Blah! Blah! Blah! ... All the talking during Mass

[mick321]

…The 4 TLM masses I have attended at separate parishes have been the exact opposite of what you describe. There are no missals provided so if you are not fluent in latin, you can still follow along, there was rampant talking at both services, most of the talk had nothing to do with the Mass, but about weekend plans. There were some kids, who even had the audacity to make a spitball, and start using it in Church! OBVIOUSLY (just like you TLMer love to point fingers at the NO mass) this was CAUSE BY the TLM mass…

The Extraordinary Form is not for everyone. If your family and friends are more comfortable attending the Novus Ordo in your home parish, that’s great. In the interest of charity, you may wish to gently remind them all that a Catholic Church is not a playpen.

Happy Holidays

 

[Zachary]

Meanwhile, I hope you all are as vocal about the blah blah blah in the world when it comes to real issues - like abortion.

I’m a father of 2 little ones. If someone tells me to keep my kids quiet, I tell them to move up front and leave the parenting to me. I want to raise my children with the Mass as part of their lives. This means they will attend and will make a fuss until they are old enough to understand what reverence is.

(PS - no family room and no one to watch them at 9AM Sundays.)

Sometimes we forget that not all humans are mature, respectful and reverant as the next. It doesn’t matter what kind of Mass you go to, someone is less quite that you.

 

[At_Trent]

Is there anything in the TLM that prevents people from talking?

Have you ever assisted a TLM Constantine ?

Yes, I have heard some chatter at the back of the church after a few TLM’s, but nothing like the OF. It is rare, and it’s usually those attending a TLM for their first time, or visiting the parish for the first time. Seldom, and I mean it is rare, do I ever hear it before Mass (TLM).

On Sundays here in town, even the most reverent parishes are full of chatter after the OF. At the two I usually go to on weekdays, there is seldom any chatter after either form. Those there, are there because they want to be, not to simply fulfill the obligation. On Sundays, at the OF, there are those there who just go through the motions.

After Mass, any Mass, there are those who pray, and anyone who ignores that fact and yaps away are rude. They have no respect for anyone but them self, and there is no way to defend their behavior. I don’t care how bad the weather is outside, the Nave is not the place for mundane chatter. Especially if the Tabernacle holds the Blessed Sacrament.

That said, if the pastor allows the post-Mass eruption, then the only thing one can do is ask him to remind the flock that they are in a holy place, and that they respect the spiritual needs of those who remain in the church, in prayer, after Mass.

If he isn’t willing to do that then I think it is within anyone’s right to find a more reverent parish if possible.
…

Apryl, if I were in your position and could not find a TLM or reverent parish, then I’d consider earplugs and pray audibly. And if someone interupts you, tell them to wait for you in the vestibule and "then we can chat ". You will probably get your point across the first time

…

People really should accept our churches for what they are, holy places of worship, and stop defending irreverence and telling pious Catholics who are minding their own business, and not bothering anyone, that they are nit-picking. One either believes in the Real Presence or not. If we do, then we should act like it while in the presence of the Most Blessed Sacrament, not to mention turning our thoughts and words to things of this world so soon after receiving Holy Communion.

Parish halls are a wonderful thing

 

[At_Trent]

Meanwhile, I hope you all are as vocal about the blah blah blah in the world when it comes to real issues - like abortion.

I’m a father of 2 little ones. If someone tells me to keep my kids quiet, I tell them to move up front and leave the parenting to me. I want to raise my children with the Mass as part of their lives. This means they will attend and will make a fuss until they are old enough to understand what reverence is.

(PS - no family room and no one to watch them at 9AM Sundays.)

Sometimes we forget that not all humans are mature, respectful and reverant as the next. It doesn’t matter what kind of Mass you go to, someone is less quite that you.

Children are children. If a parent makes an effort to control them and they still squirm and whatnot, I have no problem with that. God bless them and their parents for raising them Catholic. We do what we can.

If children are unruly during Mass and the parent(s) do nothing, then the parents would not have to tell me to move, I’d move anyway, hoping they would notice and take the hint.

Babies crying never bother me either. They are a gift

 

[odhiambo]

People who go to church to pray then spend the time gossiping with each other, need your pity and your prayers! They really do not understand the gift of prayers and the Holy Eucharist.
What you could do is very politely let them know that their chatter is disturbing others who want to pray. If they continue to talk or are unresponsive to you, leave it at that, you would have done your part in pointing out a wrong.
Do not forget that Satan has many ways of making sure that we do not get close to God.
The Church talkers may be serving other masters and have their own agendas!

 

[stevusmagnus]

I have not been to one Mass at the SSPX where there was ever a problem of chatter. This is the difference in having a truly Catholic ethos and reverence instilled in a “parish” through the Traditional teachings, devotions, practices of the Church. They were all designed over time to instill reverence.

Most NO parishes I’ve been to have the feel of Protestant gathering places where everyone is already saved and we’re simply gathering together for a memorial meal rememberance on Sunday. At a meal, people chat. At a sacrifice, people are reverent.

 

[nickybr38]

It seems to me whenever people share aproblem they’re having someone pops in with the solution to just leave and find a new parish.

I say don’t run from your problems, face them and figure out how to be a beacon of light in an otherwise confused mess.

Pray. Pray before going to the Church for Mass. Be an example. If people try to interrupt you to converse politely ask them to address you after Mass. If no one has ever taught them proper manners within the church how will they ever learn when they are only surrounded by people who are like minded?

When I first started attending Mass with my cousin she used to whisper gossip into my ear! The first two times I let it pass but the third time I took her aside after Mass and explained to her that it was just not appropriate. After that she hasn’t said a word in Mass again. And no, she’s not angry with me. She honestly didn’t realize she was gossiping!!!

I don’t think this is entirely an irreverence issue. I think people just aren’t taught proper manners. This society is rude and crude and of course that seeps into Mass! Why wouldn’t it? But, as I said already, how will anyone learn if no one is there to teach them?

 

[stevusmagnus]

It seems to me whenever people share aproblem they’re having someone pops in with the solution to just leave and find a new parish.

I say don’t run from your problems, face them and figure out how to be a beacon of light in an otherwise confused mess.

Pray. Pray before going to the Church for Mass. Be an example. If people try to interrupt you to converse politely ask them to address you after Mass. If no one has ever taught them proper manners within the church how will they ever learn when they are only surrounded by people who are like minded?

When I first started attending Mass with my cousin she used to whisper gossip into my ear! The first two times I let it pass but the third time I took her aside after Mass and explained to her that it was just not appropriate. After that she hasn’t said a word in Mass again. And no, she’s not angry with me. She honestly didn’t realize she was gossiping!!!

I don’t think this is entirely an irreverence issue. I think people just aren’t taught proper manners. This society is rude and crude and of course that seeps into Mass! Why wouldn’t it? But, as I said already, how will anyone learn if no one is there to teach them?

Nice thought. Unfortunately, it is completely unrealistic.

Can you imagine being a “beacon of light” and teaching people “proper manners” in the following parish??

rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2010/11/vatican-ii-moment-pre-party-mass.html

Much more likely Apryl will lose her faith first.

Apryl’s primary obligation would be to find a reverent Mass for the sake of her soul.

 

[pnewton]

I do not believe the TLM is more conducive to meditation as it is attractive to those who have less of an interest in chatter. That is not the only path though. If you can find the right priests there are those that educate their parish enough to curtail all the chatter. Talking is one of those things, whether at Mass or a restraunt where we take cues from those around us. The more who talk, the more who feel free to talk. The quieter it gets, the more conducive the environment to get quieter.

 

[stevusmagnus]

I do not believe the TLM is more conducive to meditation as it is attractive to those who have less of an interest in chatter. That is not the only path though. If you can find the right priests there are those that educate their parish enough to curtail all the chatter. Talking is one of those things, whether at Mass or a restraunt where we take cues from those around us. The more who talk, the more who feel free to talk. The quieter it gets, the more conducive the environment to get quieter.

The very nature of the TLM makes it more conducive to meditation than the NO, not just the types of people who go to each one.

The NO constantly requires verbal responses, is in English and audible so it is hard to meditate as you are being talked at the entire time, the priest is facing the people so it is human nature to look up and see what he is doing, you have Eucharistic Ministers moving about on the altar, typically some sort of English folksy hymn or worse, rock song, completely disconcerting you, etc.

The TLM includes copious amounts of silent reflection time and if it is a sung Mass there is gregorian chant and/or uplifting meditative Traditional Catholic music perfect to assist meditative prayer. There is simply no comparison.

The NO was constructed on a faulty notion of “active participation” meaning external acts which, over time simply become robotic and automatic. The TLM promotes true “active participation” of the mind and will during the Mass, uniting oneself to Christ on Calvary.

 

[nickybr38]

Nice thought. Unfortunately, it is completely unrealistic.

Can you imagine being a “beacon of light” and teaching people “proper manners” in the following parish??

rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2010/11/vatican-ii-moment-pre-party-mass.html

Much more likely Apryl will lose her faith first.

Apryl’s primary obligation would be to find a reverent Mass for the sake of her soul.

What IS unrealistic is running every time something is going on in Mass that we disagree with. You do NOT have to be surrounded by reverence to BE reverent. However, a certain amount of reverence is required to stave off irreverence. No one said being faithful would be easy - even at Mass.

 

[stevusmagnus]

What IS unrealistic is running every time something is going on in Mass that we disagree with. You do NOT have to be surrounded by reverence to BE reverent. However, a certain amount of reverence is required to stave off irreverence. No one said being faithful would be easy - even at Mass.

If the atmosphere is one of reverence and one or two people are chatting, I can see your point.

But if your parish Mass looks anything like the video, you need to get the heck out of there for the good of your own soul.

 

[Apryl]

They should be “little things” compared to the reason a person is at mass.

I am only talking about myself being distracted because of those little things. (I used to) I myself would not say anything to the distractors…some may though.

Ok… so you say that I should be able to not be distracted.

But I don’t know. I don’t have kids at home to ‘teach’ me the art of ignorinig those things. I can’t handle someone literally TOUCHING me when I’m kneeling in prayer. When I have some one just stand over me, it only bothers me if I happen to look up and seem them lording over me.

When someone is talking behind me, as the priest is consecrating before me. … that I can try to tune out. It’s aggravating. Esp when the person slips their s’s (like a Slitherin or something).

But when I’ve received the Eucharist and I’m trying to get back to my seat to pray, and a ‘well meaning person’ decides now is the time to grab my hand to shake it or to hug me since they are back at church after an absence, Or if I just have to wait on them to stop talking about getting over to the social hall to prepare for the fund raiser so that I can make my way back to the pew.

Again, I realize this is some shortcoming on my part (Oops… Is my sarcasm loose again), but I really would like a reaction… or even better, an explanation from some who are culprits themselves.

 

[Apryl]

Meanwhile, I hope you all are as vocal about the blah blah blah in the world when it comes to real issues - like abortion.

I’m a father of 2 little ones. If someone tells me to keep my kids quiet, I tell them to move up front and leave the parenting to me. I want to raise my children with the Mass as part of their lives. This means they will attend and will make a fuss until they are old enough to understand what reverence is.

(PS - no family room and no one to watch them at 9AM Sundays.)

Sometimes we forget that not all humans are mature, respectful and reverant as the next. It doesn’t matter what kind of Mass you go to, someone is less quite that you.

Um… first of all: yes, I’m as vocal when it comes to abortion AND euthanisia.

But before you get your panties in a twist: in no where in my original post did I mention CHILDREN and their normal child like behavior. Children should be children, and that is not a ‘disruption’.

What I am talking about is adults who choose to be disrespectful and continue to do so.

Please, don’t attack when no one was addressing you or your situation. If you are feeling ‘guilty’ or something, deal with that, but please don’t take it out on me, ok? I’m not the one.

 

[Denise1957]

If the atmosphere is one of reverence and one or two people are chatting, I can see your point.

But if your parish Mass looks anything like the video, you need to get the heck out of there for the good of your own soul.

I didn’t look at the video you posted a link to, but will assume that’s it’s a rather extreme example of what does sometimes happen at an OF mass. I don’t believe it’s proper to show extremes in order to prove a point.

While it may be more conducive to worship in an silent chapel, it isn’t absolutely necessary. Having to pray or meditate in a noisy church can be offered up for the good of one’s soul, or for the good of another’s soul. As Catholics, do we really have an absolute right to being comfortable?

Regarding the dialogue mass, when I attended a low mass at an SSPX chapel, it was always a dialogue mass, with a lot of active participation by the laity, in Latin.
Now that I attend an FSSP parish, the low mass on weekdays is quiet and peaceful, because there are only a few places where the laity participate.

 

[faithfully]

Personally, I see no problem with shooshing a person who is behind me talking. I’d do it in a move theatre, and I’d do it in Church.

With regards to being grabbed as you’re returning to the pew. I’d recommend a downward glance, hands FIRMLY clasped together.

I’d talk to the priest about talking to the Choir/band about NOT talking during mass. Is it possible they are using people that aren’t part of the church community? Maybe they are totally clueless???

My church is quite large. There is always a hum that emits from all the people. Which right now, I’m grateful for. My boys can get loud with their wiggles, it makes them NOT so obvious. The last church I went to, did not cater to children AT ALL. Mine were the only ones. It made their wiggles extremely obvious… and I’m sure extremely annoying.

I do think it’s important to consider attending a church that is more “you”. Like I said, my last church, the average age is probably 60, with MANY much older! All you hear are oxygen tanks. Although I made some fantastic friends. There was really little community for my youngish family.

However, where I"m at now… our choir of at least 30 members is DEAD SILENT during the entire mass, except when they are singing. Electronic piano that can sound like an organ, but usually like a grand, and a violin. Plus, on special occassions as it turns out… Bells (I can’t wait for Christmas)

 

[StTommyMore]

More reverence and the actual awareness and belief that God is in the tabernacle.

I call hogwash. I have been to beautiful, reverent, silent, OF Masses, and I have been to a TLM where some people wouldn’t shut up. It is not the form of the Mass that makes a difference, but the interior disposition of the congregants.

 

[pnewton]

The very nature of the TLM makes it more conducive to meditation than the NO, not just the types of people who go to each one.

I saw your post. I know that this is your opinion. It is not mine.

The NO constantly requires verbal responses,

No. The responses are not constant and are fairly simple. You are right in that they are more common and make ir more difficult to meditate on something unrelated to the Mass.

Again, let us not confuse opinion with fact. Neither should we take extreme anecdotes as evidence of anything except a sign of the internet age.

 

[Apollos]

…there are only a few places where the laity participate.

Participation is not the same as verbal responses! People who aren’t saying anything are still participating. The anti-EF forces have hijacked that word, so be careful how you use it!

 

[barb_finnegan]

I know-it drives me nuts too.

But there are times when I am just as guilty of doing it.

I go to the TLM exclusively, and sometimes I have to speak to the person who sits next to me. We have the same Missal (the St. Andrew) and I help him find what the Mass is going to be said. I do it in a whisper, of course. I usually have all my ‘marks’ before the end of the preceding Sunday’s Mass. He, on the other hand, does his almost at the last minute! But I don’t mind assisting him-he’s good to me.

But there’s a older couple who sit behind me, and they never stop yapping from the time they sit down! They do it after the sermon, they even do it after receiving Communion!
I ‘suck it up and offer it up’ when I hear them, remembering St. Therese and the Sister who was behind her in chapel, making a noise that initially annoyed her, and how she dealt with it.