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Bonnie
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Nothing wrong with fantasy - it’s not knowing the difference between fantasy & reality that bothers me. And lying to the kids. Couldn’t ever bring myself to do that.
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pensmama87
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I’m sorry, that must have been hard.
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Millie123
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False dichotomy…what makes you think that families who dont do Santa also dont value their childrens fun, fantasy, and innocence of their youth? You can still have youthful fun, fantasy, and innocence even without Santa…Santa doesnt hold the monopoly on that
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Bonnie
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Actually - no. We were a lot closer than we were later in a bigger house. It’s just that there weren’t any secrets.
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Dorothy
Guest
I agree. St. Therese the Little Flower had gifts for Christmas, but it wasn’t from Santa. They had the custom of gift-giving, and filling shoes (or socks) with little gifts as well.
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Contra_Mundum_1
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Exactly.
Christmas is about celebrating the birth of Jesus. Throwing in this Santa story to make it more ‘magical’ takes away the focus because the kids are all about the fat man who brings gifts from their list. Kids are like that, thy focus on gifts a lot. And it also makes me wonder why these parents need to insert this into Christmas. Is the reality of Christmas just not enough? Not beautiful enough for their kids?
I Understand that secular people need to justify celebrating Christmas, so Santa works perfectly for them. But practicing Christians? C’mon people. Our holidays have been bastardised enough. Why play along?
meltzerboy
New member
Well, of course Santa holds no monopoly on fun, fantasy, and innocence. I just meant that I see no harm in kids’ believing in Santa so long as they are taught the tenets of their faith as well. In other words, I don’t think belief in Santa will jeopardize their Christian faith, nor do I believe they will grow up unable to differentiate fantasy from reality. In fact, most kids have quite a good grasp on make-believe play and on reality, better than their parents may think. This we know from the psychological research. However, if parents are opposed to introducing Santa to their kids as a “real” person, it is of course their prerogative to raise their children virtually any way they wish.
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Bonnie
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I can’t say there is cause & effect, but I have met people who can’t differentiate between an actor & the role he plays. But maybe? It would be interesting to ask these people if they believed in Santa Claus when they were young.
meltzerboy
New member
I think really good actors themselves may lose touch with reality when delving into a role. That is a good thing, I think, for both the actors and the audience so long as no psychotic break actually occurs.I can’t say there is cause & effect, but I have met people who can’t differentiate between an actor & the role he plays. But maybe? It would be interesting to ask these people if they believed in Santa Claus when they were young.
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Millie123
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I agree with you parents have the freedom to practice whatever Christmas tradition that they want within their family. My frustration with this thread that I am voicing. Is that I have recently come to my realization that small innocent children, between the ages of 5/6/7. Who dont believe in Santa, are expected by grown adults to also accomadate to the beliefs of children who do believe in Santa. Speaking from first hand experience, because I have a small child who has been dealing with this from school over the last couple of weeks. Based on his age and maturity level I think that it is an unfair expectation on adults to place this burden on my child. Who does not have the maturity level to play on with the charade when in conversation with his friends.
Honestly…as a parent this is a big source of frustration. There has to be another way, some more critical thinking from both sides need to be taking place. No, it is not fair for believing children to be told that Santa isnt real. But, it is also an unfair burden to expect small children who don’t believe in Santa, to “play along with the charade” when really his instincts when participating in conversation is to speak his mind, with innocent honesty. If parents of beliving children honestly think that when small children are engaging in conversation about Santa. That during that conversation, the burden is on the nonbelieving child to maintain their believing childs belief in Santa. Then thats a plan that’s not based in reality, or charity, and is doomed to failure.
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AClaire11
Guest
In the kindergarten I worked at, we’d gently explain to children how it’s not nice to announce that you dislike something or think it’s dumb right after a classmate expresses they like it. It’s the same principle. Otherwise, why censor an atheist child, for example, who tells Mary Beth that Jesus is a lie? That child is just expressing his belief, right? But it’s certainly not appropriate for kindergarten. Obviously that’s on another level, but it shows that yes, there are times when censorship is appropriate.
And I really don’t understand the disdain some on this thread have for a harmless tradition. It certainly never took away from my faith in Jesus. I don’t think we’re giving children enough credit.
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Millie123
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No, but…if my child were having a conversation with an atheist child regarding the Holy Eucharist. I most certainly would not put the burden on the atheist child to maintain my sons belief in the Holy Eucharist. Especially when both children have willingly entered into that conversation together. That would be an unfair, unrealistic, and uncharitable burden to place on the atheist child.
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Contra_Mundum_1
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Why do you think it is harmless? My kids are bombarded with messages that Christmas is about Santa bringing them gifts. I constantly must keep reminding them that we celebrate the birth of Jesus. Why are we expected to accomodate this fake Christmas, but must be very careful to not shock poor kids who have been told this lie by their parents?
Again, I don’t expect anything better from non Christians, but it seriously shocks me that so many Christians support this nonsense.
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gracepoole
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Actually I think the opposite: it’s not the place of atheist children to challenge other children’s belief in the Holy Eucharist, just as it’s not the place of non-Santa-believing children to challenge those who do believe. I don’t understand how a 6-year-old who never believed is different than a 6-year-old who “figured it out.” Both need to be taught not to spill the beans. And I’ve met many 6-year-olds who were keeping the secret from siblings and friends without tremendous difficulty. This is a cultural practice and we’re all initiated into it, kids included.
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gracepoole
Guest
Maybe people see it as harmless because it didn’t permanently rupture their faith. It certainly didn’t for me. Santa filled our stockings in the night. That didn’t in the least take away from the many Advent traditions we practiced, midnight Mass, the celebration of the Epiphany, Candlemas…
This whole thing reminds me of Halloween. Evangelical influences have pushed some Catholics to assert that children shouldn’t be celebrating Halloween because it flirts with the occult, it takes away from the religious significance of All Saints Day, it’s “nonsense.” Yet some of the most pious Catholics I know have celebrated Halloween for the past 70-80 years without their faith suffering for it. Fun, mystery, and magic are part of the collective human experience. It really isn’t necessary to read more into it than that.
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Millie123
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Yes we have different perspectives. When I was growing up I was a very devout Roman Catholic school girl going to public school in a Mormon state, and vocal about my devotion. Yes, it was very common for me to have my Catholic beliefs challenged among my classmates. No it was not my classmates responsibility to reaffirm my Catholic beliefs. I would just go home and tell my parents about what happened at school, and they would reaffirm what it was we believed. It was my parents responsibility to reaffirm, and maintain my Catholic beliefs. Not my classmates.
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BlueEyedLady
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I guess I don’t get the rabid defensiveness. Kids aren’t going to confuse Santa with Jesus if your faith is a real part of your family. I mean, kids don’t watch their parents (and large groups of society) go to mass every Sunday all year to worship Santa. They don’t pray to Santa before meals. Nuns don’t enter convents over the guy at the mall in a red suit. Surely faith traditions and religious beliefs aren’t so fragile as to be challenged by a jolly fat man.
It’s a shared cultural and family tradition. If it isn’t part of yours, that’s fine, but trying to turn it into a larger moral statement is silly.
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Allegra
Guest
Does it? The tradition of Santa Claus allows parents the opportunity to give their children real gifts. I’m not talking socks, underwear, pencils, books, and all the things parents have to/ are supposed to be providing their children or an allowance or privilege that the child should earn. I’m talking about giving their kids a real, unnecessary gift, for no other reason than they love them for who they are, and without any recognition or expectation of any response from their child. It’s a very loving experience to give an anonymous gift to someone, especially when it’s someone you love very much. I would say, a very Christian experience, particularly when you consider that Christmas is all about the giving of a great gift that was not deserved, earned, or ever properly appreciated, but it was given, nonetheless, out of love. And when children become old enough to discover what Santa really is, which is not a “lie” but a tradition of anonymous giving that has been handed down through generations, then they realize how loved they are and learn to share that love with others in turn. How can this be anything other than efficacious?
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JK61
Guest
When my children were little and they asked about Santa, I told them I had never seen him. When my oldest was in second grade and I was pretty sure the talk around school was getting more towards disbelief I told him after Christmas, I didn’t want him embarrassed by a classmate the next year. I asked him if he remembers the story of St Nicholas that they celebrated at school. I told him Santa was based on St Nicholas and since St Nicholas was not living that Santa could not be living either. I told him not to spoil it for his brother and sister. He let his brother and sister and other classmates enjoy the fun. My daughter, the youngest, says he told her but she’s the smartest of the three. I just try to gauge what information they are really wanting. Kids grow up too fast anymore. Children learn from an active imagination, Santa is a fun one to share.
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CradleJourney
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I, personally, believe strongly in Santa - having been the beneficiary of his generosity many times throughout not just my childhood, but my adult life.
When I was a child, the only answer my mom would ever give regarding him is that “Santa is real as long as you believe he is.” While frustrating for awhile it did eventually lead me to better understanding after reflecting on “who” Santa is.
I don’t know for sure (the youngest are still growing up), but I think I’ve done a fairly good job with my kids in educating them about Santa - that there are others who don’t believe in him - just like their are others who don’t believe in Christmas or God or any one of the beliefs we hold as Catholics. That’s okay, but it doesn’t make it true (or false). That it’s up to them to believe or not (though reminding them that Santa doesn’t bring gifts to those who don’t acknowledge him has kept that “belief” going … and prevented sibling disclaimers over the years).
And, of course, the main reason for Santa in the first place - to use as a tool to gradually help my children grow from the black/white concepts of logistics, into the understanding of selfless giving, with a desire to please and bring joy to another with no personal recognition. To grow, if you will from being just a child into also eventually being Santa to others. Just like a small child may picture God as an elderly but powerful man sitting on a throne up in the sky, but eventually grows (hopefully) beyond that to where they understand that God is not just all-powerful, but everywhere, all the time, and speaks to us in a variety of ways (not just in burning bushes, thankfully). A 3 yr old is still working out that Jesus is not the priest we see at mass…but a 30 yr old can recognize him in what others only see as a wafer of bread. A 3 yr old is looking for a red suit…but a 30 yr old can find Santa in the good Samaritan who helps jump start his car in a parking lot on Christmas eve - or be Santa to his elderly neighbor.
Just wish more people could see beyond the “red suit” and realize it can be more than just playing pretend for a few years before outing “the truth” at a certain point.
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