"Bilingual" frustrations

[PacoG]

God does NOT prefer people or their worship based on what language the speak. NOT latin, NOT spanish, NOT swahili (sp?). To imply such is disgusting. God is NOT closer to the hispanic people than to anyone else.

I don’t say that anywhere and one has to go through extreme mental gymnastics to find that in what I wrote. Latin is the official language of the Latin Rite of the Catholic Church, of which we are members. (In case you don’t know, the Catholic Church has several rites. There are Melkites, Greek Catholics, and several others. Most of us in the Western World are LATIN RITE CATHOLICS which means that the official language of our church is LATIN). Spanish is Romance language, which by its very nature makes it closer to the official language (Latin) of the LATIN RITE than English. (In case you didn’t know, ROMANCE LANGUAGES are languages that derived from LATIN. Spanish, Italian, Romanian, French are Romance Languages because they derive in one way or another from LATIN. English is Germanic Language which means it isn’t a Romance language.)

AND, I hate to break this to you: the original worship of the catholic church was in greek and aramaic, NOT latin, so please spout the “spanish language is closer to the catholic liturgical birthright speeches” elsewhere. We don’t need the kind of socio-racial discrimination you showed in that post.

Once again, the OFFICIAL LANGUAGE of the LATIN RITE of the Catholic Chuch is LATIN. Latin is still the normative language of the Mass. The Second Vatican Council affirmed this in Sacrosanctum Concilium:

1. 1. Particular law remaining in force, the use of the Latin language is to be preserved in the Latin rites.

 

[Lujack]

God does NOT prefer people or their worship based on what language the speak. NOT latin, NOT spanish, NOT swahili (sp?). To imply such is disgusting. God is NOT closer to the hispanic people than to anyone else.

AND, I hate to break this to you: the original worship of the catholic church was in greek and aramaic, NOT latin, so please spout the “spanish language is closer to the catholic liturgical birthright speeches” elsewhere. We don’t need the kind of socio-racial discrimination you showed in that post.

Technically, what the previous poster said is correct. If you compare a hypothetical best Spanish translation to a hypothetical best English translation, the Spanish translation will be more accurate because the language is tighter to Latin, which is the official language of the Church.

I also don’t see the “socio-racial discrimination” you’re grumping about.

 

[promethius]

I don’t say that anywhere and one has to go through extreme mental gymnastics to find that in what I wrote. Latin is the official language of the Latin Rite of the Catholic Church, of which we are members.

Quite so, but that’s not what you stated. you stated that the liturgical birthright of CATHOLICS is latin. I disagree. The liturgical birthright of CATHOLICS is the ministry of Christ, which transcends language. Which do you hold more important, Paco? The use of latin and superiority of languages which are “closer to latin” or the sacrifice on the cross?

What you’ve changed your post to here is a FAR cry from what you originally stated.

(In case you don’t know, the Catholic Church has several rites. There are Melkites, Greek Catholics, and several others. Most of us in the Western World are LATIN RITE CATHOLICS which means that the official language of our church is LATIN).

ACTUALLY, none of the ones you named are actually RITES, by definition. The seven rites of the Catholic church are: Byzantine, Alexandrian, Syriac, Arminian, Maronite, and Chaldean Catholics. Melkites and Greek Catholics are part of the Byzantines.

Further, the language of our CHURCH is not latin… that is the language of our particular RITE of the church. Perhaps you should do more research on what constitutes a rite vs a church before you attempt to educate me on it though.

Spanish is Romance language, which by its very nature makes it closer to the official language (Latin) of the LATIN RITE than English. (In case you didn’t know, ROMANCE LANGUAGES are languages that derived from LATIN. Spanish, Italian, Romanian, French are Romance Languages because they derive in one way or another from LATIN. English is Germanic Language which means it isn’t a Romance language.)

All correct, however (again) this is still a massive change from what you originally stated: that latin is the birthright of the liturgy of the Catholic church and that therefore spanish is closer to the liturgy of Christ than english. A HIGHLY offensive and incorrect thing to say. If you wish to retract your previous statement in favor of this one, that’s fine, we can discuss Vatican II all day, but your original statement was VERY wrong.

As to the validity of language, the other rites do NOT use latin. Does the Catholic Encyclopedia disparage them? No. Here’s what it says: Within the Catholic Church … Canonical rites, which are of equal dignity, enjoy the same rights, and are under the same obligations. Although the particular churches possess their own hierarchy, differ in liturgical and ecclesiastical discipline, and possess their own spiritual heritage, they are all entrusted to the pastoral government of the Roman pontiff, the divinely appointed successor of St. Peter in the Primacy.

The Catechism states: faithful obedience to tradition, the sacred Council declares that Holy Mother Church holds all lawfully recognized rites to be of equal right and dignity, and that she wishes to preserve them in the future and to foster them in every way

So I hope we can now admit that language does NOT make one more or less Catholic since such a position disagrees with official church teaching on the matter that all rites and their respective language SHARE EQUAL dignity and right.

 

[mdgspencer]

This is a serious problem. However, the priest should deal with it. What if the priest won’t deal with it? Then you are stuck if you go to mass there. I wouldn’t intervene on my own as some people suggest. I would think it would be a worse disruption if the person physically fought with you during the mass if you tried to stop him on your own authority.
I wouldn’t be impatient, because probably this will end after a few masses, unless he is in fact mentally ill.
Some people may find a general discussion about the language of the mass interesting, but usually when people take a thread off in a different direction, everyone else stops reading the messages.