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Michael68
Guest
Can any Protestant show one scripture that says we are to follow the bible alone as final authority?
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Padres1969
Guest
Considering there was no bible until after all of it had been written and compiled you’d be hard pressed to.
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chero23
Guest
Exactly, but that is a strong Protestant argument
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Padres1969
Guest
Well you can make the same argument the other way. Where is the biblical support for tradition in churches like the Catholic and Anglican?
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Seekerjn316
Guest
Most of Holy Scripture was already in place existence before any organization declared “canon”. That most of what is called New Testament was circulated and " canonized" long before Nicea, or any other council was convened by a “heretic” who had collected anlRge portion of Paul’s writing as early as second century.
While I am not a sola scriptura adherant, the claims of the church of Rome concerning scripture isn’t necessarily correct.
While I am not a sola scriptura adherant, the claims of the church of Rome concerning scripture isn’t necessarily correct.
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eazyduzit
Guest
Here is one scripture.
Pr.30:5,6
Every word of God is pure:He is a shield unto them that put their trust in Him.
Add thou not unto His words, lest He reprove thee, and thou be found a liar.
I would surely not want to be found a liar.
Pr.30:5,6
Every word of God is pure:He is a shield unto them that put their trust in Him.
Add thou not unto His words, lest He reprove thee, and thou be found a liar.
I would surely not want to be found a liar.
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cath4alltime
Guest
It’s a great Scripture verse but doesn’t answer the OP
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pablope
Guest
Except this particular passage was first in oral form befor it came into the written form.Here is one scripture.
Pr.30:5,6
Every word of God is pure:He is a shield unto them that put their trust in Him.
Add thou not unto His words, lest He reprove thee, and thou be found a liar.
I would surely not want to be found a liar.
Besides…where does “word of God” in this passage that it says it is strictly the written word?
It could also refer to the Eucharist…for all you know…
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frangiuliano115
Guest
The passage says that we are to put our trust in HIM.Except this particular passage was first in oral form befor it came into the written form.
Besides…where does “word of God” in this passage that it says it is strictly the written word?
It could also refer to the Eucharist…for all you know…
I’m catholic and have been here at CAF since July. I’m starting to wonder what we put our faith in. Jesus or doctrine?
You’re going to answer both. It can’t be both. I’m either trusting the Lord to get me to heaven or I’m trusting in my understanding of doctrine - which is equivalent to trusting in myself.
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Cathoholic
Guest
eazyduzit.
You quoted . . . .
QUOTE: Pr.30:5,6
Every word of God is pure . . .
Every word of God IS pure.
But how in the world do you get sola Scriptura from THAT quote?
God bless.
Cathoholic
You quoted . . . .
QUOTE: Pr.30:5,6
Every word of God is pure . . .
Every word of God IS pure.
But how in the world do you get sola Scriptura from THAT quote?
God bless.
Cathoholic
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chero23
Guest
2 Thessalonians 2:15
Paul tells them to stand firm to the traditions by which he and the apostles have taught them.
The Catholic Church is the only church that can trace itself back to the apostles. (Christian church that’s is)
You don’t, quite frankly.
OTOH…
He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?” 16Simon Peter replied, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” 17And Jesus answered him, “Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah! For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father who is in heaven. 18And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rockb I will build my church, and the gates of hellc shall not prevail against it. 19I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosedd in heaven.” 20Then he strictly charged the disciples to tell no one that he was the Christ.
…how do you get universal ordinary and immediate jurisdiction over the entire Church on Earth from this?
Jon
Michael,
Why do you believe that this principle, "that the sole rule and standard according to which all dogmas together with [all] teachers should be estimated and judged are the prophetic and apostolic Scriptures of the Old and of the New Testament alone" would be or even must be explicit in scripture?
The quote in my sentence comes for the Epitome of the Formula of Concord. Note that it gives the purpose of this principle: to hold dogma, doctrines, teachings, teachers accountable.
I guess my question is do you think the Catholic Church violates this principle in any of it’s teachings?
Jon
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Seekerjn316
Guest
Except for the Orthodox, Orientals, Syriac (sp) and any other group that claimed independence from Rome or Constantinople …if by “only” you mean" all these others too" then “only” no longer means “only”…your statement is simply not true. Why state what you know is not true?
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Johnny31897
Guest
Hey Jon,
Since Catholics don’t believe in Sola Scriptura, we’re not required to prove the authority of the Church from a verse of Scripture alone.
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SalusaSecondus
Guest
Sure.
“All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.”
Is teaching correct doctrine a good work? If so then I can be complete to use all scripture to teach correct doctrine.
And yet that is exactly where the authority of the Church to teach is found. It is where we find Christ’s presentation of the Keys. Without those words once spoken then written, knowing that authority would be difficult.
Jon
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JohnGerard
Guest
Hey Fran.
Others may not, but you are right…I’m gonna answer both.
Why can’t we trust the Lord to get us to Heaven by trusting that He left us with correct doctrine and His Church to guide us? Why do you think it is either trust in the Lord or trust in myself?
I mean, of course we must place our faith/belief in Christ…we cannot be saved without that. But doesn’t that faith have an element of obedience to it as well?
Matthew 28:19-20: “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me…go therefore…teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you;…”
Hebrews 5:9: “…and being made perfect He became the source of eternal salvation to all who obey Him…”
It seems like to observe what He commands and to obey Him is to live as He taught…which is taught to us as…doctrine.
Isn’t it?
Orthodoxy (right teaching) and orthopraxy (right practice) are given to us by His Church. To trust in those is to trust in Him. Isn’t it?
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Michael68
Guest
No, i don’t believe the bible, OT or NT, is the sole authority. Paul told Timothy to hold firm to their teachings whether by letter or word of mouth. The NT is a Catholic tradition
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Michael68
Guest
This verse does not say bible alone. All it says is the bible is good for instruction. It does not say the bible is final authority
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