Best Philosopher?

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I am performing an experiment: who do you think is the most important philosopher (to date) for Catholic thought?
 
Linusthe2nd said:
Thomas Aquinas, hands down. St. Augustine second.
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I think I would concur with this…Blessed John Duns Scotus is a debatable second. He did some nice work solving logical problems with the Immaculate Conception.
 
St Thomas Aquinas, by a mile, for more modern development, and St Augustine, for laying the early groundwork. Aristotle and Plotinus, even as pagans, come in third and fourth, I think, or at least in the top ten, for the influence the former had in giving the framework of philosophy (and later philosophic theology) itself to the West and the Church, and the latter for his extensive influence on St Augustine.

For the East, I’d say it’s probably Origen, in the same place as St Thomas is in the West - most important by a mile - followed by the Cappadocians, and Gregory Palamas, with the pagan philosopher of great importance being Plato.
 
St Thomas Aquinas had to choose the most appropriate philosophical instrument for his "art."No philosophy but Aristotle’s could fit the task.Why?His philosophy alone merits the name of “perennial philosophy”,by its realism,its logical precision,and its preoccupation with the first principles of things.

Aristotelianism is the glorification of common-sense,the philosophical systematization of down-to-earth wisdom.As the history of ancient Greece bears witness,beyond Aristotelianism philosophy the intellect can but err.

The conclusions of our pagan philosopher,however,lacked a certain illumination,especially on questions approaching the supernatural:creation,the immortality of the soul,and the nature of God.For Aristotle’s wisdom was horizontal rather than vertical;realist rather than sublime.Aristotle did not go beyond created substance,St Thomas had to push his philosophical analysis farther,higher and beyond.

So I would have to say Aristotle as perfected by St Thomas Aquinas.
 
Very happy with these answers 🙂

Definitely the mighty St. Thomas Aquinas, followed by Aristotle (A lot of ancient Greek thinking provides an important foundation for Catholic philosophy).

Also very important are St. Anselm and Augustine as well as more modern scholars like GK Chesterton.

Although he wasn’t Catholic, I find CS Lewis’ works very inspiring and useful for the Catholic thinker.
 
Khalid said:
St Thomas Aquinas, by a mile, for more modern development, and St Augustine, for laying the early groundwork. Aristotle and Plotinus, even as pagans, come in third and fourth, I think, or at least in the top ten, for the influence the former had in giving the framework of philosophy (and later philosophic theology) itself to the West and the Church, and the latter for his extensive influence on St Augustine.

For the East, I’d say it’s probably Origen, in the same place as St Thomas is in the West - most important by a mile - followed by the Cappadocians, and Gregory Palamas, with the pagan philosopher of great importance being Plato.
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Hey, K, nice to have you at home. Keep it up.👍
 
How about the best living Catholic philosopher?

Msgr. Robert Sokolowski
 
Chronologically, I propose the following, who together form a vertiable intellecutal history of Catholicism:
  1. King Solomon
  2. Diogenes of Sinope
  3. JESUS CHRIST
  4. Marcus Aurelius
  5. St. Francis of Assisi
  6. Bl. Jacapone da Todi
  7. Arthur Schopenhauer
  8. Tristan Tzara
  9. Albert Camus
  10. Jacques Derrida
In order of importance (and confining the list to Catholics)- Jesus Christ, Bl. Jacapone da Todi, Albert Camus.
 
Qoeleth said:
Chronologically, I propose the following, who together form a vertiable intellecutal history of Catholicism:
  1. King Solomon
  2. Diogenes of Sinope
  3. JESUS CHRIST
  4. Marcus Aurelius
  5. St. Francis of Assisi
  6. Bl. Jacapone da Todi
  7. Arthur Schopenhauer
  8. Tristan Tzara
  9. Albert Camus
  10. Jacques Derrida
In order of importance (and confining the list to Catholics)- Jesus Christ, Bl. Jacapone da Todi, Albert Camus.
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Thank you
 
Qoeleth said:
Chronologically, I propose the following, who together form a vertiable intellecutal history of Catholicism:
  1. King Solomon
  2. Diogenes of Sinope
  3. JESUS CHRIST
  4. Marcus Aurelius
  5. St. Francis of Assisi
  6. Bl. Jacapone da Todi
  7. Arthur Schopenhauer
  8. Tristan Tzara
  9. Albert Camus
  10. Jacques Derrida
In order of importance (and confining the list to Catholics)- Jesus Christ, Bl. Jacapone da Todi, Albert Camus.
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With all due respect----------

Schopenhauer and Camus, the biggest atheists around (particularly Schopenhauer), and Derrida, the founder of Deconstructionism, as influential to CATHOLIC THOUGHT?🤷

Maybe I’m too dense and lacking “common sense,” but could you please explain to me (and the rest of the posters) what criteria you are using for putting those in the list of Catholic influences?

What is it that I am not seeing, pray tell?:confused:

Just asking. 🙂
 
well I, for one, was impressed that Christ made it on the list. I used to think philosophy was about getting truth; I am a little depressed about Catholic thought when the person who taught us how to think about truth gets neglected. I am also glad that it wasn’t the typical ‘Aquinas and Augustine’, but that for perhaps less noble reasons.
 
Dietrich Bonhoeffer or St John the evangelist

I can’t make up my mind : P

SHALOM
GOD BLESS
 
OrdinaryMelkite said:
With all due respect----------

Schopenhauer and Camus, the biggest atheists around (particularly Schopenhauer), and Derrida, the founder of Deconstructionism, as influential to CATHOLIC THOUGHT?🤷

Maybe I’m too dense and lacking “common sense,” but could you please explain to me (and the rest of the posters) what criteria you are using for putting those in the list of Catholic influences?

What is it that I am not seeing, pray tell?:confused:

Just asking. 🙂
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Camus was baptized a Catholic, and God and redemption are a leading theme of his work. If you read “The Fall”, it is a modern, 1st person re-telling of John the Baptist, and similarly “The Outsider” talks about the alientation caused by commitment to Truth. He wrote his thesis on the influence of Plotinus on St. Augustine, and towards the end of his life he sought re-baptism. He accounts for the redemptive nature of rebellion against man’s fallen nature.

Similarly, Schopenhauer, while not ‘God-focused’ is profoundly Christocentric in his ethics, and talks about the metaphysical connection between suffering and sin, the fallenness of the human condition, the unity of all mankind in common suffering, and compassion as the only response- the ‘Lord of this World’ as the anti-thesis of good.

And Derrida- the demonstration of the absence/presence of the quasi-meontic Logos, the transcendental signified (which perhaps doesn’t ‘exist’ [whatever that means])- the necessary (but necessarily unreachable) object of metaphysical desire- -]revealed/-] through deconstruction. His analysis of the negative theology Angelus Silesius is the best philosophical theology of the 20th Century- God as the collapse of meaning and the failure of language.

Well, each of these has brought me closer to God and the message of Jesus, in a way that Aquinas never did.

I would also add E.M. Cioran…
 
Qoeleth said:
Camus was baptized a Catholic, and God and redemption are a leading theme of his work. If you read “The Fall”, it is a modern, 1st person re-telling of John the Baptist, and similarly “The Outsider” talks about the alientation caused by commitment to Truth. He wrote his thesis on the influence of Plotinus on St. Augustine, and towards the end of his life he sought re-baptism. He accounts for the redemptive nature of rebellion against man’s fallen nature.

Similarly, Schopenhauer, while not ‘God-focused’ is profoundly Christocentric in his ethics, and talks about the metaphysical connection between suffering and sin, the fallenness of the human condition, the unity of all mankind in common suffering, and compassion as the only response- the ‘Lord of this World’ as the anti-thesis of good.

And Derrida- the demonstration of the absence/presence of the quasi-meontic Logos, the transcendental signified (which perhaps doesn’t ‘exist’ [whatever that means])- the necessary (but necessarily unreachable) object of metaphysical desire- -]revealed/-] through deconstruction. His analysis of the negative theology Angelus Silesius is the best philosophical theology of the 20th Century- God as the collapse of meaning and the failure of language.

Well, each of these has brought me closer to God and the message of Jesus, in a way that Aquinas never did.

I would also add E.M. Cioran…
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Ah, now I see…

Thanks for the explanation.

Yep. 👍👍
 
Qoeleth said:
Chronologically, I propose the following, who together form a vertiable intellecutal history of Catholicism:
  1. King Solomon
  2. Diogenes of Sinope
  3. JESUS CHRIST
  4. Marcus Aurelius
  5. St. Francis of Assisi
  6. Bl. Jacapone da Todi
  7. Arthur Schopenhauer
  8. Tristan Tzara
  9. Albert Camus
  10. Jacques Derrida
In order of importance (and confining the list to Catholics)- Jesus Christ, Bl. Jacapone da Todi, Albert Camus.
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I’m surprised you didn’t mention Nietzsche.
 
Qoeleth said:
And Derrida- the demonstration of the absence/presence of the quasi-meontic Logos, the transcendental signified (which perhaps doesn’t ‘exist’ [whatever that means])- the necessary (but necessarily unreachable) object of metaphysical desire-
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Have you read Jacques Lacan?

He was a wild French Freudian who talked about our futile attempt to find the transcendental signified. Life, according to Lacan, is a chase after substitute signifiers which don’t satisfy. Sounds like an atheist Augustine, with a touch of Mick Jagger and F. Scott Fitzgerald.
 
levinas12 said:
Have you read Jacques Lacan?

He was a wild French Freudian who talked about our futile attempt to find the transcendental signified. Life, according to Lacan, is a chase after substitute signifiers which don’t satisfy. Sounds like an atheist Augustine, with a touch of Mick Jagger and F. Scott Fitzgerald.
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I have read a few of his papers, but not systematically. Any particular works of his you recommend?

Do you see post-modern (a-)theism as forming a fertile ground for a post-scientific, post-rationalist Christian revival? Does the deconstruction of the idea of ‘objective truth’ actually re-open the possibility of Faith as a viable intellectual orientation?
 
Qoeleth said:
Camus was baptized a Catholic, and God and redemption are a leading theme of his work. If you read “The Fall”, it is a modern, 1st person re-telling of John the Baptist, and similarly “The Outsider” talks about the alientation caused by commitment to Truth. He wrote his thesis on the influence of Plotinus on St. Augustine, and towards the end of his life he sought re-baptism. He accounts for the redemptive nature of rebellion against man’s fallen nature.

Similarly, Schopenhauer, while not ‘God-focused’ is profoundly Christocentric in his ethics, and talks about the metaphysical connection between suffering and sin, the fallenness of the human condition, the unity of all mankind in common suffering, and compassion as the only response- the ‘Lord of this World’ as the anti-thesis of good.

And Derrida- the demonstration of the absence/presence of the quasi-meontic Logos, the transcendental signified (which perhaps doesn’t ‘exist’ [whatever that means])- the necessary (but necessarily unreachable) object of metaphysical desire- -]revealed/-] through deconstruction. His analysis of the negative theology Angelus Silesius is the best philosophical theology of the 20th Century- God as the collapse of meaning and the failure of language.

Well, each of these has brought me closer to God and the message of Jesus, in a way that Aquinas never did.

I would also add E.M. Cioran…
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Qoeleth:

And Lonergan? Your take, por favor.

God bless,
jd
 
JDaniel said:
Qoeleth:

And Lonergan? Your take, por favor.

God bless,
jd
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One of my favourite 20th Century theologians- in recognising theology as foremost a ‘whole-human’ activity, and the human nature as one driven by self-transcendence, which has both a political and a ‘prive/spiritual’ significance.
 
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