Bill Maher vs Ben Affleck on the problem with Islam

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I’m surprised no1 had posted this yet but guess not many watch Real Time!

Anyway there was a very heated debate last Friday on Maher’s show

youtube.com/watch?v=IafWePD1DVw

Affleck claimed critiquing Islam is as bad as saying “shifty Jews”

of course this a deeply held problem in the liberal circles both US & UK.

Would be interested to see what peoples thoughts on it are here.
 
Sceptical_John said:
I’m surprised no1 had posted this yet but guess not many watch Real Time!

Anyway there was a very heated debate last Friday on Maher’s show

youtube.com/watch?v=IafWePD1DVw

Affleck claimed critiquing Islam is as bad as saying “shifty Jews”

of course this a deeply held problem in the liberal circles both US & UK.

Would be interested to see what peoples thoughts on it are here.
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I agree with Ben Affleck on this issue. Terrorists are not representative of any religion, and they come in all forms: Christian IRA terrorists in Northern Ireland, Jewish terrorist supporters of the late Rabbi Meir Kahane, Muslim members of terrorist organizations such as ISIS and Al Qaeda, etc.
 
Never thought I’d be siding with Bill Maher and Sam Harris, but they are absolutely right.

I wish Bill had asked Ben,

“What about the Muslims in Iran? Iraq? Syria? Somalia? Lybia? Afghanistan?”

On and on.
 
I don’t watch Maher as a rule, it can be a near occasion of sin for me. However, even a broken clock is correct twice daily.
 
meltzerboy said:
I agree with Ben Affleck on this issue. Terrorists are not representative of any religion, and they come in all forms: Christian IRA terrorists in Northern Ireland, Jewish terrorist supporters of the late Rabbi Meir Kahane, Muslim members of terrorist organizations such as ISIS and Al Qaeda, etc.
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Bill was not saying all Muslims are terrorists.

He was saying that islam teaches that women and minorities are second class citizens, that apostates should be put to death or shunned to the point of human rights violations.

The proof is in looking at any Islamic country in the world. Even moderate ones like morocco or Egypt.

Only on the secular west are we blind to this. We use the “cafeteria Muslims” as the example of what Islam teaches. But the only people who live Islam that way are the secularized minorities.
 
Jon_S said:
Bill was not saying all Muslims are terrorists.

He was saying that islam teaches that women and minorities are second class citizens, that apostates should be put to death or shunned to the point of human rights violations.

The proof is in looking at any Islamic country in the world. Even moderate ones like morocco or Egypt.

Only on the secular west are we blind to this. We use the “cafeteria Muslims” as the example of what Islam teaches. But the only people who live Islam that way are the secularized minorities.
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I question whether Islam teaches this. I teach several Muslim students in a Catholic university, mainly women who are religious, and they don’t appear to be oppressed. It is too easy, in my view, to be critical of other religions as an outside observer. Many say that certain Orthodox Jews oppress women and shun apostates as well, without any real understanding of the moral values and principles of the religion.
 
meltzerboy said:
True, but they also presumably live according to the tenets of Islam.
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This is the exact error I speak of.

They cannot practice true Islam in Anerica, they’d be arrested. Look to the rest of the world. Look to the countries that are Islamic theocracies. Look to the countries that have chosen sharia law by popular opinion.

You can argue that they have the wrong interpretation of Islam I guess, but they would say the same of “Americanized muslims”. History would tend to side with the Muslim countries interpretation.

It should also be noted that the 120 imams that wrote an open letter to the Islamic state did not decry the right of Muslims to form a state, or to tax Christians, instead they condemned Islamic states methods.
That should make everyone feel uneasy.
 
meltzerboy said:
I agree with Ben Affleck on this issue. Terrorists are not representative of any religion, and they come in all forms: Christian IRA terrorists in Northern Ireland, Jewish terrorist supporters of the late Rabbi Meir Kahane, Muslim members of terrorist organizations such as ISIS and Al Qaeda, etc.
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I was annoyed when Affleck, a straight, white, non-Muslim male, pulled the islamophobia/racist card on Maher and the other guest.
 
SuperLuigi said:
I was annoyed when Affleck, a straight, white, non-Muslim male, pulled the islamophobia/racist card on Maher and the other guest.
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I’m not sure what it is that causes people to so quickly ignore a constitution that calls for the subjugation and discrimination of Christians, Jews and Atheists under said constitution’s law.

Imagine if we had it written in the American constitution to fight a group until they pay a tax and feel subdued; simply for being a different group.

Discrimination based on Religion is terrible; why do Liberals support this? Why, why why?
 
meltzerboy said:
I question whether Islam teaches this. I teach several Muslim students in a Catholic university, mainly women who are religious, and they don’t appear to be oppressed. It is too easy, in my view, to be critical of other religions as an outside observer. Many say that certain Orthodox Jews oppress women and shun apostates as well, without any real understanding of the moral values and principles of the religion.
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A quick google search will turn up how Islam views a woman in relation to a man and the Quran has several passages referring to the treatment of infidels.
 
meltzerboy said:
I question whether Islam teaches this. I teach several Muslim students in a Catholic university, mainly women who are religious, and they don’t appear to be oppressed. It is too easy, in my view, to be critical of other religions as an outside observer. Many say that certain Orthodox Jews oppress women and shun apostates as well, without any real understanding of the moral values and principles of the religion.
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That is a very good case based entirely in anecdotal evidence.
 
Poor Ben! He is so full of himself. What a show off!
Trying to prove how intellectual he is. Big Hollywood star defending Islam. This is the first time I applaud Bill Maher. I don’t usually watch Bill’s show, but I saw a clip of the show.

I always remember the video Ben made with Jennifer Lopez when they were Bennifer. Ben’s ego is quite huge.

Ben should not do shows like this. He should stick to poker.
 
Some good discussion. Its intriguing how opposing groups can find common causes (new atheists & xtian right).

Its why I believe were doomed to repeat our failures on MENA when our leaders continue the Islam is a religion of peace mantra and have no probs working with saudi arabia/qatar and so on.
 
Sceptical_John said:
Some good discussion. Its intriguing how opposing groups can find common causes (new atheists & xtian right).

Its why I believe were doomed to repeat our failures on MENA when our leaders continue the Islam is a religion of peace mantra and have no probs working with saudi arabia/qatar and so on.
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And don’t forget the political-expediency actions our government often engages in. Yes, I agree with you: strange bedfellows. I might add that Bill Maher is just as likely to put down Christian religion when the opportunity arises, so he is no paragon of unbiased attitudes in this arena.
 
meltzerboy said:
It is my own view and not meant to be an exacting scientific study of Islam and other religions. We form opinions in part based on anecdotal evidence.
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Of course, but if you were teaching school in Iran, and their were no girls in your class and they found out you were Jewish and executed you, your anecdotal perspective would change right.

So, if you looked at Islam by country you would find a very large number who are more like Iran than American Muslims.
 
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