Bishop Denies Communion While Kneeling

  • Thread starter Thread starter CSPaxChristi
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
I agree on giving the Benefit of the doubt and prayer. ignorance may be a satisfactory defense yet it does not relieve him of the duty to be accountable for the action and take steps to mitigate the damage to the faith, the faithful and the diocesen clergy.
An action by a Bishop during a televised Mass that rejects what the church has declared loud and clear and which the Pope himself just recently commented on must be addressed by this Bishop in the same manner. The Bishop needs to be obedient to what the Church has taught. The folks denied communion were not disobedient. if this Bishop was sincerely mistaken then he’s surely now aware that his action Is perceived as public dissent and rebellion by a Bishop on a matter the church has settled.
If this was the Chrism Mass then this public action was also a statement to all the clergy that they too are free to deny the faithful what the church has termed a right( good not to be denied). The fact is that regardless of his intent, knowledge or lack thereof he just made a very public statement against the Church and The rock on which it was built. It is the Bishops duty to the Lord and His Church to publically admit his mistake, reaffirm the churches position on the matter and apologize to those scandalized by it.
The Lord was very clear on the humility required of His shepards. When we are given any degree of that grace of humility and are able to freely admit our errors and mistakes the Lord is delighted. “I was unaware, I did this, this was wrong I am sorry and wanted to make sure you know the truth on the matter…from me.
If a Bishop Is unable to publically ackniwledge a public error and make public correction to mitigate the damage- regardless of his motive or knowledge then he lacks very basic leadership 101. Instead of demanding more from leadership…people tell the sheep to keep quite. All the while souls are at stake.
I dont kneel when I recieve but wholely respect and even take delight in those that do.
 
We do not know what has happened prior to this filmed happening. Heck, the idea that it WAS filmed makes me suspicious that could have been an attempt to “gotcha” the Bishop.
 
TheLittleLady said:
We do not know what has happened prior to this filmed happening. Heck, the idea that it WAS filmed makes me suspicious that could have been an attempt to “gotcha” the Bishop.
Click to expand...
No one in the Communion line seems at all surprised or startled. And as the deacon mentioned, who would be filming behind the Bishop?

Too many questions.
 
Last edited:
Diaconia said:
There is something odd about the video itself - the footage was shot from behind Bishop Aos. Who made the video? It seems unlikely that one of the ministers was standing behind the bishop with his iPhone.
Click to expand...
This was my very first thought. Who would be behind him, and that close yet, with an iphone? Was someone trying to catch him or did he ask someone to video tape him? Nothing makes sense about this video.

There are many ways even amateurs can edit videos today. When the people come for communion after that man, who I guess is supposedly still on his knees, no one seems to be watching out to make sure they don’t trip over him. They don’t pause. They don’t hesitate or even look down at the man.

I think it is odd. Not too long ago I wasn’t allowed to kneel so I know it can be disheartening but this is odd to have someone videotaping.
 
Last edited:
Yes. The Pope received the resignation of every Chilean bishop and accepted some and rejected some. The Pope has more first hand knowledge of Chilean bishops than any Pope ever. Every single bishop in Chile currently was looked at and placed or remained in his position personally by the Pope himself. So we will see if the Pope corrects this…
 
Last edited:
TheLittleLady said:
We do not know what has happened prior to this filmed happening. Heck, the idea that it WAS filmed makes me suspicious that could have been an attempt to “gotcha” the Bishop.
Click to expand...
This is a good point. But if it really happened we should have no issue saying a bishop was “wrong” we should not judge his motivations as wrong but the actions captured were wrong. Regardless of motive somebody somewhere thought “I need to record this” and did.
 
If it was filmed deceptively and he did not in fact deny the faithful communion for kneeling. He should say as much. If he did deny the faithful communion for kneeling he needs to acknowledge, apologize and reaffirm the churches well established position. It was the Chrism Mass. The perception alone (if the film is bogus) that the Bishop-at that significant Mass in the liturgical calender where all priests are present and the church universal is up front and center, denied the faithful communion for kneeling, in contradiction, rejection, denial, rebellion or sheer ignorance of the Church’s decision on the matter requires this Bishop make a public acknowledgement, correction and apology for the damage- percieved or real. Until He does the damage continues. Again- souls are at stake.
 
Bushum said:
Some people here would attempt to justify a bishop punching a parishioner in the face during communion.
Click to expand...
It’s the punch of the Lord! He was just reminding me of my confirmation and the challenge of being a Christian soldier in the Church Militant. Excuse me while I put some ice on this…
 
From what I can find out, this is an excerpt from a video of the Chrism Mass which was released by the Archdiocese itself. I can only surmise that the Archdiocese had the Mass videotaped which makes the vantage point for the filming of Communion not that odd.
 
CapitalistCatholic said:
To think. No more than 60 years ago, kneeling was the norm.
Click to expand...
Sixty years ago, I wasn’t sixty years old with wonky knees. Kneeling isn’t an issue. Getting back up, is unless I have something to prop myself back up. I suspect this is increasingly the case in the West, as the population ages.

At the abbey where I attend Mass, there is a gentleman who mistakenly thinks the cloister barrier is a communion rail. It isn’t. He kneels at it. The monks are indulgent and come over and give him communion, but he is extremely disruptive. He crowds people in the first pew, his legs stretch out into ours, and makes it impossible for people to flow back to their pews in a circle as they normally do, because they have to step over him as they walk past, or are completely blocked as he’s crowding people in first pew and there’s no easy way around. Last week at Easter Mass this fellow cause an enormous problem with the flow of communicants, forcing people to walk back down the central aisle which they had come up, making the lines 3 wide instead of 2-wide, because the monks didn’t notice him at first. This week the monks clued in and came to give him communion first before anyone else.

The normal procedure is to come up the centre or the side aisles to receive from one of the priests: two rows up the centre aisle, and 1 each up the two side aisles. There’s no problem kneeling doing that if you can make it back up under your own steam, many do so. I do not because it would be very awkward for me, and reverence is a matter of attitude not posture.

In general the flow works better if everyone is doing the same thing. I should also point out that in the days when monasteries had papal enclosures (pre-V II) there was no communion rail. The grille’s gates were opened in the centre aisle, and people processed up the centre to receive.
 
Proably a simple solution to getting up and down with more ease and not causing problems during the flow to communion would be an altar rail, even just a simple small kneeler. It doesn’t need to go all along the sanctuary. In this way people would have the choice to kneel or not kneel and would have something to help them up as they age and have bad knees (me).

We have a parish in our community that has just that. It works great unless the priest doesn’t want people to kneel and then goes and stands way over to the side where there is no where to kneel, which is what happened to me and the other parishioners once during daily Mass. It was a visiting priest and did not want any one to use the kneeler so he moved way to the left.
 
Off topic: Austerity in church aesthetics isn’t usually my thing, but man that is a stunning abbey! You’re lucky to worship there.
 
Personal opinion, just bring back the altar rails, on the tongue, and patens. Just this Sunday we had 4 people walk away from altar with the host. They were approached and asked to consume the host. It’s an excommunicable offense to walk out with the host.

Pretty much solidified my opinion a few years ago when people were trying to sell the Eucharist on eBay. The Eucharist has also been known to be used in black masses.

Besides it just seems more humble and reverent; kneeler, tongue, paten.

Peace and God bless
Nicene
 
Bushum said:
Some people here would attempt to justify a bishop punching a parishioner in the face during communion.
Click to expand...
And some people here would attempt to characterize a bishop reaching out to shake hands as an attempted assault. Just sayin’… 😉
AlbertDerGrosse said:
It’s been two days now and no corroboration whatsoever that this actually happened the way the narrative says so. Is nobody skeptical of this?
Click to expand...
Nah. I mean, Voris is well-known by everyone to be a straight-shooting, never-editorializing, never-sensationalist reporter, right? 🤣 :roll_eyes:
Nicene said:
Just this Sunday we had 4 people walk away from altar with the host. They were approached and asked to consume the host. It’s an excommunicable offense to walk out with the host.
Click to expand...
I think you mean that one is excommunicated if he desecrates the host, and it’s your presumption that this is what these people were attempting, by walking away.

(It’s more likely that they weren’t Catholic, and that’s the custom at their denomination – take the host and walk away and consume in the pews.)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top