Being Single...(And Sexuality)

[Epistemes]

I don’t really understand the dynamics of sexuality nor the chemistry that goes on between women and men even though I’ve written a number of poems dealing with just that subject, trying to rationalize my relationship to women. I find it so very strange that I’m able to talk fairly comfortably with the ladies at work, most of whom are older than me - some who I don’t find physically attractive, others I do - but most are married, and I leave it alone. I get along with women better than I do other men: it seems that most men are interested in sports, talking lewdly about other women, late nights, business, and more sports. While I can’t say that a similar streak doesn’t exist in me, as well, my faith has tamed me quite a bit. I am very much a mama’s boy, though, which has taught me much about women and their need for respect. It’s also taught me how to cook and clean.

What I don’t completely understand about myself and about male-to-female relationships is the fact that despite all of this background, I can’t find it in myself to say ‘hello’ to a single girl who I might be interested in, much less even look at her without flinching to avoid being noticed. I may have low self-esteem, but I also have it in me to say hello to strangers because I do it all the time, especially when I’m instilled by a greater sense of confidence of who I am as God’s child. I feel so cheap, so very sheepish, when I even think about approaching a girl who I’d like to be interested in. I get absolutely petrified and run, justifying my actions by saying, “Oh, she’s just not…” or “Oh, she’s too…” - and it’s not her, it’s me.

I don’t understand it.

I guess I bring this up since it’s spring, love is in the air, and I just got finished looking at an album of wedding pictures on Facebook. I don’t know that my vocation is to marriage, but I would really like to find a good, conservative Catholic girl to see if it is. Unfortunately, I don’t seem to be in any position socially to find her - and with no “Singles” or “Youth” group in the vicariate, my chances are even more diminished it seems.

I feel like I’m behind on life even if this is where God wants me to be.

 

[Blade_and_Blood]

Behind? Dude, you’re not behind, you’re just shy. That’s not a bad thing. You just haven’t found “that girl” yet. When you find her, you’ll know. If you’re okay with a single life, then, that’s okay too. :yup:

Ironically Yours, Blade and Blood

 

[chevalier]

when I even think about approaching a girl who I’d like to be interested in

[HouseJD]How about a girl you actually are interested in?[/HouseJD]

 

[catherinette]

I don’t really understand the dynamics of sexuality nor the chemistry that goes on between women and men even though I’ve written a number of poems dealing with just that subject, trying to rationalize my relationship to women. I find it so very strange that I’m able to talk fairly comfortably with the ladies at work, most of whom are older than me - some who I don’t find physically attractive, others I do - but most are married, and I leave it alone. I get along with women better than I do other men: it seems that most men are interested in sports, talking lewdly about other women, late nights, business, and more sports. While I can’t say that a similar streak doesn’t exist in me, as well, my faith has tamed me quite a bit. I am very much a mama’s boy, though, which has taught me much about women and their need for respect. It’s also taught me how to cook and clean.

What I don’t completely understand about myself and about male-to-female relationships is the fact that despite all of this background, I can’t find it in myself to say ‘hello’ to a single girl who I might be interested in, much less even look at her without flinching to avoid being noticed. I may have low self-esteem, but I also have it in me to say hello to strangers because I do it all the time, especially when I’m instilled by a greater sense of confidence of who I am as God’s child. I feel so cheap, so very sheepish, when I even think about approaching a girl who I’d like to be interested in. I get absolutely petrified and run, justifying my actions by saying, “Oh, she’s just not…” or “Oh, she’s too…” - and it’s not her, it’s me.

I don’t understand it.

I guess I bring this up since it’s spring, love is in the air, and I just got finished looking at an album of wedding pictures on Facebook. I don’t know that my vocation is to marriage, but I would really like to find a good, conservative Catholic girl to see if it is. Unfortunately, I don’t seem to be in any position socially to find her - and with no “Singles” or “Youth” group in the vicariate, my chances are even more diminished it seems.

I feel like I’m behind on life even if this is where God wants me to be.

I’d say you are overthinking it! Don’t look at every chance you have to ask a girl out to coffee or to have a friendly conversation as “discerning your vocation to marriage”. And don’t worry about going to singles groups or youth groups just for the opportunity to meet the right girl. That’s way too artificial; do the stuff that interests you instead, and you might just run into someone worth meeting! Well, at least that is my advice, but I am single too so what do I know!

 

[LongingForLight]

I am very much a mama’s boy, though, which has taught me much about women and their need for respect.

THANK YOU! This is a horrid tangent, but I am so sick of hearing about how men need respect, as if it didn’t matter to women! My DH has to listen to me rant on this every time it comes up

More seriously, though, I think this is normal for anyone who takes love seriously. Just keep praying - God has an answer for your shyness. And you aren’t behind - I’m sure you are using your time as a single person well. God needs some people who take some time to build His Kingdom in the community before moving on to building His Kingdom in their families.

 

[Epistemes]

I’d say you are overthinking it! Don’t look at every chance you have to ask a girl out to coffee or to have a friendly conversation as “discerning your vocation to marriage”. And don’t worry about going to singles groups or youth groups just for the opportunity to meet the right girl. That’s way too artificial; do the stuff that interests you instead, and you might just run into someone worth meeting! Well, at least that is my advice, but I am single too so what do I know!

Perhaps you’re right, perhaps I am overthinking it - because I know I have a tendency to overthink a lot of things as being single seems to allow lots of thinking time!

Seriously, though, to give a better example of what I’m talking about in this thread: there’s this girl in my parish, whose name I’ve learned through other friends and Facebook , who I think is very pretty. I would love to be able to say ‘hello’ to her, even if it meant just making another acquaintance in the parish - but I can’t. I’ve reached the critical point where I am absolutely terrified of her because I’ve mentally prepped myself for high expectations, expectations which cannot now be diluted no matter how hard I try. I see her weekly at Mass, I’ve gone to parish picnics where she’s there, and other parish functions, and even though I always say ‘hello’ to her mom and dad, I invariably ignore her because I’m petrified.

I’ve resorted to rationalizing why she’s not good for me: she’s too girly, she’s not devout enough, she’s too young, she’s too Cuban, she’s too… And I don’t even *know *her. I think my retiscence is due to the fact that I’m actually thinking that I’m too nerdy, I’m too devout, I’m too Anglo, I’m too much of a mama’s boy…

Our pastor gave a good homily today, here on Trinity Sunday, discussing how it’s in our very natures to love and be loved, to share ourselves with someone, to be the social beings that we were created to be…all in the image of the Most Holy Trinity, the perfect expression of communal love. As he was talking, my mind wandered off, thinking about how the Little Flower, St. Therese, wrote a wedding invitation for the Carmelite postulants announcing her betrothal to the Lord Jesus, the list of heavenly witnesses, and the ceremony and reception to be held in Heaven. For the Little Flower, Christ was Spouse enough; all other spouses were, indeed, only a shadow and copy of the Eternal Spouse.

I’m single, and I so often get lonely. I desire companionship, I desire affection, I desire having someone to talk to, to share myself with, to be with, and to give my love to. When I think long and hard about dating, I realize that it’s truly no cakewalk: yes, there will be picnics, state fairs, and quiet evenings beside the lake, but there will also be disagreements and - assuming things don’t work out - heartache. Am I ready for that?, I wonder. The truth is, I’m not sure I will ever have the opportunity to find out since I’m much more likely to run from any female interest than to stay around and chat like a normal human being, allowing any type of relationship to develop.

 

[chevalier]

Conquer your fear! Barring confidence coming from experience, only stupid people don’t fear! The courageous are those who proceed regardless of it.

It doesn’t matter if your knees are shaking or if your voice acts up or anything of that kind. It matters much more that you simply say it.

Decide whether you want to give it a go or not and then do it (or not) but don’t dwell on it. Well-though decisions are good. Overthought ones are not.

 

[catherinette]

Perhaps you’re right, perhaps I am overthinking it - because I know I have a tendency to overthink a lot of things as being single seems to allow lots of thinking time!

Hahaha, so true. I think if I don’t end up getting married I will have to become a contemplative nun!

Seriously, though, to give a better example of what I’m talking about in this thread: there’s this girl in my parish, whose name I’ve learned through other friends and Facebook , who I think is very pretty. I would love to be able to say ‘hello’ to her, even if it meant just making another acquaintance in the parish - but I can’t. I’ve reached the critical point where I am absolutely terrified of her because I’ve mentally prepped myself for high expectations, expectations which cannot now be diluted no matter how hard I try. I see her weekly at Mass, I’ve gone to parish picnics where she’s there, and other parish functions, and even though I always say ‘hello’ to her mom and dad, I invariably ignore her because I’m petrified.

You never know, she might just be wondering about that cute guy she sees at mass on Sundays, and secretly hoping he will come up and ask her out to coffee one day! Would it be so hard to say, “Hey I’ve seen you around at church, and I just wanted to introduce myself”?

Our pastor gave a good homily today, here on Trinity Sunday, discussing how it’s in our very natures to love and be loved, to share ourselves with someone, to be the social beings that we were created to be…all in the image of the Most Holy Trinity, the perfect expression of communal love. As he was talking, my mind wandered off, thinking about how the Little Flower, St. Therese, wrote a wedding invitation for the Carmelite postulants announcing her betrothal to the Lord Jesus, the list of heavenly witnesses, and the ceremony and reception to be held in Heaven. For the Little Flower, Christ was Spouse enough; all other spouses were, indeed, only a shadow and copy of the Eternal Spouse.

I’m single, and I so often get lonely. I desire companionship, I desire affection, I desire having someone to talk to, to share myself with, to be with, and to give my love to. When I think long and hard about dating, I realize that it’s truly no cakewalk: yes, there will be picnics, state fairs, and quiet evenings beside the lake, but there will also be disagreements and - assuming things don’t work out - heartache. Am I ready for that?, I wonder. The truth is, I’m not sure I will ever have the opportunity to find out since I’m much more likely to run from any female interest than to stay around and chat like a normal human being, allowing any type of relationship to develop.

I suppose it’s good to remember that loneliness is not something that will go away even if you are in a relationship. It’s part of the very desire for God which is at the center of our souls; you can’t expect another human being to completely fulfill that desire, nor would you want them to. Besides, it’s also good to remember that being in the wrong relationship is far worse than being in no relationship at all!

 

[chevalier]

You never know, she might just be wondering about that cute guy she sees at mass on Sundays, and secretly hoping he will come up and ask her out to coffee one day! Would it be so hard to say, “Hey I’ve seen you around at church, and I just wanted to introduce myself”?

Skip, “just.”

 

[AlexaD]

You won’t know unless you try! It may be awkward but if anything you’ll have the satisfaction of knowing you tried and didn’t back away. It’ll make the next time easier. OR, you will be pleasantly surprised to receive a positive reaction from this girl and you can take things from there. You have to conquer your fears and get yourself out there. You can do it. Good luck!

 

[Captain_America]

A big part of “overthinking” is placing too much importance right from the start on the relationship. Better to have casual, que sera, sera approach. And if Girl A doesn’t like you, just move on to Girl B. Plenty of fish in the sea.

I am more fascinated by your description of yourself as a “mama’s boy”.

I am overwhelmed by this social message that TRUE men only care about spectator sports, cussing and drinking. That’s an AWFULLY limiting view of what men can do, and what they should be.

 

[chevalier]

A big part of “overthinking” is placing too much importance right from the start on the relationship. Better to have casual, que sera, sera approach.

Que sera sera, qui vivra verra. What will be, will be, but who lives (i.e. stays around) long enough will see. If you don’t live long enough, you won’t see anything.

And if Girl A doesn’t like you, just move on to Girl B. Plenty of fish in the sea.

And that’s precisely what many women don’t like.

Let’s face it: Some want you to “be cool about it” and even casual, or even slightly dismissive or doubtful about it. Some others would like you to be certain you want to commit yourself to them forever even before they invest the five minutes it takes to have a conversation. There are many different women, but the point is not about finding the right strategy to “get one”, but rather the point is about finding one that will be good for you.

Personally, my reflection is that a sense of entitlement is not something I take well and on the other hand, a penchant for men who don’t care is not something I appreciate in a woman, either.

I can very well pull off the que sera sera and I can succeed in it. Except at the end of the day I will think that if I really cared, if it really were it, then there should be (or have been) no such thing. No nonchalance whatsoever.

 

[catherinette]

A big part of “overthinking” is placing too much importance right from the start on the relationship. Better to have casual, que sera, sera approach. And if Girl A doesn’t like you, just move on to Girl B. Plenty of fish in the sea.

I think casual in the sense of not putting the relationship on the romantic level right away is a good idea. But you make it sound like any homo sapien with two X chromosomes is the same as any other, and would do just as well!

 

[RobNY]

Definitely introduce yourself to her.

You can think of a million reasons why she won’t like you, but girls are very ingenious in making up reasons to like men. They’re not as unapproachable or impossible as they seem.

I think praying can never go wrong. A decade of a rosary here, some liturgy of the hours there. I’m a fan of the church date. Chevalier, what do you think of this?

Companionship and affection are very important. Make sure you keep your prayer life going on all cylinders. This will help you discern, as you date or consider dating women, in what manner you want to find companionship and affection.

Let me tell you, fraternal companionship is very important, and nearly altogether lacking in our society because of how we have sexualized all relationships. I am a firm believer that men need intimate friendships with other men-- and I think you can see true brotherhood as a bond which unites men in every age. But since we’ve sexualized everything, it is often blithely assumed that an intimate male relationship must be homosexual-- think about Frodo and Sam in the Lord of the Rings, and how much of a shock Tolkien’s portrayal of their friendship was, as it came out in the movies (to a secular audience). Tolkien, of course, was a member of a group of men called the Inklings, which included C.S. Lewis.

So it’s also natural to want to have fraternal companionship, and you might eventually find that you’d like to be in a religious order, for this reason among others.

And then of course, there’s also the question of the interior life, and it is not without its own consolations.

Being in a godly relationship with a woman will help you to sort out what sort of life you are called to. Quite frankly, your sentence with “I’m single…” and talking about loneliness is something I would have identified with a few years ago. But after some years of praying, and being in a relationship for a while, I’ve started to realize that I don’t think it is the affection and companionship of the married state that I need.

And whichever you need… that depends on how God made you. I’m not trying to dissuade you from dating, the opposite in fact. But you’ll just have to be open to where God’s calling you. I’m sure it will hit you out of the blue. And getting to know a woman one on one will definitely help you to figure that out-- it will in a certain sense de-mystify them, although in another sense they will remain utterly mysterious.

God bless,
Rob

 

[catherinette]

And that’s precisely what many women don’t like.

Exactly!

Let’s face it: Some want you to “be cool about it” and even casual, or even slightly dismissive or doubtful about it. Some others would like you to be certain you want to commit yourself to them forever even before they invest the five minutes it takes to have a conversation. There are many different women, but the point is not about finding the right strategy to “get one”, but rather the point is about finding one that will be good for you.

I think it’s necessary to find a balance. Certainly you don’t know right away that a woman is the right one for you. A man professing his undying love five minutes after meeting the girl is frankly a bit scary, and also not too believable; love is more than just an emotional response. But on the other hand a woman (or a man) wants to be treated as a unique individual, and not just another pretty face. Some people meet the person they are going to marry and know right away that he or she is the one for them; but most people have to go through a couple of relationships before they find the one. I think an attitude towards seriously dating someone needs to recognize, that yes, you aren’t the first person I’ve ever liked, and if it doesn’t work out, you won’t be the last; yet there is something unique about you that interests me enough to want to know you better and see how things develop.

Personally, my reflection is that a sense of entitlement is not something I take well and on the other hand, a penchant for men who don’t care is not something I appreciate in a woman, either.

I can very well pull off the que sera sera and I can succeed in it. Except at the end of the day I will think that if I really cared, if it really were it, then there should be (or have been) no such thing. No nonchalance whatsoever.

The nonchalant attitude may spare you a bit of pain, but at some point it’s necessary to take a risk. Otherwise you are saying to the other person, “I don’t see enough of what I am looking for in you to want to take that risk.” You can hardly expect such an attitude to win the girl’s heart!

 

[catherinette]

You can think of a million reasons why she won’t like you, but girls are very ingenious in making up reasons to like men. They’re not as unapproachable or impossible as they seem.

Some of us aren’t!

I think praying can never go wrong. A decade of a rosary here, some liturgy of the hours there. I’m a fan of the church date.

I would be impressed if a man asked if I wanted to go to adoration with him. But coffee is always good too.

 

[RobNY]

Some of us aren’t!

I wouldn’t believe you anyway.

I would be impressed if a man asked if I wanted to go to adoration with him. But coffee is always good too.

I think what we need are cheesy Catholic pickup lines. What woman can resist, “you’ve got such stunning scapular brown eyes?” But say it without the question mark at the end or you’ll sound like Ron Burgundy?

-Rob

 

[TZiggy]

Quote from Mother Angelica:
“We are trained today to fear. I’m not afraid of failure. Fear of failure is the worst thing in the world, because it prevents you from stepping out.”

Think about it. If God is inspiring you to approach someone, you are allowing fear (it only comes from one place) to hamper that inspiration.

It’s time to trust God. He may allow disappointment to show you your true strength. He may show you your true love on the first try.

TRUST in the Lord and go for it!

 

[Epistemes]

Companionship and affection are very important. Make sure you keep your prayer life going on all cylinders. This will help you discern, as you date or consider dating women, in what manner you want to find companionship and affection.

Let me tell you, fraternal companionship is very important, and nearly altogether lacking in our society because of how we have sexualized all relationships. I am a firm believer that men need intimate friendships with other men-- and I think you can see true brotherhood as a bond which unites men in every age.

So it’s also natural to want to have fraternal companionship, and you might eventually find that you’d like to be in a religious order, for this reason among others.

Being in a godly relationship with a woman will help you to sort out what sort of life you are called to.

Indeed, I have wondered, at times, if my desire for romance isn’t actually just a desire to fill a more apparent hole, namely the one that has led me to believe that I have few actual friends – either guys or girls my age with whom I can go out for drinks, dinner, movies, etc. The older I get, the more marginalized I increasingly become: I’m not married, I don’t have kids, I don’t go for contact sports, I don’t go for getting crazy drunk, I don’t go for much contemporary popular music, and so on. For example, I have a couple of friends, who are married, whom I met in RCIA a couple of years back. Since then, we’ve occassionally gone out to dinner, movies and the like. However, I recently reflected that only *once *or *twice *in the three years that we’ve known each other have they actually extended such invitations to me, it’s much more common that I invite them because I’m bored or particularly lonely. To add insult to injury, seeing pictures on their Facebook page made me realize that it’s far more easy for them to relate and have fun with other married couples than with a drifting, single guy who hasn’t dated in years.

At the moment, my one only actual guy friend (who is Catholic) is trying to overcome a serious drug and alcohol addiction, and the reason why he got addicted was because he was bored and lonely and there’s nothing to do in this town but eat and shop (if you’re moral) or get drunk and spend money on strippers (if you’re not). It’s very difficult finding young people who are anywhere between ages 22 - 35 who aren’t interested in doing just that. In fact, given that I don’t know this girl at my parish, how do I know that she, too, doesn’t smell like gin on Sunday mornings but comes to Mass only because she may happen to live with her parents?

It’s all speculation, and I fear it will remain speculation for years to come.

 

[chevalier]

Exactly!

I’m glad we understand each other.

I think an attitude towards seriously dating someone needs to recognize, that yes, you aren’t the first person I’ve ever liked, and if it doesn’t work out, you won’t be the last; yet there is something unique about you that interests me enough to want to know you better and see how things develop.

The most important point I’d like to make in that context is that people aren’t being reasonable. The result is that some women want a securitised investment from the get go, while some others make a point of wanting you to be cool about it. Little patience do I have for such games. I would never put my money in shady equity and so much less would I put my very personality in a relationship with someone I had only just seen. I could do just that, but only as my own decision, not as a precondition demanded by someone else. As for playing cool, well, those ladies might want to play ice hockey. While cool, it’s rather slippery, however.

The nonchalant attitude may spare you a bit of pain,

I can take it. I don’t shy away.

“I don’t see enough of what I am looking for in you to want to take that risk.”

Most of the time that’d be a true statement.

You can hardly expect such an attitude to win the girl’s heart!

Yeah, but ultimately the point isn’t about winning.