Bl. JP II imminent canonization?

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ellzeena

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Just read a report on CNN that Blessed John Paul II is about to be canonized. It seems they have been studying the second miracle attributed to him, a woman in Costa Rica who suffered a very serious brain injury. I’m unsure of any details except that this is now (as reported) awaiting the Cardinals and Pope Francis actions.
👍
 
Just read a report on CNN that Blessed John Paul II is about to be canonized. It seems they have been studying the second miracle attributed to him, a woman in Costa Rica who suffered a very serious brain injury. I’m unsure of any details except that this is now (as reported) awaiting the Cardinals and Pope Francis actions.
👍
The talk is in Oct 2013! I believe it will be this year.
 
Hopefully the Holy See will clarify the public acts he did and public statements he made that have scandalized so many of the faithful.
 
Hopefully the Holy See will clarify the public acts he did and public statements he made that have scandalized so many of the faithful.
He is a Blessed, be careful what you say about the man who will soon be Canonized!
 
He is a Blessed, be careful what you say about the man who will soon be Canonized!
I simply stated that there many acts and statements that JPII did and said that clarification from Rome would be of great benefit to many of the faithful, that’s all. In other words, he is being canonized NOT because of these acts and statements would be helpful to many Catholics.
 
I love Blessed John Paul II. He was a very holy man as is clear by the fact that he was beatified and will soon be canonized. I am so happy that he will be canonized soon!
 
I simply stated that there many acts and statements that JPII did and said that clarification from Rome would be of great benefit to many of the faithful, that’s all. In other words, he is being canonized NOT because of these acts and statements would be helpful to many Catholics.
It wouldn’t be “helpful” to any Catholics I know. Blessed JPll is the primary reason that I came back to the Church. If you are referring to his act of kissing the Quoran, I think you are out of luck - that will not keep a very holy man from becoming a saint!:rolleyes:
 
It wouldn’t be “helpful” to any Catholics I know. Blessed JPll is the primary reason that I came back to the Church. If you are referring to his act of kissing the Quoran, I think you are out of luck - that will not keep a very holy man from becoming a saint!:rolleyes:
Well, I do know quite a few Catholics that have been scandalized. Just because you don’t know any doesn’t mean there aren’t any.

I won’t comment on the action you mentioned because I don’t want be censored, which seems to happen any time this subject comes up, from what I’ve observed. I’m glad God brought you back to His Church.
 
Hopefully the Holy See will clarify the public acts he did and public statements he made that have scandalized so many of the faithful.
And what statements do you reckon have scandalised so many of the faithful?

John Paul II was an amazing pope and an amazing human being. John Paul II did not scandalise any of the faithful (the fact that they didn’t like what he did, doesn’t make it scandal). You, personally may have issues with some things he said or did, the Church has no such issues with anything he said or did (including kissing the Qu’ran) quite the contrary.
 
And what statements do you reckon have scandalised so many of the faithful?

John Paul II was an amazing pope and an amazing human being. John Paul II did not scandalise any of the faithful (the fact that they didn’t like what he did, doesn’t make it scandal). You, personally may have issues with some things he said or did, the Church has no such issues with anything he said or did (including kissing the Qu’ran) quite the contrary.
See above. I will not mention the many examples that can easily be researched because I would be censored by the moderators here. There are many that I have met (including priests) that find many of the statements and actions of JPII scandalizing. They exist. I’m sorry if that troubles you, but it is a fact.

I do not question his personal holiness. Only God knows that.
 
See above. I will not mention the many examples that can easily be researched because I would be censored by the moderators here. There are many that I have met (including priests) that find many of the statements and actions of JPII scandalizing. They exist. I’m sorry if that troubles you, but it is a fact.

I do not question his personal holiness. Only God knows that.
OK, so we get it, you appear to be part of a group founded in France that does not adhere or believe that anything the Church has done since the mid 60’s is legit, including 5 Popes. Take a look at JPll just in global political issues alone, he was a major force in the fall of the Eastern Block. If when you read JPll’s personal story and prayers you are not moved, then there is nothing that any of us plain o’l Catholics can do to change your mind.🤷
 
OK, so we get it, you appear to be part of a group founded in France that does not adhere or believe that anything the Church has done since the mid 60’s is legit, including 5 Popes. Take a look at JPll just in global political issues alone, he was a major force in the fall of the Eastern Block. If when you read JPll’s personal story and prayers you are not moved, then there is nothing that any of us plain o’l Catholics can do to change your mind.🤷
I am a member of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church. I have never met an SSPX priest in my life, if that’s what you’re getting at, nor assist at their Masses. Btw, you are speaking falsities about the SSPX, who are our Catholic brothers. They recognize the council and all the popes thereafter as the supreme pontiffs. Be careful about spreading false info about other Catholics.

I have read quite a bit of JPII and know about is story early in life. I have several of his books in my library. Nevertheless, he has done and said some things that scandalized quite a few Catholics I know, including priests, priests that are in full communion with Rome. I can’t cite the many examples, lest I be booted from here. Freedom of discussion only goes so far here.
 
I’m not staying around to debate this point, because I’m not in the best of health to debate anything these days. However, I think that there is a point that must be made here for the sake of those who are not Catholic or for Catholics who don’t understand how canonizations work.

Whether or not Bl. John Paul said or did anything that scandalized anyone becomes a mute issue as soon as the reigning pope says that he lived a life of extraordinary virtue and declares him venerable. At that point, the Church is no longer interested in any other opinions, not even the opinions of clergy. The pope has spoken and declared him venerable.

The next concern for the Church is two miracles that must be attributed to the Venerable and which cannot be attributed to any other saint. There are two parts to this. First part is that the Holy See has to declare that it’s a miracle. Here again, the Holy See is not interested in other opinions once it hears out all of the scientists and witnesses involved. There was a big issue made over Bl. Mother Teresa’s miracle, because one doctor said that the patient was cured by something else. The pope didn’t care what the doctor said. It’s the pope who decides whether it’s a miracle or not, not the doctor. The doctor is simply a professional who gives his professional opinion along with other professionals. But the faith of the Church does not depend only on professional opinions.

Once that first miracle is proven, the pope can order a beatification or do it himself. Then the Church waits for a second miracle and the process of assessing the miracle is repeated. Once the pope says that it is a miracle, the process is over. Then it’s a matter of inscribing the person into the canon of the saints and the liturgy of the Church. The pope can do that immediately or he can wait. That’s his call and no one is allowed to make any suggestions to him.

Having said all of this, there are some who argue that the process of canonization has changed and that it is deficient. This is not possible. Yes the process has changed. It is not possible for it to be deficient. A canonization depends wholly on the faith of Peter and the faith of the people of God, not on the process.

In other words, if Peter believes that a person is a saint, then he is. If the people of God, believe that a person is a saint, then he is. There is no requirement for miracles and investigations. These are strictly up to the reigning pope to use these systems or not. Many men and women have been canonized without an inquiry of any kind. In my own Franciscan tradition Francis of Assisi, Anthony of Padua, and Clare of Assisi were canonized without an inquiry and without a beatification. Many miracles were reported, but none were ever proven. The popes who canonized them were personal friends of the saints and knew of their holiness personally. They did not need any (name removed by moderator)ut from man, nor any proof from God. They had seen what God had done in the lives of these people with their own eyes.

Other saints were never canonized and never needed it, because the faith of the people says that they are saints. Among them are the Blessed Mother, St. Joseph, Jesus’ grandparents, the Apostles, the Fathers of the Church, the prophets of the Old Testament, the Patriarchs of Israel and a few other saints.

Scandal is only a concern for those who claim there is scandal. As far as the Holy See is concern, there is nothing that it found to be a scandal in the life of John Paul II. Therefore, the Holy See does not feel that need to offer an explanation for something that the Holy See says never happened.

What never happened? Bl. John Paul never did or said anything that the Church finds objectively scandalous. It considers the claims of scandal to be subjective. When such claims are subjective, the problem is no longer a problem of the Church, but one that the individual has to resolve for himself to bring himself into alignment with the Church.

Once the pope orders that all Catholics are to venerate Saint X and that all around the world are to celebrate a feast day and liturgy to commemorate his feast day and to pray to God through the saint’s intercession, there is no way that a Catholic cah bow out.

The Church does not command that I have a personal devotion to any saint. Which is good, because there are too many to have a personal relationship with all of them. But I am bound to venerate all of them. To venerate means that I must acknowledge that they are heroes of the faith worthy of veneration and imitation. I cannot say the contrary or I would be contradicting a statement of faith made by Peter, which statement is binding on all Catholics.
 
I’m not staying around to debate this point, because I’m not in the best of health to debate anything these days. However, I think that there is a point that must be made here for the sake of those who are not Catholic or for Catholics who don’t understand how canonizations work.

Whether or not Bl. John Paul said or did anything that scandalized anyone becomes a mute issue as soon as the reigning pope says that he lived a life of extraordinary virtue and declares him venerable. At that point, the Church is no longer interested in any other opinions, not even the opinions of clergy. The pope has spoken and declared him venerable.

The next concern for the Church is two miracles that must be attributed to the Venerable and which cannot be attributed to any other saint. There are two parts to this. First part is that the Holy See has to declare that it’s a miracle. Here again, the Holy See is not interested in other opinions once it hears out all of the scientists and witnesses involved. There was a big issue made over Bl. Mother Teresa’s miracle, because one doctor said that the patient was cured by something else. The pope didn’t care what the doctor said. It’s the pope who decides whether it’s a miracle or not, not the doctor. The doctor is simply a professional who gives his professional opinion along with other professionals. But the faith of the Church does not depend only on professional opinions.

Once that first miracle is proven, the pope can order a beatification or do it himself. Then the Church waits for a second miracle and the process of assessing the miracle is repeated. Once the pope says that it is a miracle, the process is over. Then it’s a matter of inscribing the person into the canon of the saints and the liturgy of the Church. The pope can do that immediately or he can wait. That’s his call and no one is allowed to make any suggestions to him.

Having said all of this, there are some who argue that the process of canonization has changed and that it is deficient. This is not possible. Yes the process has changed. It is not possible for it to be deficient. A canonization depends wholly on the faith of Peter and the faith of the people of God, not on the process.

In other words, if Peter believes that a person is a saint, then he is. If the people of God, believe that a person is a saint, then he is. There is no requirement for miracles and investigations. These are strictly up to the reigning pope to use these systems or not. Many men and women have been canonized without an inquiry of any kind. In my own Franciscan tradition Francis of Assisi, Anthony of Padua, and Clare of Assisi were canonized without an inquiry and without a beatification. Many miracles were reported, but none were ever proven. The popes who canonized them were personal friends of the saints and knew of their holiness personally. They did not need any (name removed by moderator)ut from man, nor any proof from God. They had seen what God had done in the lives of these people with their own eyes.

Other saints were never canonized and never needed it, because the faith of the people says that they are saints. Among them are the Blessed Mother, St. Joseph, Jesus’ grandparents, the Apostles, the Fathers of the Church, the prophets of the Old Testament, the Patriarchs of Israel and a few other saints.

Scandal is only a concern for those who claim there is scandal. As far as the Holy See is concern, there is nothing that it found to be a scandal in the life of John Paul II. Therefore, the Holy See does not feel that need to offer an explanation for something that the Holy See says never happened.

What never happened? Bl. John Paul never did or said anything that the Church finds objectively scandalous. It considers the claims of scandal to be subjective. When such claims are subjective, the problem is no longer a problem of the Church, but one that the individual has to resolve for himself to bring himself into alignment with the Church.

Once the pope orders that all Catholics are to venerate Saint X and that all around the world are to celebrate a feast day and liturgy to commemorate his feast day and to pray to God through the saint’s intercession, there is no way that a Catholic cah bow out.

The Church does not command that I have a personal devotion to any saint. Which is good, because there are too many to have a personal relationship with all of them. But I am bound to venerate all of them. To venerate means that I must acknowledge that they are heroes of the faith worthy of veneration and imitation. I cannot say the contrary or I would be contradicting a statement of faith made by Peter, which statement is binding on all Catholics.
Thank you.
 
Thank you, JR. Whatever ails you, I will pray for relief from your aflictions.
 
Bl. Pope John Paul II, Pray for Us!

I’ve been holding off on getting an Icon of His Holiness in hopes of a short date…

See, the halo is rendered differently for those beatified vs those canonized. I’m hoping soon to need to get another icon of Father Bishop-martyr Theodore Romzha; I’ve yet to see one of Blessed priest-martyr Ragheed.
 
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