world safer for all people.
Christian discernment is never done, this side of Paradise.With all due respect to the OP I think your time for discerning whether or not to join the military is done. You are in as an ROTC cadet to some degree because you have a contract. I am speaking as someone who has served - and we are also called to fulfill our civil duty which you incurred voluntarily.
I served in Iraq - I am a disabled vet - and I would not change it as it has changed me for the better as it has brought me closer to God. I was a medic. Before I left I was converting to Chaplain’s Assistant.
Now, what you can do is discern your job in the military - medical, personnel, military police, etc. so that you will be in the best place that you feel will meet with your moral obligations. (Obviously as a Catholic Chaplains Corps on the Officer level is out unless you are male - and plan on going to seminary but I did not get that from your post) You can serve your minimum obligation and be done.
God bless.
Yes…but what about a Christian service-member?“I was just following orders” has not been an acceptable defense since Andersonville. A serviceman vows to obey lawful orders and is duty bound to refuse unlawful orders.
Obedience means to listen. Conscience always overrides that which is immoral, It does not matter to whom a Christian has promised obedience, his/her obedience is to God first.Yes…but what about a Christian service-member?
Are Christians in the military to put lawful (military) commands above the Gospel?
I wasn’t really addressing what is lawful, but rather what is Christian.
I disagree completely - all major decisions are done with discernment.Christian discernment is never done, this side of Paradise.
Christian discernment is never done, this side of Paradise.
As a writer, I laughed out loud at this exchange. A Dictionary of Modern American Usage disucsses the word “done” on page 222.I disagree completely - all major decisions are done with discernment.
Pax,(=finished), when used as an adjective is sometimes criticized, but the word has been so used since the 19th century . . . Many stylists prefer through.
I am so sorry if my head injury and trouble finding the occasional word none as nominal aphasia gets in the way of my meaning. I would think a fellow solder could understand TBI instead of picking apart things with a dictionary when it is fairly obviously what is being said.As a writer, I laughed out loud at this exchange. A Dictionary of Modern American Usage disucsses the word “done” on page 222.
Pax,
OA
I’m not having fun at your expense. My point was that you correctly identified that intelligent people can interpret the original sentence in more than one way. People like me make those sorts of writing mistakes all the time.I am so sorry if my head injury and trouble finding the occasional word none as nominal aphasia gets in the way of my meaning. I would think a fellow solder could understand TBI instead of picking apart things with a dictionary when it is fairly obviously what is being said.
Seriously? Everything a military organization commands is coherent with Christian/Catholic teaching?Yes, a Christian must follow military commands. That is not against Catholic teaching.
Yes of course. My point was that discernment is never finished (done) for Christians. We always need to discern, as Christians, all through our lives.I disagree completely - all major decisions are done with discernment.
That is the point - there are ways to make your point while getting to know people. While this an online community it still is a community - and many of us are here and have gotten to know each other over a period of time. My injuries have come from epilepsy over a period of five years. Thanks and Pax et Bonum.I’m not having fun at your expense. My point was that you correctly identified that intelligent people can interpret the original sentence in more than one way. People like me make those sorts of writing mistakes all the time.
And I’m sorry about your injury, which I knew nothing about.
Pax,
OA