Bible Alone and what does it really mean?

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Timeline

Around 4 B.C.:
Jesus is born. His birth was “in the days of Herod the king” (Matthew 2:1), and scholars tell us that Herod died in 4 B.C. (see for example Jamieson, Fausset, and Brown Commentary, verse 1, and People’s New Testament, verse 1). As these two commentaries point out, Jesus is believed to have been born in the last year of Herod’s reign, which puts His birth at around 4 B.C.

Around 30 A.D.:
Jesus is crucified. In Luke 3:23 we are told that Jesus was about 30 years old when He began His ministry, and scholars tell us that His ministry probably lasted about three and a half years (see for example Wesley’s Explanatory Notes, verse 23). So Jesus died somewhere around 30 A.D.

Around 30 A.D. (continued):
The Church is born. Jesus was in the tomb on the Passover Sabbath, and the day of Pentecost always fell on the fiftieth day counting from the day after the Passover Sabbath (see for example People’s New Testament, verse 1, and Gill’s Exposition of the Bible). Acts 2:1-4 tells us that on the day of Pentecost the Holy Spirit filled the original disciples, along with manifestations such as the sound as of a mighty wind, visible tongues of fire, speaking in tongues, and the first preaching of the Gospel (in which a harvest of souls began to be gathered in). This event is often regarded as signaling the birth of the Church.

45-48 A.D.:
The book of James is written. Most non-Catholic Bible scholars agree that James was one of the half-brothers of Jesus (Catholics disagree because they believe that Jesus’ mother had no other children) and the one who presided over the “Jerusalem Conference” in Acts 15:1-30 (48-50 A.D.). There are several other men named James in the New Testament (including two apostles), but there are strong reasons for eliminating them as the author of the book of James (see for example People’s New Testament).

48-50 A.D.:
The apostle Paul is in Antioch and he writes his first letter, which we call the book of Galatians. This is during the time period of Acts 15:25-35.

Around 50 A.D.:
The Gospel of Matthew is believed to have been written sometime around 50 A.D. by the apostle Matthew (although possibly it was written a few years earlier or later). The Bible Knowledge Commentary (Walvoord and Zuck, Dallas Theological Seminary) describes a number of theories which scholars have proposed concerning the dates and sources for the “synoptic Gospels” (Matthew, Mark, and Luke), and suggests that a date somewhere around 50 A.D. for Matthew’s Gospel would satisfy all of the issues.

50-54 A.D.:
The apostle Paul writes 1 and 2 Thessalonians from Corinth (Silas and Timothy are listed as co-authors of these books. See 1 Thessalonians 1:1 and 2 Thessalonians 1:1). This is during the time period of Acts 18:1-11.

54-55 A.D.:
The apostle Paul spends roughly 3 years in Ephesus (from 53 to 55 A.D.), where he writes his second letter to the church at Corinth (his first letter to them has been lost). We call this second letter the book of 1 Corinthians (Sosthenes is listed as a co-author of this book. See 1 Corinthians 1:1). This is during the time period of Acts 19:1-41.

56-57 A.D.:
The apostle Paul writes his fourth letter to the church at Corinth from Macedonia (his third letter to them has been lost). We call this fourth letter the book of 2 Corinthians (Timothy is listed as a co-author of this book. See 2 Corinthians 1:1). This is during the time period of Acts 20:1-2.

Late winter/early spring of 57-58 A.D.:
The apostle Paul writes his letter to the Romans (Tertius is listed as the one who actually wrote this letter, so he was probably taking dictation from Paul. See Romans 16:22. Other passages indicate that Paul may have frequently dictated his letters to someone else, and that he preferred to write the concluding remarks himself. See 1 Corinthians 16:21, Galatians 6:11, Colossians 4:18, 2 Thessalonians 3:17, and Philemon 1:19, for example). This is during the time period of Acts 20:2-6.

57-59 A.D.:
The Gospel of Mark is believed to have been written during this time period. The early church fathers believed that this Gospel was written by Mark, an associate of the apostle Peter and the one who is referred to as “John, also called Mark” in Acts 12:12.

58-60 A.D.:
The Gospel of Luke is believed to have been written during this time period. Luke was a physician who sometimes traveled with the apostle Paul, and he is also the author of the book of Acts.
 
.

60-63 A.D.:
The apostle Paul is under house arrest in Rome for four years. He writes the book of Ephesians around 60 A.D., Colossians around 60-61 A.D. (Timothy is listed as a co-author of this book. See Colossians 1:1), Philippians around 61-62 A.D. (Timothy is listed as a co-author of this book. See Philippians 1:1), and Philemon around the summer of 62 A.D. (Timothy is listed as a co-author of this book. See Philemon 1:1). This is during the time period of Acts 28:14-31.

60-62 A.D.:
The book of Acts is written by Dr. Luke (see Colossians 4:14), Paul’s part-time traveling companion and the author of the Gospel of Luke.

60-65 A.D.:
The apostle John writes the books of 1, 2, and 3 John.

63-66 A.D.:
The apostle Paul writes 1 Timothy and Titus from Macedonia.

64 A.D.:
The apostle Peter writes the book of 1 Peter.

64-68 A.D.:
The apostle Peter writes the book of 2 Peter. This is the last New Testament book that Peter will write. He is believed to have been martyred in late 67 or early 68 A.D.

67 A.D.:
The apostle Paul writes 2 Timothy while imprisoned in Rome. This is the last New Testament book that Paul will write. He is believed to have been martyred in 68 A.D.

68-69 A.D.:
An unknown person writes the book of Hebrews. Some scholars believe that the apostle Paul wrote Hebrews, but the evidence that he did not write this book is very strong (for example, notice that all of the books written by Paul say that they were written by Paul, yet Hebrews is anonymous). Many other scholars believe that there is strong evidence that Barnabas wrote Hebrews. Barnabas (who is mentioned a number of times in Acts chapter 11 through chapter 15) was the apostle Paul’s traveling companion, so he would have picked up many of Paul’s phrases and expressions from hearing Paul preach so much. This may be why Hebrews sounds similar to Paul’s writings, even though it does not say that it was written by Paul (Paul’s letters all say that they were written by him) and it does not have Paul’s usual greeting.

It is interesting to note that the human authors of other books and portions of Scripture are unknown as well, such as the Old Testament books of 1 and 2 Kings, Job, Esther, and 1 and 2 Chronicles.

67-80 A.D.:
Jude writes his letter. He calls himself a brother of James. There are several men named Jude in the New Testament, but for a number of reasons many scholars believe that Jude was one of the half-brothers of Jesus.

85-95 A.D.:
The Gospel of John is believed to have been written during this time period by the apostle John.

95-96 A.D.:
The apostle John writes the book of Revelation while in exile on the island of Patmos. This is the last New Testament book that John will write. At this point he is the last surviving member of the twelve apostles and perhaps the only apostle to have died a natural death. The other ten of the original twelve apostles were martyred (not counting Judas Iscariot, who hung himself):

…

397 A.D.:
The complete New Testament canon (as we know it) is approved at the Council of Carthage (The History of Christianity, Dr. Tim Dowley, p.109). The books of Hebrews, James, 2 Peter, 2 & 3 John, and Jude are included in the canon for the first time, and other disputed books are officially excluded from the New Testament canon, such as “The Shepherd of Hermas,” “Letter of Barnabas,” “Gospel of the Hebrews,” “Revelation of Peter,” “Acts of Peter,” “Didache,” “Teaching of Twelve,” and “Apostles” (The History of Christianity, Dr. Tim Dowley, p.134-135). To learn more about the canon of Scripture and how it was created, and to learn more about many of the “disputed” books, try The Canon and Ancient Versions of Scripture.

layhands.com/WhoWroteTheNewTestament.htm
 
received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so." Acts 17:11

In other words, they interpreted the Scriptures for themselves with the help of the Holy Spirit.

“And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?” Mark 12:24

Why did Jesus chastise the Sadducees for not knowing the Scriptures if it was impossible for them to interpret them?

And why did Peter,“Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.” 2 Peter 1:20

Why does Paul instruct us to study the Bible if we can’t interpret it?

“Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.” 2 Timothy 2:15

The Bible reveals that the Holy Spirit, not a group of men, will interpret Scripture for God’s children and will help them to understand all things:

“But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.” John 14:26

“Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth…” John 16:13

The Apostle Paul recognized that the Holy Spirit was the One who taught him:

“Which things also we speak, not in the words which man’s wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.” 1 Corinthians 2:13
“Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.” 1 Corinthians 2:12

Why are Christians commanded to memorize the Scriptures if they can’ t understand them?

“Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee.” Psalm 119:11
“Keep my commandments, and live… write them upon the table of thine heart.” Proverbs 7:2-3

A warning

The following verses of Scripture should alarm anyone who believes they need a church to interpret the Bible for them:

“These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you. But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie , and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.” 1 John 2:26-27

Could God’s position be any plainer?

“But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned” (I Cor. 2:14).

I John 4:6 says: "We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

I do not say that if you do not agree with me in every detail, you are not saved, you are not a child of God. But I speak of the truth as it is in the Word of God, simple and plain, on major matters. If your heart is not open to principal truth from the Word of God, then the Spirit of God is not abiding in you and you will go on in your blindness. I will grieve about that if you do. But I hope that there is in you a love for Christ and the presence of the Holy Spirit of God so that your heart will answer honestly to the Scriptures. If it does not, then at least I have done my duty.

“For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book” (Rev. 22:18)

2nd Corinthians 11:3-4, “But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the SIMPLICITY that is in Christ. For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.”

simplicity that is in Christ.

“That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth” -Philippians 2:10

“But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.” -John 1:12-13
 
truthnlight said:
received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so." Acts 17:11
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Ahhh…the Bereans. Do you feel that they followed the “Bible Alone”? That they were sola scripturists before sola scriptura was cool?
In other words, they interpreted the Scriptures for themselves with the help of the Holy Spirit.
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Were they actually interpreting scripture as you state, or were they simply verifying what Paul had already preached to them orally?

Determining a meaning is one thing…checking a few facts is quite another.

Let’s take a closer look at the issue of the Bereans, shall we?

Berean Rejection of Sola Scriptura

If one group could be tagged as believers in sola scriptura, who would it be, the Thessalonians or the Bereans? The Thessalonians, obviously. They, like the Bereans, examined the Scriptures with Paul in the synagogue, yet they rejected his teaching. They rejected the new teaching, deciding after three weeks of deliberation that Paul’s word contradicted the Torah.

Their decision was not completely unjustified from their scriptural perspective. How could the Messiah of God be cursed by hanging on a tree like a common criminal, publicly displayed as one who bore the judgment of God? What kind of king and Messiah would that be? This seemed irreconcilable to them (see Simon J. Kistemaker, Acts [Grand Rapids, Michigan: Baker Books, 1990], 614).

When some of the Greeks and prominent citizens did accept Jesus as Messiah, the Jews became jealous—and rightfully so, from their perspective, since the new believers separated themselves from the synagogue and began meeting elsewhere, at Jason’s house. The Jews naturally considered themselves the authoritative interpreters of the Torah. Who were the Gentiles to interpret Scripture and decide important theological issues or accept additional revelation? They were the “dogs,” not the chosen custodians of the oracles of God (see William Barclay, The Acts of the Apostles [Philadelphia, Pennsylvania: Westminster Press, 1976], 128).

We can see, then, that if anyone could be classified as adherents to sola scriptura it was the Thessalonian Jews. They reasoned from the Scriptures alone and concluded that Paul’s new teaching was “unbiblical.”

The Bereans, on the other hand, were not adherents of sola scriptura, for they were willing to accept Paul’s new oral teaching as the word of God (as Paul claimed his oral teaching was; see 1 Thess. 2:13). The Bereans, before accepting the oral word of God from Paul, a tradition as even Paul himself refers to it (see 2 Thess. 2:15), examined the Scriptures to see if these things were so. They were noble-minded precisely because they “received the word with all eagerness.”

Were the Bereans commended primarily for searching the Scriptures? No. Their open-minded willingness to listen was the primary reason they are referred to as noble-minded—not that they searched the Scriptures. A perusal of grammars and commentaries makes it clear that they were “noble-minded” not for studying Scripture, but for treating Paul more civilly than did the Thessalonians—with an open mind and generous courtesy (see I. Howard Marshall, “The Acts of the Apostles” in the Tyndale New Testament Commentaries [Grand Rapids, Michigan: Eerdmans, 1981], 5:280).

The Bereans searched the Torah no less than the Thessalonians, yet they were eager to accept words of God from the mouth of Paul, in addition to what they already held to be Scripture, that is, the Law and the Prophets. Even if one claims that Paul preached the gospel and not a “tradition,” it is clear that the Bereans were accepting new revelation that was not contained in their Scriptures. These Berean Jews accepted oral teaching, the tradition of the apostles, as equal to Scripture, in addition to, and as an “extension” of, the Torah. This is further illustrated by the Christian community’s reception of Paul’s epistles as divinely inspired Scripture (see 2 Peter 3:16; here Peter seems to acknowledges Paul’s writings as equal to the “other Scriptures,” which can be presumed to refer to the Old Testament).

From Steve Ray’s article: catholic.com/thisrock/1997/9703fea3.asp

Those who followed the doctrine of sola scriptura, the Thessalonians, rejected Paul’s oral preaching and the long awaited Messiah. Those who accepted oral teaching AND scripture, the Bereans, accepted the Gospel and the Messiah.

Additionally, although both groups searched the scriptures, they came to contradictory conclusions about the Messiah. Clearly, scripture alone is insufficient to ensure proper interpretation.

Hope this helps. :tiphat:
 
The Sadducees had a limited canon of only the five books of Moses as I recall. So, Jesus is telling them off for not searching the rest of scripture, the history books, prophets, writings, etc.,

Clearly, catholics do recognise the importance of scriptrue. And, I think that is all you have demonstrated, that the early church had a high view of the Old Testament.

I am not sure how to answer the rest of your post, nor am I sure how to respond the the next two articles, So I will leave that to others. Jesus showed some support for some of the Jewish traditions by celebrating the festival of lights. “I am the light”. But, Jesus hated those traditions that were contray to God’s word.

What did the Early Church believe about the authority of Scripture? (sola Scriptura)
christiananswers.net/q-eden/sola-scriptura-earlychurch.html

Bible on sola scriptura
christiananswers.net/q-eden/sola-scriptura-bible.html
 
hi everybody! as you can see from my sig, i was raised a protestant. to be more specific, i was raised in the Church of Christ. the name comes from the greek, meaning Christ’s church (greeks would say ‘car of bob’ instead of ‘bob’s car’ like we do in english). anyways, each congregation is autonomous from all other congregations and are headed by at least 2 elders, with a couple deacons and a minister/preacher (can’t call him a pastor, that’s a sin). i was taught strictly “bible only”. we were the “one true church” because we tried “to be just like the first century chuch”; even though we had hymnals, worshipped in a church building as opposed to homes and didn’t believe in spiritual/supernatural miracles even though the book of acts (first century chuch) is replete with them.
i asked my father one time (uh oh, i called a man father…) when i was a kid about the traditions paul had talked about. i was told that there was no way to know what those traditions are because they were lost to history. i still haven’t looked into it yet, but i plan to try a find out what those traditions are (if it’s possible.).
anyways (again), being raised protestant, sola scriptura was just pounded into my head. the general attitude is "if you can’t show it to me in the bible (protestant one), then you can’t prove it. hope this helps those of you who haven’t experienced the protestant faith. please bear in mind that this is my own personal experience, and not meant to be an insight into all protestant minds.
 
truthnlight said:
And why did Peter,“Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.” 2 Peter 1:20
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It is odd that you quote this verse since Peter specifically points out that scripture is not a matter of personal interpretation. Your own error here proves him right.
Why does Paul instruct us to study the Bible if we can’t interpret it?

“Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.” 2 Timothy 2:15
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Ignorance of scripture is ignorance of Christ. However, even heretics know the words; what they lack is the proper meaning. So, we study the scriptures to learn the words and we submit our understanding (when it is not plain) to the Church.
The Bible reveals that the Holy Spirit, not a group of men, will interpret Scripture for God’s children and will help them to understand all things:

“But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.” John 14:26

“Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth…” John 16:13
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Were these words spoken on a hillside in front of thousands? No. How many people were in the room when Jesus made these promises? Eleven. The Apostles and first Bishops of what would become known as the Magisterium of the Catholic Church.
The Apostle Paul recognized that the Holy Spirit was the One who taught him:

“Which things also we speak, not in the words which man’s wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.” 1 Corinthians 2:13

“Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.” 1 Corinthians 2:12
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The Holy Spirit does teach us and guide us. However, unlike the Apostles, we have not been promised that we will be infallible in our understanding. He does not speak error, of course, but we may not be clear on what we have heard. Our sinful nature gets in the way.
Why are Christians commanded to memorize the Scriptures if they can’ t understand them?

“Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee.” Psalm 119:11

“Keep my commandments, and live… write them upon the table of thine heart.” Proverbs 7:2-3
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See above.
A warning

The following verses of Scripture should alarm anyone who believes they need a church to interpret the Bible for them:

“These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you. But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie , and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.” 1 John 2:26-27

Could God’s position be any plainer?
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I kinda think Paul would have been disappointed if Timothy or the Romans or the Corinthians, etc had not listened carefully to what he, Paul, a mere man had taught them. He wrote:


  1. *]2 Thessalonians 2:15
    So then, brothers, stand firm and hold to the teachings we passed on to you, whether by word of mouth or by letter.
    *]2 Thessalonians 3:6
    *Warning Against Idleness *] In the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, we command you, brothers, to keep away from every brother who is idle and does not live according to the teaching you received from us.
    And there are dozens of verses like this. Could it be any plainer?
    I do not say that if you do not agree with me in every detail, you are not saved, you are not a child of God. But I speak of the truth as it is in the Word of God, simple and plain, on major matters. If your heart is not open to principal truth from the Word of God, then the Spirit of God is not abiding in you and you will go on in your blindness. I will grieve about that if you do. But I hope that there is in you a love for Christ and the presence of the Holy Spirit of God so that your heart will answer honestly to the Scriptures. If it does not, then at least I have done my duty.
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    Are you infallible? Why should I accept your fallible interpretation of the Bible instead of that of the Church that Christ Himself established?

    And why do you have the right to state that my interpretation is incorrect? Am I not allowed to interpret these verses for myself? What makes your fallible interpretation any better than mine?
 
guardian1 said:
anyways (again), being raised protestant, sola scriptura was just pounded into my head. the general attitude is "if you can’t show it to me in the bible (protestant one), then you can’t prove it.
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Using this logic, can you show me where in the Bible it says that everything has to be proved from the Bible?

I can save you some time…you won’t find a verse that says that.

If sola scriptura is not in the Bible, then it is an unscriptural “tradition of men”, isn’t it? Worse, it is anti-Biblical, since the Bible clear tells us to “hold fast to the traditions”. (2 Thessalonians 2:15)

Jesus rightly condemned corrupt traditions that set aside the Word of God. Men have wrongly used His words to condemn the Word of God contained in Tradition.

Hope this helps. :tiphat:
 
What is getting lost in this discussion is that Paul’s letters (epistles), and that of others, are corrective to a particular Christian community that has gone errant in some fashion.

Where does the NT contain that which is right and non-errant daily liturgical practice? It doesn’t: it was known in the community and passed orally and by tradition.

Hence the RCC’s (and Orthodox) practice of Scripture, Apostolic Tradition and Magisterium (teaching authority). Those familiar with engineering understand that a tripod (the RCC) is far more stable than a pogo stick (reformation-based Protestants who follow the pogo stick of sola scriptura or sola fide).

So why did they give up the “tripod”? Because without giving it up, they had no basis for schisming from the RCC.

Now, if we can only get them off the pogo stick long enough for their brains to stop rattling, we can return them to the fold of the one church, the kata holos church that Jesus established and the apostles and disciples preached.
 
Ephesians 2:20 (New International Version)
built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone.

I think we all can agree that his verse means that the church rests on the foundation of the apostles, prophets and Jesus, right?

Where does this verse say the church is founded on the bible alone?

Read the chapter for context
 
Randy_Carson said:
The Early Church Fathers were anything but sola scripturists.

ewtn.com/library/SCRIPTUR/SOLASCRI.TXT

Hope this helps. :tiphat:
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Mat.7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and
Code: 
few
there be that find it.

21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22
Many
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will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Colossians 2:8 Paul warned,

Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ.

We do not need the “teaching of the ages” (the tradition of men) to understand the Word of God. The Holy Spirit is all we need to understand the Word of God. 1 John 2:26-27 says,

These things I have written to you concerning those who try to deceive you. But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you will abide in Him.

But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you know all things. I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth. (1 John 2:20-21)

2 Timothy 3:16-17 says,

All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.

1 John. 2:4He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
 
truthnlight said:
2 Timothy 3:16-17 says,

All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.
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Having the equipment is one thing; having the training you need to use it properly is quite another.

If you back up two verses you read the following:

2 Timothy 3:14-15
14But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have become convinced of, because you know those from whom you learned it, 15and how from infancy you have known the holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus.

Let’s take another look at those verses with the meaning inserted in read:

14But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have become convinced of [by means of Paul’s oral instruction which we now call Tradition], because you know those from whom you learned it [those men of God who were the leaders of the early Church who formed what we now call the Magisterium], 15and how from infancy you have known the holy Scriptures [which in Timothy’s youth would have been the Old Testament only], which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus.

So, in this passage. we find Tradition + Scripture + Magisterium working in harmony.

Just as the Catholic Church has said all along. :tiphat:
 
truthnlight said:
We do not need the “teaching of the ages” (the tradition of men) to understand the Word of God. The Holy Spirit is all we need to understand the Word of God.
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Acts 2:42
42They devoted themselves to the apostles’ teaching and to the fellowship, to the breaking of bread and to prayer.

I’m curious…why did the believers devote themselves to the Apostles’ teaching after receiving the Holy Spirit on the day of Pentecost?
 
Randy_Carson said:
Acts 2:42
42They devoted themselves to the apostles’ teaching and to the fellowship, to the breaking of bread and to prayer.

I’m curious…why did the believers devote themselves to the Apostles’ teaching after receiving the Holy Spirit on the day of Pentecost?
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1 Corinthians 2:2 Paul wrote,

For I determined not to know anything among you except Jesus Christ and Him crucified.

What did Paul mean by this statement? That he didn’t teach on other matters of Scripture other than the character and actions of Christ (like what is found in Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John) and the fact of His crucifixion? No. Paul taught the whole counsel of God (Acts. 20:27). In 1 Corinthians 2:2 Paul is not saying that he didn’t teach the whole council of God. Actually, his statement means that he did teach the whole counsel of God, because Christ (the Word, John 1:1, 14; Revelation 19:14; Hebrews 4:12-13) is the whole counsel of God. He is the Word of the living God. So, what Paul was basically pointing out here is that the knowledge he let out of his lips was the knowledge of the Scripture (Christ), and Him crucified. The wisdom of this world he determined not to know (1 Corinthians 3:19).

Paul didn’t come along with a bunch of great worldly wisdom. He says, “For I determined not to know anything among you except Jesus Christ and Him crucified.” Appeals to the wisdom of this world (like psychology) or wanting to bring any worldly wisdom in to help out on how to deal with living this life before God and ways that please Him, or how to deal with sin, or demented minds (Romans 1:28), etc., identifies a man as a false teacher, as antichrist (Colossians 2:8-10; 2 John 7). Because, Jesus Christ has come in the flesh (2 John 9). He took on the same kind of flesh as we have (Hebrews 2:14). He suffered in this flesh and was tempted as we are (Hebrews 2:18). He learned obedience through suffering (Hebrews 5:8). He even feared God as we ought (Hebrews 5:7).

Acts2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
2: 42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles’ DOCTRINE and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers

43 And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done by the apostles.
44 And all that believed were together, and had all things common;
45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need.
46 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,
47 Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. (2 John 9)

Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able. (Luke 13:24)

1Peter4:017 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
4:018 And if the righteous (scarcely be saved), where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?
4:019 Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.

2John001:009 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

001:010 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed

John 10:27My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.

Isaiah 5:20Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil; who put darkness for light, and light for darkness
 
Yes, Jesus condemed human traditions that were contray to the word of God. But, the catholic position is that the traditions passed down are part of the apostolic teachings and thus are part of the word of God. The apostles wrote books, but they also taught orally too.

Where does it say that those teachings of Paul, Peter, John are “traditions of men” ?

Where can one document ( give examples ) of oral teachings of Paul, Peter and John that have clearly without doubt been passed down from them through the church, throught the church fathers?

👍
 
truthnlight said:
1 Corinthians 2:2 Paul wrote,
Click to expand...
For I determined not to know anything among you except Jesus Christ and Him crucified.BUUUUUUZZZ!

I’m sorry. That’s not the answer we were looking for. :nope:

In a nutshell:
  1. The Holy Spirit works in individuals by calling them to recognize and repent of their sins.
  2. The Apostles were given unique gifts of the Spirit, i.e., the ability to work miracles, as proof of their divine mandate.
  3. Not everyone gets the same gifts or the same degree of the Spirit’s presence.
  4. The same Spirit is present in those who teach and those who learn of the faith. That is how a person is able to respond to the truth via the Holy Spirit; he must be instructed and the Spirit enables him to understand and accept the teachings. But He doesn’t just zap the truth into our heads and hearts. All He does is ready us to receive God’s truth.
  5. The result of the Holy Spirit’s infusion into the soul after baptism is to draw them into the Church, the body of believers, and transform them into unselfish Christians.
Now, as to infallibility. We know that Christ promised in Matthew 16 that Peter would be given the keys. In order for the keeper of the keys to do God’s Will, he had to be protected from teaching error in a special (meaning divine) way. So, too, would those in authority need a similar type of protection, otherwise doctrinal error could enter the deposit of faith. Christ promised them that the Holy Spirit would guide them in all truth as His duly appointed teachers. Was everyone in the early Church similarly enabled to teach? Not according to the Bible. Even Paul was not accepted as an authoritative teacher in the Church until the other Apostles accepted him. His letters warn of false teachers and alien gospels, which were rampant during his time and still are.

As for the pope, he enjoys primacy and the charism of infallibility by virtue of his office. The first Vatican Council, in which the dogma of papal infallibility was formally defined, used as evidence that the successor of Peter was unique from the Apostles a passage from Luke’s Gospel: [Christ said:]Simon, Simon, behold, Satan has desired to have you (plural, referring to all the Apostles), that he may sift you as wheat. But I have prayed for thee (singular, referring only to Peter), that your faith may not fail, and do thou, when once thou has turned again, strengthen thy brethren."

To sum up:
  1. The Holy Spirit was promised to the Apostles in a special way to protect their teaching from error.
  2. Peter was given the keys and also promised that divine guidance.
  3. Christ prayed for Peter in a particular way that he would be able to sustain his faith and that of his Apostolic brethren.
The Bible explicitly teaches that there is one Spirit but many gifts, that not all members of the Church are equal in authority, and that the Church has governance in all matters of faith and morals by virtue of the Spirit’s protection. Just remember, it’s also in the Bible that the general Christian body did not have the same ability as the leadership(1Cor. 12:27-29, Acts 5:12-13).

Hope this helps. :tiphat:
 
“My sheep hear my voice, and I know them,
and they follow me” John 10:27.

SCRIPTURE ALONE IS INSPIRED AND INHERENTLY AUTHORITATIVE.

The Biblical message breathed out by God is revelation in written form. (2 Timothy 3:15-16). The Biblical claim is that what God has inspired was His written word (2 Peter 1:20-21). When the Lord Jesus Christ said, “the Scripture cannot be broken” (John 10:35), He was speaking of God’s written word. The events, actions, commandments, and truths from God are given to us in propositional, i.e. logical, written sentences. God’s declaration in Scripture is that it and it alone, is this final authority in all matters of faith and morals. Thus there is only one written source from God, and there is only one basis of truth for the Lord’s people in the Church.

THE TRUTH AND THE SCRIPTURE

The Lord Jesus Christ, in His great high priestly prayer, declared clearly the truth of God’s Word. He said, “Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.” This was consistent with the declarations right through the Old Testament in which the Holy Spirit continually proclaims that the revelation from God is truth, as for example Psalm 119:142, “thy law is truth.” The Lord Himself therefore identified truth with the written Word. There is no source other than to Scripture alone to which such a statement applies. That source alone, the Holy Scripture, is the believer’s standard of truth.

In the New Testament, it is the written word of God and that alone to which the Lord Jesus Christ and His apostles refer as the final authority. In the temptation, the Lord Jesus three times resisted Satan, saying, “It is written” as for example, in Matthew 4:4, “he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.” In stating “It is written,” the Lord used the exact same phrase that is used in the Holy Bible forty six times. The persistence of the repeated phrase underlines its importance. The Lord’s total acceptance of the authority of the Old Testament is evident in His words found in Matthew 5:17-18, “Think not that I came to destroy the law or the prophets: I am not come to destroy but to fulfil. For verily, I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law till all be fulfilled.”
 
-]As for the pope, he enjoys primacy and the charism of infallibility by virtue of his office. The first Vatican Council, in which the dogma of papal infallibility was formally defined, used as evidence that the successor of Peter was unique from the Apostles a passage from Luke’s Gospel: [Christ said:]Simon, Simon, behold, Satan has desired to have you (plural, referring to all the Apostles), that he may sift you as wheat. But I have prayed for thee (singular, referring only to Peter), that your faith may not fail, and do thou, when once thou has turned again, strengthen thy brethren."/-]

To sum up:
  1. The Holy Spirit was promised to the Apostles in a special way to protect their teaching from error.
  2. Peter was given the keys and also promised that divine guidance.
  3. Christ prayed for Peter in a particular way that he would be able to sustain his faith and that of his Apostolic brethren.
The Bible explicitly teaches that there is one Spirit but many gifts, that not all members of the Church are equal in authority, and that the Church has governance in all matters of faith and morals by virtue of the Spirit’s protection. Just remember, it’s also in the Bible that the general Christian body did not have the same ability as the leadership(1Cor. 12:27-29, Acts 5:12-13).

Hope this helps. :tiphat:

OTHER SOURCES OF AUTHORITY CONDEMNED

Furthermore, in refuting the errors of the Sadducees, the Scripture records the Lord saying, “Ye do err, not knowing the Scriptures nor the power of God” (Matthew 22:29). Christ Jesus continually castigated and rebuked the Pharisees because they made their tradition on a par with the Word of God. He condemned them because they were attempting to corrupt the very basis of truth by equating their traditions to the Word of God. So He declared to them in Mark 7:13 “[You are] making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such things do ye.” Since Scripture alone is inspired, it alone is the ultimate authority¾ and it alone is the final judge of Tradition.

The Word of the Lord says as a commandment in Proverbs 30:5,6 “Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him. Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar.” God commands that we are not to add to His Word: this command shows emphatically that it is God’s Word alone that is pure and uncontaminated. Aligned with Proverbs, the Lord’s strong, clear declaration in Isaiah 8:20 is: “To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.” The truth is this: since God’s written word alone is inspired, it and it alone is the sole rule of faith. It cannot be otherwise.

THE EXPRESSION “SOLA SCRIPTURA”

From the time of the giving of the Decalogue on Mt. Sinai, when Holy God wrote with His finger on the tablets of stone (Exodus 31:18), until this present day, the written word of God has been extant in the world. The term “sola Scriptura” or “the Bible alone” as the measure of truth is short hand, as it were, for the emphatic and repeated statements of Scripture and of the commandment of God. The very phrase " It is written" means exclusively transcribed, and not hearsay. The command to believe what is written means to believe only the pure word of God. It separates from all other sources the corpus what a man is to believe. What is at stake before the All Holy God is His incorruptible truth.

In the very last commandment in the Bible God resolutely tells us not to add to nor take away from His Word.

For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book: If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the Book of Life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book" (Revelation 22:18-19)
His Word is absolutely sufficient in itself. (Psalm 119:160)
 
As for the pope, he enjoys primacy and the charism of infallibility by virtue of his office. The first Vatican Council, in which the dogma of papal infallibility was formally defined, used as evidence that the successor of Peter was unique from the Apostles a passage from Luke’s Gospel: [Christ said:]Simon, Simon, behold, Satan has desired to have you (plural, referring to all the Apostles), that he may sift you as wheat. But I have prayed for thee (singular, referring only to Peter), that your faith may not fail, and do thou, when once thou has turned again, strengthen thy brethren."

To sum up:
  1. The Holy Spirit was promised to the Apostles in a special way to protect their teaching from error.
  2. Peter was given the keys and also promised that divine guidance.
  3. Christ prayed for Peter in a particular way that he would be able to sustain his faith and that of his Apostolic brethren.
The Bible explicitly teaches that there is one Spirit but many gifts, that not all members of the Church are equal in authority, and that the Church has governance in all matters of faith and morals by virtue of the Spirit’s protection. Just remember, it’s also in the Bible that the general Christian body did not have the same ability as the leadership(1Cor. 12:27-29, Acts 5:12-13).

Hope this helps. :tiphat:

THE EXPRESSION “SOLA SCRIPTURA”

From the time of the giving of the Decalogue on Mt. Sinai, when Holy God wrote with His finger on the tablets of stone (Exodus 31:18), until this present day, the written word of God has been extant in the world. The term “sola Scriptura” or “the Bible alone” as the measure of truth is short hand, as it were, for the emphatic and repeated statements of Scripture and of the commandment of God. The very phrase " It is written" means exclusively transcribed, and not hearsay. The command to believe what is written means to believe only the pure word of God. It separates from all other sources the corpus what a man is to believe. What is at stake before the All Holy God is His incorruptible truth.

In the very last commandment in the Bible God resolutely tells us not to add to nor take away from His Word.

For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book: If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the Book of Life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book" (Revelation 22:18-19)
His Word is absolutely sufficient in itself. (Psalm 119:160)
 
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