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jcrichton
Guest
I’m quite pedestrian… could you be more specific… what is it that you seek?
Maran atha!
Angel
Maran atha!
Angel
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J
jcrichton
Guest
Hi, Noe!
…so only the New Covent is suspect?
Maran atha!
Angel
…so only the New Covent is suspect?
Maran atha!
Angel
J
jcrichton
Guest
So you are saying that the world evolved on its own–outside of Catholic Doctrine?
Maran atha!
Angel
Maran atha!
Angel
H
hymin
Guest
Final perseverance and humility to beg for a purer hope.
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hymin
Guest
Well I stood in those places myself. And I accuse myself of not being diligent enough to learn to write better and study to give a better answer. Please pray for me.
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jcrichton
Guest
No, I meant what is the venom that you are speaking of?
Who has claimed that you are maligning the Faith?
Maran atha!
Angel
Who has claimed that you are maligning the Faith?
Maran atha!
Angel
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jcrichton
Guest
I love Scriptures and often ignore everything else… so when I catch something through the peripheral it is not always well-founded; I don’t think this is so wrong if it is done without malice–also, we must be open to correction and growth.
I pray that the Holy Spirit continue to Bless us with His Guidance and Favor.
Maran atha!
Angel
I pray that the Holy Spirit continue to Bless us with His Guidance and Favor.
Maran atha!
Angel
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hymin
Guest
“Jerome remarks, a heresy arises from words wrongly used” (STh I, Q. 31, a. 2, c.) and I know that I am susceptible to writing, There are grounds for me to pursue a principle outside myself in regard to writing. Perhaps a standpoint in the forum would do me good. May God continue to provide for all of us. He presented to me five minutes ago a group in a local library that gathers for the subject of writing. And they have an event called “Don’t fear the FASFA”. (Financial aid for college) Jerome was very keen, and exhorted others to find opportunities to study under a master,
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jcrichton
Guest
…so you are up a few on the heresy channel–you have the Church’s Fathers, the Church’s experience with the various heresies, and, on top, the Holy Spirit.
Remember that the Quest for the Truth (Jesus) must remain the reason (purpose) for your Vocation. Many who have gone astray have done so because, though they were Called to be Apologists, they succumbed to their ego and the vain glory of the world.
Stay true to the Course (Jesus); humble yourself, always, to God and He will lift you up!
Maran atha!
Angel
Remember that the Quest for the Truth (Jesus) must remain the reason (purpose) for your Vocation. Many who have gone astray have done so because, though they were Called to be Apologists, they succumbed to their ego and the vain glory of the world.
Stay true to the Course (Jesus); humble yourself, always, to God and He will lift you up!
Maran atha!
Angel
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hymin
Guest
Very true and edifing words jcrichton, they reflect my father, and I see Jesus in you! Truly, you ask what do I seek? I gave you a reasonable answer. But the passions go first when unbridled. And the passion of love chases them away from ourselves. The idols of this world cry out trust in me (cf. Lumen Fidei, 13). Now I gladly stand corrected by you! I hope this benefits the OP. And I encourage him or her to engage further for clarity.
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Sy_Noe
Guest
No clue where you got that.
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jcrichton
Guest
Thank you for your generous words!
I too am glad to have encounter you. The Body of Christ needs committed Servants to both maintain and proclaim His Love!
Maran atha!
Angel
I too am glad to have encounter you. The Body of Christ needs committed Servants to both maintain and proclaim His Love!
Maran atha!
Angel
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jcrichton
Guest
Hi, Noe!
…there was a typo “New Covent” should read “New Covenant;” I’m the worst proof reader ever.
Now here’s what I read:
If this is not what you meant to convey, please accept my apologies.
Maran atha!
Angel
…there was a typo “New Covent” should read “New Covenant;” I’m the worst proof reader ever.
Now here’s what I read:
…what I understood was that the New Covenant was not true but for having faith in it (believing that it is) because of what the Catholic Church purports that it is.
If this is not what you meant to convey, please accept my apologies.
Maran atha!
Angel
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Sy_Noe
Guest
No problem. I understood you meant “covenant”. I had originally referred to the NT only because at the time I was responding to a post that mentioned Christ’s resurrection. But yes, for anyone to come to believe they know with certainty, it takes faith in a Creator, faith in human writers who penned words in the confines of the time in which they lived , for Christians in general, faith in the NT and yes in regards to the Catholic faith, faith in the ECFs, in Catholic interpretation and so on. Simply put it takes a heap of faith regardless of one’s religious identity.Hi, Noe!
…there was a typo “New Covent” should read “New Covenant;” I’m the worst proof reader ever.
Now here’s what I read:
Sy_Noe:
…what I understood was that the New Covenant was not true but for having faith in it (believing that it is) because of what the Catholic Church purports that it is.
If this is not what you meant to convey, please accept my apologies.
Maran atha!
Angel
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SnoopSword
Guest
I would say that believing in the Creeds are our Faith are required and the Bible is not. The first creed in Christianity… actually… the first ever document is called the Easter Creed which is why the Anabaptists HATE Easter and call the holidays ‘pagan’. What’s really happening is the wolves want the Christian sheep to DENY the Easter Creed which is given by Paul in the NT. Even if there was no NT, the creed was around and is agreed by most scholars to be the the earliest Christian document. If you DENY the creed, you deny the headship of the Apostle(s) which is against our religion (1 Cor 11:1).
Our Faith is defined by the Creeds - not the Bible itself. For instance, if you want to join Islam you have to agree to their contract. If you want to be Christian, you have to agree with the Nicene Creed at least. ALL Catholic, Protestant, and Orthodox accept them. 95% of Christianity. ANABAPTISTS REJECT THE CREEDS COMPLETELY AND THUS REJECT THE APOSTLES AND THUS ARE NOT CHRISTIAN.
Why? Because here’s what one of the Creeds say. And yes the Protestants DO accept these below:
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DebCWil
Guest
Because of the amount of anti-Catholic literature and misinformation floating around, one thing I have learned to do when I read or hear what a particular group believe is go directly to the source. In college, I had to write a paper on the Mennonites, part of the Anabaptists. So are the Amish.
Anabaptist means to re-Baptize They rejected infant Baptism, and were baptized again as adults. Their understanding of Baptism differs somewhat from that of Catholics. They hold to a three fold Baptism of desire, water, and blood.
For Catholics, the Baptism of Desire is reserved for those, who through no fault of there own are unable to be Baptized with Water. For the Anabaptist, the Baptism of Water is the public profession of Faith. Much like Catholic Confirmation, it is reserved for the age of discernment. The Baptism of Blood is that of Martyrdom. To the Anabaptist, it is a lifelong process of dying to self and growing in Christ.
Many of the first Anabaptists died under persecution reciting the Nicene Creed.
What we accept as the truths of our Faith can be found in Scripture. They are indeed summarized in the Creed. I find it interesting that many of the mainline churches of our separated brothers and sisters continue to recite the Nicene Creed as part of their Sunday services, just as we do.
There are some “non-denominational” churches which follow a narrow and fundamental reading of the Bible. Many of these younger churches do not have the richness of established tradition. They have not gone through any of the hardships of mainline churches. Members lack an understanding of the importance of the Sacraments are not engaged in current ecumenical dialogue with the Catholic Church toward the unification that Christ calls us, “That all may be one.”
Strife is a luxury that we as Christians cannot afford. As St. Pope Paul VI wrote during Vatican II, the current separation that we as Christians experience serves as a scandal to the world. Yes, I have been asked about this very scandal by a Hindu. It is why I continue to pray for unity with our separated brothers and sisters in Christ.
Saint Jerome called ignorance of Scripture ignorance of God. Reading the Bible does not mean we need to be able to quote chapter and verse. As Catholics, we read the Bible as a whole. The O.T. gives light to the N.T. which fulfilled the O.T. Mass is divided into 2 parts for a reason, the Liturgy of the Word plus the Liturgy of the Eucharist. While some denominations may only hear about the word of God, we as Catholics actually hear the Word proclaimed at Mass. We are not limited to hearing the Word only on Sundays. We also have the Liturgy of the Hours, the official prayer of the Church, by which the Church itself “prays unceasingly.”
Anabaptist means to re-Baptize They rejected infant Baptism, and were baptized again as adults. Their understanding of Baptism differs somewhat from that of Catholics. They hold to a three fold Baptism of desire, water, and blood.
For Catholics, the Baptism of Desire is reserved for those, who through no fault of there own are unable to be Baptized with Water. For the Anabaptist, the Baptism of Water is the public profession of Faith. Much like Catholic Confirmation, it is reserved for the age of discernment. The Baptism of Blood is that of Martyrdom. To the Anabaptist, it is a lifelong process of dying to self and growing in Christ.
Many of the first Anabaptists died under persecution reciting the Nicene Creed.
What we accept as the truths of our Faith can be found in Scripture. They are indeed summarized in the Creed. I find it interesting that many of the mainline churches of our separated brothers and sisters continue to recite the Nicene Creed as part of their Sunday services, just as we do.
There are some “non-denominational” churches which follow a narrow and fundamental reading of the Bible. Many of these younger churches do not have the richness of established tradition. They have not gone through any of the hardships of mainline churches. Members lack an understanding of the importance of the Sacraments are not engaged in current ecumenical dialogue with the Catholic Church toward the unification that Christ calls us, “That all may be one.”
Strife is a luxury that we as Christians cannot afford. As St. Pope Paul VI wrote during Vatican II, the current separation that we as Christians experience serves as a scandal to the world. Yes, I have been asked about this very scandal by a Hindu. It is why I continue to pray for unity with our separated brothers and sisters in Christ.
Saint Jerome called ignorance of Scripture ignorance of God. Reading the Bible does not mean we need to be able to quote chapter and verse. As Catholics, we read the Bible as a whole. The O.T. gives light to the N.T. which fulfilled the O.T. Mass is divided into 2 parts for a reason, the Liturgy of the Word plus the Liturgy of the Eucharist. While some denominations may only hear about the word of God, we as Catholics actually hear the Word proclaimed at Mass. We are not limited to hearing the Word only on Sundays. We also have the Liturgy of the Hours, the official prayer of the Church, by which the Church itself “prays unceasingly.”
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jcrichton
Guest
Hi, Noe!
It takes barges upon barges of faith just to believe that you will wake up the next day and move to the “Rhythm.”
…just how much faith do you suppose that it takes to study the Bible so that you can reject it on the premise that it takes Faith?
The whole purpose of Scriptures is that we have Faith in God, is it not?
So that’s quite insignificant (the claim to faith).
Science claims that the sun will expire in a couple of billions of years… is that fact?
Maran atha!
Angel
It takes barges upon barges of faith just to believe that you will wake up the next day and move to the “Rhythm.”
…just how much faith do you suppose that it takes to study the Bible so that you can reject it on the premise that it takes Faith?
The whole purpose of Scriptures is that we have Faith in God, is it not?
So that’s quite insignificant (the claim to faith).
Science claims that the sun will expire in a couple of billions of years… is that fact?
Maran atha!
Angel
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SnoopSword
Guest
Oh great. The famous cries of Anabaptist persecution by the evil Catholic Church. Thanks for defending them. You have NO IDEA how much of a TRUE ENEMY they are to our Church at home and worldwide. If you did, you would never, ever say such things or lend them ANY kind of moral support. Did you know I have a list of sins for confession; financially and even morally supporting organizations like Planned Parenthood, ADL, etc I have to ask forgiveness it’s that serious. The most anti-Catholic organzation with the greatest number are the Anabaptists (aka Pentecostal, Baptist, Seventh Day Adventist, etc).
Anyhow, your claim is illogical because Anabaptists believe in ANOTHER baptism that does different things - NOT the one described in the Nicene Creed:
“I believe in…one Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church. I acknowledge ONE BAPTISM for the REMISSION OF SINS.” -The latter part is what they reject.
The Christian baptism is a baptism of infants and always has been. Those who REJECT this truth and try to change the rules about our Baptism, REJECT the FOUNDATION of our Faith that Christ gave us. This specific issue was prophesied about and foretold to warn us:
Heb 6:1-2 let us NOT lay AGAIN the FOUNDATION of the doctrine of BAPTISMS, of LAYING on of HANDS (also proves Baptism is NOT laying of hands and other blasphemous nonsense the Anabaptists are continually coming up with).
1 Cor 12:13 For by ONE SPIRIT we were all BAPTIZED INTO ONE BODY
Proof Anabaptists are not Protestant whatsoever:
WESTMINSTER CONFESSION 28.1, 28.4 “Baptism is a SACRAMENT of the New Testament, ORDAINED by Jesus Christ… for the SIGN and SEAL of the COVENANT OF GRACE (aka ‘a Christian’), [and] of REGENERATION, REMISSION OF SINS , the INFANTS of one, or both, BELIEVING parents, are to be baptized” - They Children MUST BE BAPTIZED. Why? Because of this:
Acts 2:38-39 let EVERY ONE OF YOU be BAPTIZED… This PROMISE is to YOU AND to YOUR CHILDREN… and as MANY as the Lord our God WILL call (God calls ADULTS AND CHILDREN, thus their children [or future children] ALSO be baptized along with them “EVERY ONE of you” - parent AND child).
They are practicing a water ritual of their own pagan religion - 40,000 different religions - not Christianity. Here is a list of Anabaptists:
-Amish, Mennonites, Puritans
-ALL ‘Baptist’ (SBC, IFB etc. Exceptions exist in Europe)
-All Flavors of Messianic Judaism
-Seventh Day Adventists and it’s Legion of +500 Sabbath keeping denominations
-Church of Christ of all types and flavors
-Jehovah’s Witness
–Mormons
-Pentecostalism of ALL types and flavors
-Assemblies of God (also Pentecostal but listing just incase)
-Unitarian/Universal
-Christiandelphia
-Church of science
-501c3
-Non Denominational
-Almost ALL Charismatic Movements (unless they are part of an authentic Cath/Prot/Orth Church which is rare)
-House Churches
-Internet Churches
-‘Calvinism’ (Anabaptist religion pretending to be Protestant. very rare exceptions in America).
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SnoopSword
Guest
No that’s what the Church is for (or Jesus would have said he came to bring us a Bible and to use that to have Faith and Believe). Here’s proof:
Acts 15:7 PETER (the Pope) rose up and said: “Men AND brethren, YOU ALL KNOW that GOD CHOSE ME from among YOU that by MY MOUTH the GENTILES should HEAR THE WORD of the GOSPEL and BELIEVE.
(People just don’t seem to fully understand. The Anabaptist Spirit is TRULY anti-Catholic at the deepest level. It’s deep in a persons soul. It’s like a spirit that even a baptism cannot wash away (many cases of false adult baptisms’s are in the Bible which is why babies should be baptized and not adults).
Saint Cyprian (250 AD): “He who has TURNED HIS BACK on the CHURCH of Christ shall NOT come to the rewards of Christ; he is AN ALIEN, a WORLDLING, an ENEMY.” (SO TRUE. I’ve come to find this first hand over the years)
Q: “A friend of mine just got RE-BAPTIZED. He was baptized as an infant and just got RE-BAPTIZED by another church. I think that he may have SINNED AGAINST THE HOLY SPIRIT.”
A: "YES, HE DID COMMIT A SIN AGAINST THE HOLY SPIRIT. By being re-baptized, he implied by his actions that what the Holy Spirit did in his first baptism WAS NOT SUFFICIENT. -CatholicAnwers .com
“Hubmaier (died in 1527) REBAPTIZED his entire congregation of 300, and the church RENOUNCED ALL FELLOWSHIP with ROME.” Thirdmill .org
“The Anabaptist movement was actually a REACTION against the close ties between CHURCH and STATE in both Catholic AND Protestant domains.” Thirdmill .org (BIRTH OF FREEMASONRY)
“The Anabaptists, because of their doctrine of SEPARATION of CHURCH and STATE, stood for LIBERTY OF RELIGION and for a “FREE CHURCH.” They OPPOSED the establishment of ANY FAITH by law, asserting FREEDOM OF RELIGION, and believing that there should be no basis for PERSECUTION whatsoever.” (BIRTH OF FREEMASONRY, ILLUMINATI, AMERICANISM)
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jcrichton
Guest
No, you misunderstand my point.
The challenge about having to have Faith in order to accept the New Testament and the Teaching of the Catholic Church… to me this implies the old ‘blind faith.’
Scriptures are the Written Words of God; the purpose for their existence is that we have a record of God’s interaction with man and that through the knowledge found in them we have Faith in God.
The Promise made by God is Recorded even past the death of His Prophets and Saints.
However, I do not limit God’s Revelation to the Sacred Writings since it is God’s Design to include Oral Revelation through the Teaching of the Prophets and Apostles.
I was comparing the human need to have faith in things; how everything revolves around faith; yet, I am countering that it cannot be seen as out of the human experience to have Faith in God since it is His Requirement that we Believe:
Maran atha!
Angel
The challenge about having to have Faith in order to accept the New Testament and the Teaching of the Catholic Church… to me this implies the old ‘blind faith.’
Scriptures are the Written Words of God; the purpose for their existence is that we have a record of God’s interaction with man and that through the knowledge found in them we have Faith in God.
The Promise made by God is Recorded even past the death of His Prophets and Saints.
However, I do not limit God’s Revelation to the Sacred Writings since it is God’s Design to include Oral Revelation through the Teaching of the Prophets and Apostles.
I was comparing the human need to have faith in things; how everything revolves around faith; yet, I am countering that it cannot be seen as out of the human experience to have Faith in God since it is His Requirement that we Believe:
Understand, I am neither proposing nor promoting sola Scriptura nor do I propose that all roads (any belief system) leads to God.
Maran atha!
Angel
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