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PJM
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Who can understand and or interpet the bible as GOD whats it done?
What’s you’re evidence?
What’s you’re evidence?
Bible interpretation: Who can do it ........ correctly? (Edited Title for clarity)
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PJM
Guest
CUTE
I know my position; I’m interestered in what others think AND WHY?
God Bless you!
Pat
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jcrichton
Guest
…a long time ago in a far far far town lived a boy that at age 12 visited the Temple and engaged the most learned religious found at the Temple; He returned home where He lived with His Mom and Dad; breaking all expectations He began His Minitry choosing twelve other Jewish men; He Revealed Himself as the Son of God: the Resurrection and Life and as the New Covenant (in His Blood) that Yahweh God would endorse at the foot of the Cross; just before His Sacrificial Offering, He fulfilled the Passover by establishing Twelve Priests that would lead His Church (one of them was a nonBeliever who chose his own path rather than to follow the Master and ended up assisting the Suffering Servant’s Cause)–as He promised, He Rose again on the first day of the week, Sunday (which became affectionately known as “the Lord’s Day”) and revisited the Twelve (by now Eleven–as the prophesied traitor committed seppuku) in order to restore the path of the recently established Church (Simon = Kephas = rock where I will build my Church); He Breathed on them the Holy Spirit and gave them their working papers (Delegation of Priesthood Duties–Go, Teach, Baptize in the Name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit {yeah, He was fully aware that there were Three Persons but only One Divinity, hense the Name}).
Jesus’ only established Church is His Mystical Body: translation: not even hell will previel against Christ’s Church!
Maran atha!
Angel
PS: …not many seem to recall that Jesus also promised that another Paraclete would come in His Name to Teach, Guide, and Reveal the Total Truth to the Church… she does not work alone, just check both secular and Church history (I would start with the compilation of the Books (Sacred Writings) known as the Bible; then I would check the historical accounts of life before and after the Church (it’s easy to check even with present day accounts: no Church is congruent to absence of civil rights and liberties).
PPS: …I would also check against the fallacy that the Church is the cause of evil/oppression; just compare how many millions have been killed, nay murdered by the various secularist (I include non-Christian religions) movements throughout the world!
Maran atha!
Angel
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Defender1
Guest
Christ gave the church authority to interpret the Bible in Matt 16 and 18 . You see the first church leaders under the authority of Christ were the apostles (the first Bishops ) "Whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven . Please turn to Acts of the Apostles chapter 8 :30-31 "Philip ran up and heard him reading Isaiah the prophet and said "Do you you understand what you are reading ?"He replied "how can I ,unless someone instructs me ? " Philip then instructed him in so many words of course . Philip was a Church leader under the authority of Christ and the very church he was building in Matt 16 . This of course would be the scripture evidence of what God means in the bible . For evidence as to whether the stories are true or not ,plenty of Archeologists and pagan historian writings (because they wouldn’t be biased towards Christians) can verify that the stories are true .
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TimothyH
Guest
Anyone can interpret and understand the Bible. Many do so exactly as God wants them to every day. Many however, do not, especially those who read the Bible absent the light of Catholic teaching.
My evidence is all the cloistered monks and nuns who prayerfully read scripture every day and are given great understanding of the word of God.
I submit myself as evidence as well. I read the Bible daily and am sure that God has revealed some, if not much of it, exactly as he want’s me to understand it. I am also sure that the accuracy of much of that understanding and interpretation was only possible in so far as the Bible was read in light of Catholic teaching.
I’m also 100% positive that I have botched large sections of scripture.
-Tim-
My evidence is all the cloistered monks and nuns who prayerfully read scripture every day and are given great understanding of the word of God.
I submit myself as evidence as well. I read the Bible daily and am sure that God has revealed some, if not much of it, exactly as he want’s me to understand it. I am also sure that the accuracy of much of that understanding and interpretation was only possible in so far as the Bible was read in light of Catholic teaching.
I’m also 100% positive that I have botched large sections of scripture.
-Tim-
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john_aurelius
Guest
If you can read a book then you can read scripture
If you can critically examine a book then likewise
To interpret correctly a person should try to get to the sense as closely as is possible from the authors point of view, this includes both the human and divine authors.
To see if you’ve done this correctly you can compare what you have discovered with what other people have written down.
If you can critically examine a book then likewise
To interpret correctly a person should try to get to the sense as closely as is possible from the authors point of view, this includes both the human and divine authors.
To see if you’ve done this correctly you can compare what you have discovered with what other people have written down.
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Little_One0307
Guest
The Holy Magisterium of the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church. Why? See CCC that refers to the Magesterium of said Church in Part I.
God bless.
God bless.
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PJM
Guest
Angel, well done. THANK YOU.
I do however take exception to two expressed views.
- "Jesus’ only established Church is His Mystical Body: translation: not even hell will previel against Christ’s Church!"
- "PS: …not many seem to recall that Jesus also promised that another Paraclete would come in His Name to Teach, Guide, and Reveal the Total Truth to the Church… she does not work alone",
I greatly injoyed reading your discourse. But, did I miss where you answered the OPQ?
God Bless you,
Pat
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PJM
Guest
Thanks for a great RESPONCE,
God Bless,
Pat
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jcrichton
Guest
Hi, Pat!
I concur with you, the Church cannot sin; she is guided by the Holy Spirit, the Third Person of God. Yet, as you pointed out, her members, being human, can and often do fail Christ’s Commission (‘be Perfect/One’) and sin.
The Mystical Body of Christ, when in adherance to the Vine, cannot sin; the problem is that we, I perhaps the biggest, are fools who turn to Yahweh God mostly in desperation and follow our own path when it suits us.
I may not have expressed myself clearly; the reference “she” meant to refer to the Church.
Though it is true that God being Spirit and the Holy Spirit also being Spirit are gender nuetral, the revelation of the Pensonhood of God do slant to a male gender which I respect and follow–I will never call the Father or the Holy Spirit anything but what is reveal in Scriptures: God as the Father (male) and as the Son (male), and the Holy Spirit, Him being the Giver of Life (male).
Perhaps I was taken aback with the question from someone who professes to be Catholic; so I try to play with cultural references–and I was hoping that my little story would bring to mind the origins of the Church to whom Christ delegated His Authority–since He promised the Holy Spirit to Guide and Instruct the Church, it is the Church (only one founded by Christ) that has the Authority to interprete Scriptures. Perhaps I should strive to be less creative and more succinct!
Maran atha!
Angel
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PJM
Guest
Perhaps I was taken aback with the question from someone who professes to be Catholic; so I try to play with cultural references–and I was hoping that my little story would bring to mind the origins of the Church to whom Christ delegated His Authority–since He promised the Holy Spirit to Guide and Instruct the Church, it is the Church (only one founded by Christ) that has the Authority to interprete Scriptures. Perhaps I should strive to be less creative and more succinct!
GREAT!
You ARE A Catholic
God Bles you,
Pat
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Crumpy
Guest
I read an evangelical’s essay on this subject, and he used some prooftexts from scripture.
I no longer have this essay available to me, but part of it refers to the introductions to several NT writings, which are addressed not to the pope, not to the bishops or overseers, not to the priests or presbyters, and not to the deacons…but to the “saints” at such and such place.
And, this is supposed to show who can interpret those writings…correctly, I suppose.
this evangelical assumes that moderns can interpret the writings in the sense that they were intended.
There is the whole subject of “what scripture meant THEN and what it means NOW.”
For example, on the road to Emmaus, Jesus opened the eyes of two disciples about what the OT meant, presumably a meaning that was not familiar to them previously.
Applied to the NT, we might read Jesus’ remark that a man who even looks at a woman with lust commits adultery – and interpret and apply that in our modern context, for example, to point out the danger of pornography.
We recall that the Church declares that the Scriptures are an inexhaustible source of inspiration and meaning to us, so we have a lot to look forward to in studying the Bible.
HTH (hope this helps)
I no longer have this essay available to me, but part of it refers to the introductions to several NT writings, which are addressed not to the pope, not to the bishops or overseers, not to the priests or presbyters, and not to the deacons…but to the “saints” at such and such place.
And, this is supposed to show who can interpret those writings…correctly, I suppose.
this evangelical assumes that moderns can interpret the writings in the sense that they were intended.
There is the whole subject of “what scripture meant THEN and what it means NOW.”
For example, on the road to Emmaus, Jesus opened the eyes of two disciples about what the OT meant, presumably a meaning that was not familiar to them previously.
Applied to the NT, we might read Jesus’ remark that a man who even looks at a woman with lust commits adultery – and interpret and apply that in our modern context, for example, to point out the danger of pornography.
We recall that the Church declares that the Scriptures are an inexhaustible source of inspiration and meaning to us, so we have a lot to look forward to in studying the Bible.
HTH (hope this helps)
C
Crumpy
Guest
Narrowing in on the subject of interpretation, the Pope has opened the door to reviewing Jewish exegesis of the past 2000 years. (See The Jewish People and their Scriptures in the Christian Bible).
For less than $30, you can pick up the Jewish Study Bible and explore some modern viewpoints on scripture (from Oxford University Press).
Some people don’t like to “go there” and read things like this, but I like to look at a modern Jewish translation of scripture (in the first place) and get a quick perspective of centuries of Jewish study (in the second place).
After the destruction of the second Temple, in 70 A.D., Judaism had to reinterpret itself for a religion without a temple and a priesthood.
for those who are daring to look at Jewish commentary, you must realize that they feel Christians both mistranslate the scriptures and misinterpret them. So, there is a definite slant to their commentary.
For less than $30, you can pick up the Jewish Study Bible and explore some modern viewpoints on scripture (from Oxford University Press).
Some people don’t like to “go there” and read things like this, but I like to look at a modern Jewish translation of scripture (in the first place) and get a quick perspective of centuries of Jewish study (in the second place).
After the destruction of the second Temple, in 70 A.D., Judaism had to reinterpret itself for a religion without a temple and a priesthood.
for those who are daring to look at Jewish commentary, you must realize that they feel Christians both mistranslate the scriptures and misinterpret them. So, there is a definite slant to their commentary.
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jcrichton
Guest
I think that part of the problem that we have is that we miss the forest for the tree… the example you’ve cited is an excellent one… many simply do not take into account what Jesus stated before His Crucifixion (John 14, and 16); it would be only those who were with Him from the beginning to whom He would reveal Himself as the Glorified Christ (check out the walking through walls, light-speed travel, and multiple revelations–did He appear to 500 at once and were they all gathered together or did they analyzed the indivivual/smaller group encounters?); the disciples on the road to Emmaus seemed to not have been of his inner circle, which would account for them not recognizing Christ as readily as the Eleven–which again goes to the revelation of the Holy Spirit!
The same is true for Scriptures–man’s intellectualism can only comprehend a portion of the written text (hence the myriads of sects and religious groups)–that other part (it is the Spirit that gives Life) is revealed by the Holy Spirit.
Maran atha!
Angel
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jcrichton
Guest
…not just that; they feel that Catholics have high jacked their Sacred Writings and since they, as a religious group, do not accept Christ as the Messiah, the New Covenant is void to them!
Maran atha!
Angel
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PJM
Guest
Often ignored because it’s direction from “a pope” is the precise teaching of
Saint Peter on this very topic.
2nd. Peter 1: 16-21 “For we did not follow cleverly devised myths when we made known to you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but we were eyewitnesses of his majesty. For when he received honor and glory from God the Father and the voice was borne to him by the Majestic Glory, “This is my beloved Son, with whom I am well pleased,” we heard this voice borne from heaven, for we were with him on the holy mountain. And we have the prophetic word made more sure. You will do well to pay attention to this as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts. First of all you must understand this, that no prophecy of scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation, because no prophecy ever came by the impulse of man, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.”
ACTS 8: 29-32 “And the Spirit said to Philip, “Go up and join this chariot.” So Philip ran to him, and heard him reading Isaiah the prophet, and asked, “Do you understand what you are reading?”** And he said, “How can I, unless some one guides me?”** And he invited Philip to come up and sit with him. Now the passage of the scripture which he was reading was this: "As a sheep led to the slaughter or a lamb before its shearer is dumb, so he opens not his mouth.”
Rom.10: 17 “So faith comes from what is heard, and what is heard comes by the preaching of Christ”
Mark.4 Verses 32 to 34: “yet when it is sown it grows up and becomes the greatest of all shrubs, and puts forth large branches, so that the birds of the air can make nests in its shade." With many such parables he spoke the word to them, as they were able to hear it; he [Jesus] did not speak to them without a parable, but privately to his own disciples he explained everything
**Mark.4: 11 **“**And he said to them, "To you [the Apostles] has been given the secret of the kingdom of God, but for those outside everything is in parables;” **
**2 Peter 3: 14 –17 14 **Therefore, beloved, since you wait for these, be zealous to be found by him without spot or blemish, and at peace. And count the forbearance of our Lord as salvation. So also our beloved brother Paul wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, speaking of this as he does in all his letters. There are some things in them hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other scriptures
So unbelievers are forewarned. God will, because God MUST Judge based on what He God permits us to know [has exposed to us]. If we deny it; we deny God! Expected to be judged this way upon death
Pray for humility and Understanding,
God Bless,
Pat
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