Big John Lennon fan here guys

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There might be some kind of thread already started about this sort of thing but i’m kind of pressed for time so i’ll just assume there isn’t and hope i’m right. Now, i’m a really big John Lennon fan, and i listen to all his music and have a bunch of t-shirts with him on them and all. And those of you who are familiar with John Lennon would know that he was anti-religion, among other things. So my question is, would it be bad (if not necessarily a sin) to wear these shirts if they have him on them? Am i supporting the devil’s advocate on my t-shirts? I mean he was for some good things too right? On the music i just try to tune my mind out of the lyrics when anything obscene comes on, and try to just concentrate on the piano or guitar or w/e. So yeah, thanks.
 
You know, if it had been anybody else, I wouldn’t have much of an opinion…but Lennon was so influential in turning so many away from Christ. I mean, even the other Beatles were just sort of harmless idiots…like anybody cares what McCartney thinks about anything…but I have to say, to me an image of Lennon is an anti-Church image.

But, I may have an irrational dislike of him. I’m looking forward t others’ opinions on this one.
 
When I think of him, from what I know (and I think if I knew more, I’d like him less), I think “someone who was maybe trying to find Christ, but led a very dirty life morally, and had a very nasty mouth for everything/everyone who didn’t agree with him.” As Jimbo2 said, he was very influential in promoting the 60’s counterculture and moral degeneracy in general.

I’ll agree, some of his songs are quite good, and some of them have “messages” that are either relatively harmless or can even be turned to Christian themes (no, NOT “Imagine” - I was thinking about “Mind Games”, as directed towards the culture of death and its leaders). But many of them promote his themes of “do what makes you feel right”, “peace and love at all costs” and “Yoko is my Walrus” :D. Personally, I don’t know quite what to tell you, but I’d steer away from overtly advertising the man. There are many other better artists out there morally, including some that promoted a somewhat similar “we’re all looking for someone/let’s bring the world to peace” message without being nearly as radical or druggy as Lennon, and having many more conservative/Christian leanings (the “Moody Blues”, anyone?). But pray for his soul, that he finally may rest in peace. 👍
 
OUch! what to say. . . well, here goes:

Lennon spent at least a full year of his life off in some heroin dreamland. Hard to envy or admire that. (I read this in a recent Beatles history). For me, that pretty much kills the deal.

His lyrics are, to me, pretty juvenile; whatever philosophy he tried to present was pretty much on a teenager level. But it stands to reason; he didn’t get a good education since he was busy making music and getting started. So I think the lyrics are pretty puerile.

Beatles vs. Stones? Well, I recently ran across a Kurt Vonnegut quote, where he explains that an artist’s role is to give people a sense of joy at simply being alive–and he used the Beatles music as his example. So for me, it’s the Beatles, the early Beatles.

I’m a fan of another musician who also got into drugs, and as an adult, learning about this just has lessened my respect for his music. There really is a connection between the artist and his art.
 
I’m old enough to remember John Lennon’s comment back in the 1960’s. The comment was something like this: “We (the Beatles) are bigger than Jesus Christ.”

I haven’t liked John Lennon since.
 
Priscilla_Ann said:
I’m old enough to remember John Lennon’s comment back in the 1960’s. The comment was something like this: “We (the Beatles) are bigger than Jesus Christ.”

I haven’t liked John Lennon since.
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*Well, originally I pointed out that fact in reference to England. That we meant more to kids than Jesus did, or religion at that time. I wasn’t knocking it or putting it down. I was just saying it as a fact, and it’s true more for England than here. I’m not saying that we’re better or greater, or comparing us with Jesus Christ as a person or God as a thing, or whatever it is. I just said what I said and it was wrong. Or it was taken wrong. And now it’s all this. *
-John Lennon

And then there is also this from wikipedia:

The Vatican accepted his apology
-wikipedia

uh-oh i like eric clapton too. i think he also had a pretty druggy background. maybe i just have bad taste in artists.
 
BrooklynBoy200 said:
uh-oh i like eric clapton too. i think he also had a pretty druggy background. maybe i just have bad taste in artists.
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You know what? I wouldn’t worry about it. If they’re truly talented musicians, the music will still be good once they’re out of their drug haze. Lennon and Clapton made it out alive (unlike so many others). Lennon produced good music (lyrics are a different story) until he was killed, and Clapton continues to produce good music. Stevie Nicks and her band, Fleetwood Mac, were notorious druggies in the '70s and '80s. They’re all clean and sober now, and are producing some of the best music of their careers.

I guess knowing that someone used to do drugs when they were young, stupid, and easily influenced doesn’t make me think too much less of them. If they got out of it and stayed clean, good on them. Many of us have done stupid things in our lives, and I don’t believe that we should begrudge those who are blessed enough to get a second chance.
 
Heh…Heh…I’m another big John Lennon fan. As an aritst he inspires me to take the gifts God gave me and try to put them towards helping the world be a better place. I find songs like “Give Peace a Chance” and “Imagine” to be some of the most inspiring secular songs I know. Imagine no Heaven/Hell isn’t imagine no God,according to an interview I saw with Lennon, it’s imagine a world where everyone can have a relationship with God that isn’t ridiculed. I mean, I would love to see a world where everyone was Christian, but until that’s possible I don’t think we’re doing much good killing each other in the name of religion. Think about 9/11 and maybe what John’s saying isn’t so bad.

I have a Beatles t-shirt I wear often. And I wear it at the same time as I’m wearing my cross. I love their music, but that doesn’t mean that I approve of everything they did in their lives. The same thing goes for John Lennon and his life and music. I think he had some truly inspiring songs, but that doesn’t mean I agree with his drug use or adultery or spirituality.

Hope that makes sense.
 
A good friend of mine recently reminded me that, while the Church contains the fullness of truth, there is truth in other places, too.

Art is meant to serve truth, and whether the artist wants it to or not, his work will contain some nugget of truth – even if the work is so abominably obscene as to almost obscure it, the truth can be found in the unintended irony of the work.

John Lennon was a sad, misguided, lonely man, and he spent his adulthood seeking ways to fill that hole in his heart through drugs, music, sex, Eastern mumbo-jumbo pseudoreligion, and anti-religious rhetoric. His mother and father abandoned him; his mother came back into his life, and they develped a friendship of sorts – until she was killed by a drunk driver.

It’s entirely possible that he was poorly catechised, and had poor role models growing up – he certainly wouldn’t be the first – which ill-equipped him for the moral cesspool that is celebrity and fortune.

“God is a concept/by which we measure our pain.”

“Mother, you left me/ but I never left you. I needed you/ you didn’t need me/ So I/ I just want to tell you/ Good bye”

“Cold turkey/has got me/on the run.”

A sad, sad man.

To wear a John Lennon t-shirt is to say “I enjoy John Lennon’s music” – I think most people would make that assumption. To wear a t-shirt proclaiming his beliefs or crowning him as a philosopher whose wisdom we should heed is a different story.

Peace,
Dante
 
Dante:
You’ve got a really good point here. There are TONS of celebrities, rock stars, cultural people, artists, etc., who get totally wasted by the cash rewards of their success. . . and sadly corrupted.

It’s a shame there’s less cash involved in stardom. You might then find some more focused, more morally alert stars.

Less drug use, less fan abuse, less time “wasted on the way.”

re: Beatles. I see their achievement as an amalgamation of McCartney, Lennon and Harrison’s musical ambition, George Martin’s musical wisdom and knowledge, and access to good equipment, good support. This said, I’ve come to like Ringo best.
 
Maxply said:
OUch! what to say. . . well, here goes:

Lennon spent at least a full year of his life off in some heroin dreamland. Hard to envy or admire that. (I read this in a recent Beatles history). For me, that pretty much kills the deal.

His lyrics are, to me, pretty juvenile; whatever philosophy he tried to present was pretty much on a teenager level. But it stands to reason; he didn’t get a good education since he was busy making music and getting started. So I think the lyrics are pretty puerile.

Beatles vs. Stones? Well, I recently ran across a Kurt Vonnegut quote, where he explains that an artist’s role is to give people a sense of joy at simply being alive–and he used the Beatles music as his example. So for me, it’s the Beatles, the early Beatles.

I’m a fan of another musician who also got into drugs, and as an adult, learning about this just has lessened my respect for his music. There really is a connection between the artist and his art.
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I totally agree with you. Lennon’s lyrics (and music too, really) is pretty juvenile. I really think his artistic prowess was much less after the break up with McCartney, not to mention after the drug involvement.

I think the Beatles were great before the drug scene got to them.
 
I’ve been thinking about this alot in the past couple of days, and I think I understand why some people don’t like the song “Imagine”. I know that I definetly do not want to imagine a world with no Heaven or Hell because that would mean a world without justice and God’s prescence. And for all the quirks of religion, I don’t want to imagine a world without religion either since it is the glue that holds our society together. And maybe even we don’t want to see a world where all religions are viewed as equal, because there are many religious practices that are not of God or moral.

I do love John Lennon’s music and the ideals he stood for, but I also realize that his words can’t be taken as truth. No one’s words should be taken as full truth except for God. I think we can enjoy the work of John Lennon, but the words we take to our hearts should belong to Jesus.
 
I just finished reading a new book about Lennon by his first wife Cynthia. I’ve lost all respect for Lennon. He was verbally and emotionally abusive towards his first wife, committed adultery with Yoko and then divorced his wife, rarely saw his son Julian, spent much of his time in LSD and then heroin drug induced states and so on. I wouldn’t wear his picture on any t-shirt of mine.
 
Finally another Lennon fan here! 🙂 Hello! I’m only sixteen but I do love his music along with The beatles. Personally, I don’t find it a sin. People have their opinions of him. He wasn’t exactly anti-religion. He was for peace. I actually watched The Us vs. John Lennon and it explained a lot, and how he was being followed by the government and such. Really, I just think he was a great figure during the 60s and up till his death. Maybe he wasnt Christian or Catholic, but he knew what he was talking about and was a real advocate for peace. Glad to have another fan on here!👍

tv-links.co.uk/show.do/4/1806 < There’s the movie. I highly reccomend. 🙂
 
I grew up with the Beatles and saw them go from “She Loves You” to “Strawberry Fields” which was about drug use. For John Lennon, in particular, I saw him devolve into a very immoral performer.

As a writer, I know my work can lift someone’s spirits or take them to a fantastic place, but I am responsible for my message. What I bring to the reader in written form, I take as me telling them a story face to face. For me, it needs to be uplifting and contain some virtue, like early Beatles music.

I don’t like the John Lennon who sang “Why don’t we do it in the road” or, with Yoko,

"Whatever gets you through the night, it’s alright, alright
“Be it wrong or be it right, it’s alright, alright”

I don’t want to sing along to that.

God bless,
Ed
 
Can someone tell me if the song “Lady Madonna” is immoral? It would appear to de-glorify Mary at first glance, but knowing the beatles, it may not even be about Mary (as is the case with Let it Be). I think it has a really nice rythym to it. Thanks.
 
“You better recognize your brother is everyone you meet.” - John Lennon
Many Christians can’t even grasp that concept, which is sad, especially given 1 John 4:20.
That, however, is the exception, not the norm to the messages behind John Lennon’s lyrics.
We must note that the Beatles did NOT split up over RELIGIOUS differences, which makes the song, “Imagine” particularly abominable since it strongly implies that religion is the primary cause of human conflict. Even without religion, however, the song, “How Do You Sleep?” a hateful rant against Paul McCartney would still have appeared on the “Imagine” album. So much for peace. Did John Lennon cheat on Cynthia due to religious reasons? Did he neglect his son Julian due to religious differences? Did Mark David Chapman shoot John Lennon over religious differences?
The lyrics, “I’d rather see you dead, little girl, than to be with another man,” although more honest than many secular “love” songs, certainly do not show what I would consider to be a peaceful or charitable attitude. Yet, the inner feelings that would produce such lyrics are not spurred on by religious differences with some girl.
I could also do without the blasphemy found in “The Ballad of John and Yoko.”
So, I would view the song “Imagine,” as not being a call for peace, but a warlike attack on religion. A wolf in sheep’s clothing, if you will. The turmoil and strife in John Lennon’s own life were not centered on religion, but the lack thereof. Nevertheless, he chooses religion as his target, acting as if world peace would be attained by the elimination of religion. His own life, however, tells a much different story. Throughout all the fog and haze, he couldn’t see that God was calling him. John Lennon couldn’t see that he singing against Who he needed.
“Imagine” is considered to be a great peace song by many, but it is really one of the most anti-peace songs ever written, regardless of what the intentions of John Lennon’s heart were, which is not my place to judge.
Despite his wordly fame, we need to remember, John Lennon was not given all that we had in life, and it is not our place to judge him or his salvation. At the same time, we can assess lyrics to songs, and messages they send to realize that he was NOT a role model of peace and love.
Jesus is the answer.
 
Personally I see nothing wrong with being a John Lennon fan. Or a Rush fan, an Elton John fan, a Kenny G fan. I could go on and on but my music tastes are so varied that there is not room to list them all here.
 
RhyannaRose said:
I have a Beatles t-shirt I wear often. And I wear it at the same time as I’m wearing my cross. I love their music, but that doesn’t mean that I approve of everything they did in their lives. The same thing goes for John Lennon and his life and music. I think he had some truly inspiring songs, but that doesn’t mean I agree with his drug use or adultery or spirituality.

Hope that makes sense.
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That’s an excellent point, I think - that because you love the music, you’re not necessarily advocating everything about the person.

Lennon was incredibly open about his opinions and beliefs; a lot of musicians aren’t. So if we’re saying, by wearing a shirt, that we DO agree with everything this person is ‘about’… well, more often than not, we really don’t know what they’re about 100% at all.

So perhaps we should consider wearing the shirt to just mean ‘hey, I like the music’. 😉
 
Whatever. My boss is a big Lennon fan, but I just don’t care for his music. I find it very pretentious. I can’t help but feel sorry for Lennon though. As one poster said, he went through life with a big God-shaped hole in his heart and tried to fill it with sex, drugs, and everything else. But he thrust aside the one thing that would have filled it.
 
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