Bible and Alcohol

[mkarzon]

Here’s some more quotes, that distinguish wine between grape juice. I’ve put my comments in ():

Num 6:3 - he shall separate himself from wine and strong drink; he shall drink no vinegar made from wine or strong drink, and shall not drink any juice of grapes or eat grapes, fresh or dried

Ps 104:14-15 - Thou dost cause the grass to grow for the cattle, and plants for man to cultivate, that he may bring forth food from the earth, and wine to gladden the heart of man, oil to make his face shine, and bread to strengthen man’s heart. (I’ve never heard of grape juice gladdening the heart of man, unless it was Mr. Welch.)

Sirach 31:27-31 - Wine is like life to men, if you drink it in moderation. What is life to a man who is without wine? It has been created to make men glad. Wine drunk in season and temperately is rejoicing of heart and gladness of soul. Wine drunk to excess is bitterness of soul, with provocation and stumbling. Drunkenness increases the anger of a fool to his injury, reducing his strength and adding wounds. Do not reprove your neighbor at a banquet of wine, and do not despise him in his merrymaking; speak no word of reproach to him, and do not afflict him by making demands
of him. (If this is called apocrypha, you could use it to start a later discussion about who has the authority to decide “what is scripture”.)

Matt 9:17 - Neither is new wine put into old wineskins; if it is, the skins burst, and the wine is spilled, and the skins are destroyed; but new wine is put into fresh wineskins, and so both are preserved. (The reason that the old skin would burst was because of fermentation.)

 

[DallasCatholic]

After debating a point for some time he came up with a “new argument”:

Any comments?

Gandalf,
I fear that you are spinning your wheels here as I am sure your friend will shift to another arguement once you refute this one. But…I am a sucker for a good arguement…so:

I would first chastise your friend for not thinking for himself and just taking stuff off of the Internet instead of formulating his own arguements. See the following website:
jesus-messiah.com/html/drinking-wine.html
Specifically look at the paragraph headed “Jesus drank wine and turned water into wine:”

Seems remarkably similar to his “arguement” doesn’t it?

If you read from the same page the part entitled “The Lord’s Passover” you will see that this Pastor admits that the Jews drank wine during Passover. So using your friend’s own source I would point out the following:

The Last Supper was a Passover meal.
During the Last Supper Jesus took the chalice (or cup) and said:
Mark Chapter 14 verses 24 - 25 (RSV)
"And he said to them, “This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many. Truly, I say to you, I shall not drink again of the fruit of the vine until that day when I drink it new in the kingdom of God”

So based on your friends own source document which states that the Jews had no method of preserving grape juice until Passover, and acknowledges that “fruit of the vine” refers to wine we know that Jesus drank wine and that he instructs his Apostles to do so…just look in 1 Corinthians Chapter 11 verses 23 - 26 (RSV). Case closed.

 

[deb1]

Here’s some more quotes, that distinguish wine between grape juice. I’ve put my comments in ():

Num 6:3 - he shall separate himself from wine and strong drink; he shall drink no vinegar made from wine or strong drink, and shall not drink any juice of grapes or eat grapes, fresh or dried

.)

This quote is concering the Nazerite vow. For a period of time the person could eat nothing from grapes not even raisens. OF courses that still doesn’t mean that grape juice would be available beyond a very short time frame ,which might be why the vow was so specific about any grape product.

I’m mentioning this point because I have heard some fundamentalists try and use these as a reason not to drink alcohol. Of course reading the verse in context shows a different meaning then what they believe.

 

[deb1]

After debating a point for some time he came up with a “new argument”:

Any comments?

Gandalf please look up the verses that he quotes and read them in context. What you will find is that there were a lot of stipulations on priest when it was their time to attend to their temple duties. If his arguement is that priest could not drink alcohol at certain times and because we are the physically God’s temple so we therefore should not drink alcohol ever, then he is going to have to follow ALL the laws that priests had to keep. That includes type of dress and, I think, not having sex for a period of time.

Priests were allowed to drink alcohol when they were not attending to their temple duties.

Always look up the verses that a sola scriptura protestant tries to throw at you. It is amazing how simple some of their arguements are when you read the text as a whole.

 

[lak611]

Ecc 9:7

(ASV) Go thy way, eat thy bread with joy, and drink thy wine with a merry heart; for God hath already accepted thy works.

(DRB) Go then, and eat thy bread with joy, and drink thy wine with gladness: because thy works please God.

(ESV) Go, eat your bread with joy, and drink your wine with a merry heart, for God has already approved what you do.

(KJV) Go thy way, eat thy bread with joy, and drink thy wine with a merry heart; for God now accepteth thy works.

(MKJV) Go, eat your bread with joy, and drink your wine with a merry heart; for God now is pleased with your works.

(MSG) Seize life! Eat bread with gusto, Drink wine with a robust heart. Oh yes–God takes pleasure in your pleasure!

(NAS77) Go then, eat your bread in happiness, and drink your wine with a cheerful heart; for God has already approved your works.

(NASB) Go then, eat your bread in happiness and drink your wine with a cheerful heart; for God has already approved your works.

(NET) Life is Brief, so Cherish its Joys

Go, eat your food21 with joy,
and drink your wine with a happy heart,
because God has already approved your works.

(RV) Go thy way, eat thy bread with joy, and drink thy wine with a merry heart; for God hath already accepted thy works.

 

[GandalfTheWhite]

Gandalf please look up the verses that he quotes and read them in context. What you will find is that there were a lot of stipulations on priest when it was their time to attend to their temple duties. If his arguement is that priest could not drink alcohol at certain times and because we are the physically God’s temple so we therefore should not drink alcohol ever, then he is going to have to follow ALL the laws that priests had to keep. That includes type of dress and, I think, not having sex for a period of time.

Thank you, that’s an excellent argument. Now, could someone please list all regulations that priests had to follow (and if you have referrences that would be excellent!)

 

[Thing]

God put alcohol in milk => alcohol is not bad/evil/sinful.
I Leatherman:

Alkylglycerols are naturally occurring esters, which are chemicals formed by the combination of a fatty acid and an alcohol molecule .

Alkylglycerols occur naturally in mother’s milk. There are ten times more alkylglycerols in human milk than in cow’s milk.