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Wolseley
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Maybe I’ll go from 5.56mm to .50-caliber…
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bpbasilphx
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<<but they do believe in the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob.>>
No, they do not. Neither Jews nor Muslims believe this.
Christians believe that the God of Abraham is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
I confess there is no God but Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and Jesus is God Incarnate!
No, they do not. Neither Jews nor Muslims believe this.
Christians believe that the God of Abraham is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
I confess there is no God but Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and Jesus is God Incarnate!
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Peregrino
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You can neither prove this statement any more than I can disprove it. You obviously do not like the idea that Christians and Muslims pray to the same Creator. I happen to believe that they do. In fact, I happen to believe that God is one, there is one truth and as many ways of worshipping God and realizing that truth as there are ways to describe God, whether it be Allah, YHWH, Tao or whatever.
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Contarini
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Contarini
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Rodrigo,
Your sarcastic rhetoric reveals the bankruptcy of your position. You have no arguments, because there are none. We all know that “Allah” was the word Jews and Christians used for God before Muslims came along. So what’s the argument about? I agree that for non-Arabic and non-Muslim speakers to use the word is silly. But to claim that “Allah” is not the name of the Christian God is to insult and deride Arabic-speaking Christians. Don’t you think they have enough trouble dealing with Muslims without their fellow-Christians attacking them in this vicious way?
This is separate from the issue of whether Muslims worship our God, although you don’t have very strong arguments there either–the example of the Jews is pretty conclusive (since you have to say either that OT Jews didn’t worship the God we do or that rejection of Jesus constituted a shift in the God Jews worshiped), apart from the inherent problem in saying that any two monotheists worship “different gods.”
No, you really have no case. No wonder you get rude and sarcastic.
In Christ,
Edwin
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Contarini
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Where are you getting this claim? I have only seen it made on fundamentalist websites, and even then the only evidence they present is that supposedly some worshipers of the Babylonian moon god Sin referred to him as “el ilah,” meaning “the god.” In other words, even if these fundamentalist propagandists have done their research properly, it is clear that “Allah” was never the name proper to the moon god, but rather a general word for God applied to the moon god by those who saw him as the supreme god.
If you have better evidence, I am happy to look at it.
In orthodox Christian theology, there is also a sense in which God is unknown and unknowable. You are making too facile a dichotomy here.
That is not what Muslims say they believe. Frankly, I will believe them over you when it comes to a question of how they see God.
Unquestionably true, but of course Jews side with Muslims on this one!
Edwin
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Contarini
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“Reformation” is a badly chosen term for what liberal Muslims want to see. There was a counterpart to the Protestant Reformation–the Wahhabi/Salafi movement beginning in the late 18th century–and it is the source of many of our current problems!
Edwin
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dessert
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Yes I do believe they were invited and I want to follow our leadership. JPII went to the wall and Pope Benedict XVI goes to the mosque what is next.
The CCC 841 states those who acknowledge the Creator, ( could mean like or similar to the Native Americans, great spirit) and it puts them (all that acknowledge this)( muslims)in the first place but those who acknowledge and( Profess) to holdthe faith of Abraham (it doesn’t include the others ) but if you think about it Ishmael is a step son in our american language., and together with us, they adore the one, ( together ?) (with us?)
merciful God( isn’t the Pope including them together in worship)
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eagle_55
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Contrary to what the Quran (or Koran) states; the God of Abraham, Isaac, and David is NOT allah. Allah is/was a pagan god,[not identified] in the area where Muhammad was born and raised.
If we all start calling God allah, we are reducing him to pagan status.
As stated in other post, if we are to refer to God in the first person it should as I AM. Personally I prefer to address God as Father; as Jesus instructed, or simply Sir, when I speak to him.
If we all start calling God allah, we are reducing him to pagan status.
As stated in other post, if we are to refer to God in the first person it should as I AM. Personally I prefer to address God as Father; as Jesus instructed, or simply Sir, when I speak to him.
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Contarini
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So Arabic Christians and Jews long before Muhammad did not know what they were doing when they used the word “Allah” to denote the God of Abraham? Sorry, but I think I’ll trust them over you.
Edwin
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Gottle_of_Geer
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Why don’t we show our friendliness to the Kemetic Orthodox by calling the BVM Isis, & Jesus, Horus 
?
For the same reasons we can’t call God Allah in a European setting:- it would be needlessly ambiguous
- God as a name within Christianity can stand either for:
- God the Blessed Trinity
or - One of the Divine Persons.
As Muslim theism is not Trinitarian, but anti-Trinitarian, for Christians to call God Allah would be a recipe for confusion.
The Blessed Trinity is already difficult to think of: to choose alien words from a religion which is anti-Trinitarian would not ease the difficulty, for faith & words cannot be separated - as we speak, so we tend to believe. If we speak only of “Allah” - we could lose faith in the Blessed Trinity.
Besides, our theology is sophisticated, because it needs to be; & this is because it is an expression of a very rich, inexhaustible, revelation. To Islamise our theological language, would lead to the impoverishment of our ability to express our Faith.
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dessert
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**Can’t leave out the Catholic version **
RSV CE
Exodus 3; 13
Then Moses said to God,“If I come to the people of Israel and say to them,“The God of your fathers has sent me to you, and they ask me. 'what is his name?'what shalI say to them?”
14; God ssaid to Moses, " I am who I am.” And he said, "Say this to the people of Israel, ‘I am has sent me to you.’ "
15; God aalso said to Moses, "Say this to the people of Israel, "the LORD, the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Issac , and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you; this is my name forever, and thus I am to be remembered throughout all generations
So the CCC does not include all of the text on purpose I think
The word LORD when spelled with capital letters stands for the divine name, YHWH , which is here conneced with the verb hayah, to beRSV CE
I am who am; apparently this utterance is the source of the word Yahweh, the proper personal name of the God of Israel. It is commonly explained in reference to God as the absolute neccessary Being. It may be understood of God as the source of all created beings. Out of reverence for this name, the term adonai,“my Lord” was later used as a substitute. The word Lord in the present version represents this traditional usage. The word “Jehovah” arose from a false reading of this name as it is written in the current Hebrew text. narrative NAB
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Gottle_of_Geer
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If God had revealed His Name as being allah, there might be a case for Christians to use it.
But He did not - not in any book Christians recognise; so there is as much reason for us to believe that Allah is a revealed Name of God as to believe that Joseph Smith is a true prophet: none at all. Allah is no different from any other of the “high gods” of antiquity - they are no more & no less the God revealed in Christ than he is. The bishop might with equal appropriateness expect Christians to worship Baal. Baal had plenty of similarities to the God of Israel - more than Allah, probably.
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terri_fortner
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My sister and I were talking about this earlier today. I think that the easiest thing and most gracious thing and most Christian thing to do would be to accept that when I am in an Arabic speaking nation and I am speaking their native tongue, then I will be calling God Allah, but as long as I am speaking English then I’ll call him God. Unless I am calling him Father or Lord or Almighty. Just like if I was speaking german I would call God, “Gott” 
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eagle_55
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I will concede that Arabic Christians and Jews used the name Allah, long before Muhammad, however read my post again,Contrary to what the Quran (or Koran) states; the God of Abraham, Isaac, and David is NOT allah. *(As identified in the qu’ran)*Muhammad introduced Islam into an Arabia that was a flurry of cultures and religions. Muhammad’s own tribe, the Quraysh, was pagan. The Quraysh was based in the city of Mecca. The Quraysh did a lucrative trade from the pilgrimages to the local shrine, the Ka’bah, which housed numerous pagan idols – chiefly the image of the god Hubal. The local gods of all the area tribes were represented in the shrine, along with other idols identified with trees and stones near the Ka’bah. One of these gods, “allah”, not yet identified with the lone god of Islam, may have been the tribal god of the Quraysh.
Also since Muhammad, allah describes the god of Islam only. The true meaning/origin of allah is probably lost to history.
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bpbasilphx
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<<So Arabic Christians and Jews long before Muhammad did not know what they were doing when they used the word “Allah” to denote the God of Abraham? Sorry, but I think I’ll trust them over you.>>
The Arabic word “Allah” in and of itself means “God”–as in the Trisagioni hymn, as I said earlier.
But context is something to consider. And Christians, Jews, and Muslims clearly do NOT mean the same thing by the word “Allah/God”.
And the Trisagion hymn is considered to be a Trinitarian hymn, even when singing “Qudusson Allah”.
The Arabic word “Allah” in and of itself means “God”–as in the Trisagioni hymn, as I said earlier.
But context is something to consider. And Christians, Jews, and Muslims clearly do NOT mean the same thing by the word “Allah/God”.
And the Trisagion hymn is considered to be a Trinitarian hymn, even when singing “Qudusson Allah”.
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paarsurrey
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Hi
The name does not matter much, it is the attributes which are different and need to be reconciled and researched. The attributes of the CatholicGod and the JewishGod are miles apart, or the difference is of the East and the West, though they read the same OTBible.
Thanks
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Rbt_Southwell
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dessert
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Christians and Jews both celebrate the passover, both have traditions.
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Rodrigo_Bivar
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Please keep your opinion to yourself. I don’t care that you think I’m rue and sarcastic. I think i have made my point clear: the Islamic Allah is not the God of Jesus Christ - unless you think the God of Jesus Christ would make Christians into second class citizens, calling for them to be humiliated by Muslims.
It is Allah who caused the poor Christians of the Middle East to have to open their mouths so that the Muslim jizyah collector can spit into their mouths while collecting the Jizyah, or other similiar humiliations.
It is Allah who caused the poor Christians of the Middle East to have to put up with not repairing their churches or build new ones.
BTW: the fact that the Arab Jews and Christians use the word “Allah” before Muhammad is irrelevant since their Christian Allah is not the Islamic Allah. Words changed. The word, ‘Allah’, was hijacked by Muhammad (the spawn of Satan) to denote his personal god (i.e. Satan).
The issue here is NOT the use of Allah to denote the Christian concept of God. It is a dhimmified use of the word Allah to denote the islamic concept of their god and hoodwink Christians into believing that the Muslim god is the same as the God of Jesus Christ.
This is what I’m against - the deliberate misuse of the word Allah in some misguided SYMPATHY for Islam.
At the risk of using an analogy - I think a similar hijacking of a word can be seen by the use of the word “gay”. Before the homosexuals appropriate this word to mean “homosexual” gay meant happy. But now, the word gay no longer means happy - it means HOMOSEXUAL.
Likewise, the word “Allah” pre-Islam meant the God of Jesus Christ (to Arab Christians). But once Muhammad hijacked it - Allah no longer means the God of Jesus Christ.
I hope you will see this point.
Hence I am not insulting Arab Christians who use the word Allah to mean God as this was the original meaning of the word. That was not the point of the bishop’s plea. He didn’t say use the word Allah to be sympathetic to the Arab Christians. He said to use the word Allah to be sympathetic to the Islamic god.
This is the god that tells Muslims to humiliate you. Muslims understand this to mean SPITTING in your mouth while they collect the jizyah, or some similar humiliation.
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