Bishop won't allow funeral for club owner

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Bishop won’t allow funeral for club owner

The owner of a popular local nightclub with a gay clientele can’t have a funeral in the Roman Catholic Diocese of San Diego because the church has deemed his business “inconsistent with Catholic moral teaching.” None of the 98 Catholic churches in San Diego or Imperial counties will be allowed to provide services for Club Montage owner John McCusker as a result of the decision by San Diego Bishop Robert Brom.
 
Good for him! It’s nice to see a stand for Church teaching taking place in southern California.
 
The diocese said that it was not the fact that the man was homosexual, but his business that was inconsistent with Catholic teachings.

Good. Let the diocese be consisent, and also forbid funeral services for Catholic druggists who sell contraceptives, Catholic physicians who prescribe contraceptives, Catholic magazine store owners who carry salacious magazines, etc.

Take a stand in the entire business community.
 
This is some tough medicine! My reservation about this action stems not so much from sympathy for the deceased, but out of recognition that the funeral mass is also for the benefit of his/her surviving and grieving family–who may themselves be very devout, practicing Catholics. When I apply it my own family, it would be a profound bit of torture to some older and very devout relatives to not have the benefit of a Catholic funeral mass. Particularly in a case like this, that sentiment may be even more intense because of the openly sinful lifestyle of the deceased and the hope that there was repentance and mercy.

Is anyone aware if there is a teaching on the effect on the soul of the deceased, if any, of having been denied access to funeral mass?
 
Island Oak:
Is anyone aware if there is a teaching on the effect on the soul of the deceased, if any, of having been denied access to funeral mass?
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General Church teaching is that we do not know the state of anyone’s soul. I don’t think it would be different in the case of a refused funeral, be it for the reasons this mass was denied, or if refusal for suicide (which is the historically most common reason for refusal, I’d imagine). There’s also been many times that funeral masses were simply not available to be said, and we don’t think any differently on those individuals as we would for someone who had a funeral mass.
 
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Richardols:
The diocese said that it was not the fact that the man was homosexual, but his business that was inconsistent with Catholic teachings.

Good. Let the diocese be consisent, and also forbid funeral services for Catholic druggists who sell contraceptives, Catholic physicians who prescribe contraceptives, Catholic magazine store owners who carry salacious magazines, etc.

Take a stand in the entire business community.
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If any one is guily of manifest sin they should be denied a funeral mass. Why should those who lead scandalous lives not be denied?
 
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fix:
If any one is guily of manifest sin they should be denied a funeral mass. Why should those who lead scandalous lives not be denied?
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Say no more. Indeed!

Besides, they can always have a priest read prayers at graveside.
 
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Richardols:
Say no more. Indeed!

Besides, they can always have a priest read prayers at graveside.
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Quite true! As you propose, there are always way to undermine the Church. Thanks for pointing this avenue out.

Fiat
 
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Fiat:
Quite true! As you propose, there are always way to undermine the Church. Thanks for pointing this avenue out.
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The Church has always, to the best of my knowledge, allowed a priest to say prayers at graveside, even as it denied a funeral Mass for such deceased. Are you claiming that this generous act by the Church is somehow undermining? The Church can and does deny public ceremonies without denying the comfort to the families of private prayer by a priest.
 
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fix:
If any one is guily of manifest sin they should be denied a funeral mass. Why should those who lead scandalous lives not be denied?
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What about the issue I raised about surviving family members? What is the teaching on the purpose of perfoming a funeral mass? Is it for the benefit of survivors or blessing of the deceased? Survivors may be very devout and can’t be expected to control the conduct of another adult. Don’t they deserve the prayers offered at the funeral mass or is possible scandal the trump card?
 
I am absolutely shocked by the lack of charity on this board today! A Friday in Lent even. How dare anyone guess the disposition of any one soul. That is for God alone to do. The Church has proclaimed many saints (those we know for certain to be in heaven). However, I have never once heard the Church proclaiming someone to be in hell. The Church should fight for each and every soul, let none slip away to satan.

I am disgusted!
 
Lurch, who is being uncharitable? I’m asking in all sincerity–I do not see anyone being uncharitable on this thread. No one has said that anyone’s soul was going to Hell or guessed at the disposition of anyone’s soul, so I have no idea where you got that idea.

Canon law quite clearly states that a funeral mass can (must, even) be denied if the deceased was a manifest sinner whose funeral rites cannot be granted without public scandal. That does not in any way mean that the person is going to Hell. It’s just saying that their actions on earth were such that to give funeral rites would be to cause scandal among the faithful.
 
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Fiat:
Quite true! As you propose, there are always way to undermine the Church. Thanks for pointing this avenue out.

Fiat
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This was posted in regard to a priest praying at the graveside.

I would say that this is most uncharitable. No one, not Hitler, no one is beyond our prayers. Jesus died for all of us, no matter how far gone we think ourselves or each other to be.
 
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Lurch104:
This was posted in regard to a priest praying at the graveside.

I would say that this is most uncharitable. No one, not Hitler, no one is beyond our prayers. Jesus died for all of us, no matter how far gone we think ourselves or each other to be.
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Lurch:
What wasn’t clarified, but which Richardols later clarified in his/her successive post was the “private” nature of the action!! I have not found anything in canon law the forbids priests from privately offering prayers for whomever they wish. However, a mass is NEVER the priest’s possession alone. The Mass belongs to Holy Mother Church.

Fiat
 
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Lurch104:
This was posted in regard to a priest praying at the graveside.

I would say that this is most uncharitable. No one, not Hitler, no one is beyond our prayers. Jesus died for all of us, no matter how far gone we think ourselves or each other to be.
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Lurch:
What wasn’t clarified, but which Richardols later clarified in his/her successive post was the “private” nature of the action!! I have not found anything in canon law that forbids priests from privately offering prayers for whomever they wish. However, a mass, funeral or otherwise, is NEVER the priest’s possession alone. The Mass belongs to Holy Mother Church.

Fiat
 
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Fiat:
Lurch:
What wasn’t clarified, but which Richardols later clarified in his/her successive post was the “private” nature of the action!! I have not found anything in canon law that forbids priests from privately offering prayers for whomever they wish. However, a mass, funeral or otherwise, is NEVER the priest’s possession alone. The Mass belongs to Holy Mother Church.

Fiat
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By definition a mass is communal in nature. That is why priests are told not to hold ‘private masses’ anymore and to have at least 1 person in attendance.
 
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gilliam:
By definition a mass is communal in nature. That is why priests are told not to hold ‘private masses’ anymore and to have at least 1 person in attendance.
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Yes. In my own parish, an associate priest would often conduct an early Saturday morning mass for himself, but he was told that he at least needed to open the door of the adjacent adoration chapel where we have perpetual adoration so that at least one other person was in attendance.

Do you know whether those priests on hermitage receive a dispensation for this?

Fiat
 
What about the issue I raised about surviving family members? What is the teaching on the purpose of perfoming a funeral mass? Is it for the benefit of survivors or blessing of the deceased? Survivors may be very devout and can’t be expected to control the conduct of another adult. Don’t they deserve the prayers offered at the funeral mass or is possible scandal the trump card?
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Requiem Masses are for the soul of the deceased. They are not for the survivors. The survivors may pay stipends to a priest to have Masses said for the soul of the deceased at a later time, and I would expect that if they are devout Catholics they would do this very charitable act. The souls of the departed are presumed to be in Purgatory, and are therefore in sore need of our prayers and many Masses. I would recommend a prayer from each listmember for the soul of Mr. John McCusker.

Eternal rest grant unto him, O Lord, and let perpetual light shine upon him.
 
gilliam said:
Bishop won’t allow funeral for club owner

The owner of a popular local nightclub with a gay clientele can’t have a funeral in the Roman Catholic Diocese of San Diego because the church has deemed his business “inconsistent with Catholic moral teaching.” None of the 98 Catholic churches in San Diego or Imperial counties will be allowed to provide services for Club Montage owner John McCusker as a result of the decision by San Diego Bishop Robert Brom.
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good…maybe he can be buried over in the middle east somewhere…perhaps near where Sadom was.
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