Bongo drums, modern songs, and waving hands

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stringbeanduck said:
Wow that’s great. Have fun 🙂 I would love to have the chance to play for God. Al though I have no knowledge of the organ. My voice is no good, and the only instrument I have ever play was the recorder. And I only mastered hot cross buns. Sigh 😦
Well I suppose I could learn.
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LOL Bean:

My children and grand children can each play more then one insturment 😃 . I can play the piano some. But as for me singing I MAKE A JOYFUL NOISE UNTO THE LORD. And I mean NOISE (even had one child tell me NOT to sing LOL). I can’t even set the rado properly (I’m tone deaf) and am told not to ever change the settings. (sometimes I do and that really gets their attention;) )

But you are correct you could learn.
 
stringbeanduck said:
Okay I may be 14 but I do know what is traditional and what is not. When we moved down south the masses were different but still had tradition in them. Over the course of ten year it has quickly started to die out. Our parish now has these bongo drums modern songs, and, has just recently a few members are starting to wave their hands during songs. Al right last time I check this is not southern hills rocken mega church of Christ. I believe it is called a Roman Catholic Church. What happened to the ringing of the bells during communion and older songs derived from latten? I ask you all to keep these traditions alive in our troubled world. Do any of you notice tradition fading in your area?
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First I want to say that there is nothing wrong with that kind if music and there is nothing wrong with raising your hands, and sometimes it is even fitting in the Mass, but I know what you mean. At my Church the 6:00 Mass is the “teen Mass” so they use “cool music” and I agree with you, it’s sad:crying:

[SIGN]Laudatis Deum[/SIGN]
 
I hate to disappoint you young folk, but as far as the east is from the west, so far is the Life Teen masses from the Mass I grew up with.

Hand raising and waiving is so evangelical Protestant…it has no similarity to any Mass I ever experienced prior to 1970.

Eritrean drums are OK. OK, using that line of reasoning, why is it that we don’t hear the bodhran, tin whistle, or uillean pipes at Mass today? Are not these Irish instruments as valid as the Eritrean? The big dog that sits there and is ignored in these arguments is that prior to 1965, the majority of Catholics worshiped as one across the globe.

The very first Mass using ethnic instruments that I ever heard was Missa Luba - a Congolese Mass (in Latin no less) which came out in 1969. We are accepting that what we experience today is the gospel truth…It’s not. There are still significant numbers of “us” who are still alive and remember HMC when we were kids. Y’all accept so much as “normal” when it fact, it was anything but normal.
 
stringbeanduck said:
Okay I may be 14 but I do know what is traditional and what is not. When we moved down south the masses were different but still had tradition in them. Over the course of ten year it has quickly started to die out. Our parish now has these bongo drums modern songs, and, has just recently a few members are starting to wave their hands during songs. Al right last time I check this is not southern hills rocken mega church of Christ. I believe it is called a Roman Catholic Church. What happened to the ringing of the bells during communion and older songs derived from latten? I ask you all to keep these traditions alive in our troubled world. Do any of you notice tradition fading in your area?
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my churcch keeps tradition. I don’t think that there is anything wrong with making the music more upbeat though.
 
Linnyo said:
This psalm form USCCB says,
1 1 Hallelujah! 2 Praise God in his holy sanctuary; give praise in the mighty dome of heaven. 2 Give praise for his mighty deeds, praise him for his great majesty. 3 Give praise with blasts upon the horn, praise him with harp and lyre. 4 Give praise with tambourines and dance, praise him with flutes and strings. 5 Give praise with crashing cymbals, praise him with sounding cymbals. 6 Let everything that has breath give praise to the LORD! Hallelujah! This suggests that worshipping on a variety of instruments is indeed showing reverence to God as it is in His Word. I think that it is down to personal preference. God will be pleased if we are worshipping Him regardless of our musical preferences. Note that it didn’t say organ or chanting but that doesn’t mean they are wrong either. God just wants us to worship Him using whatever means available to us.
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It is important to remember what culture that psalm references. That is a reference to early middle-eastern, specifically hebrew/israeli culture. In that culture, those instruments are much more appropriate. Certain rites still use them.

Here is a video of a Coptic Divine Liturgy, in which cymbols are used, and rather well, i might add.

video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3949607392404226859&q=coptic+liturgy&total=18&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0

To them, in their culture, it is reverent and prayerful.

To the western culture, it is NOT. This issue is just like the issue of liturgical dance. While dance might be prayerful and respectful in some African societies, Western society demands different posture altogether.

VIdeo of Cardinal Arinze on this subject: youtube.com/watch?v=EZSYj8PRi7g

Things like foreign instruments and dance are wholly inappropriate for the Roman rite of the Catholic church. The organ and Gregorian Chant are some of the oldest musical styles in European society, and so they are the approriate expression of reverence and prayerfulness in the Roman rite.
 
agapewolf said:
Actually, thats the whole premise that this is actually allowed. The vatican has approved the idea of having a youth mass. JPII said that teens are a seperate culture in many ways. The fact that all ages seem to enjoy it I think speaks volumes about it, but just by calling it a youth mass does not rule out the “older” people. Instead of looking at it like it is exclusionary, look at it as if it was specifically including our teens in a special way.
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It seems these days people are afraid to make their kids do anything, punish them, correct them and instruct them. We want instead to respect their ‘rights’ and let them do anything they want. They don’t WANT to go to boring ol’ mass! So let’s just let them have their way and their very own mass! Not only will this make them love God enough to worship him, but it’ll teach them that they can get whatever they want as long as they cry loud enough! This wasn’t so when I was a teen. Every teacher in my school had a paddle on the desk, and were not afraid to use it! But now that’s considered abuse, and is not allowed. Now I also see my little brother go to school and get patted down by the police officer at the door before going through the metal detector. No police or metal detectors when I went to school. Teachers these days are scared to death of their students; they certainly weren’t when I was in school. Rather, I was afraid of them! Hmmm any relation between the lack of adult control and the increase in the lack of respect for adults and everyone/everything else?
 
Bean, you sound like such a nice young man, and it is edifying to me to know that there are teens who are concerned about these issues. You have a right to your preferences in the style of worship that you attend. I think that it would be a good idea to make an appointment with your pastor to discuss this matter with him. If you have siblings or friends who of the same opinion as you, bring them along. Tell Father that you are willing to learn to serve the Mass, if you are not doing so already. Let him know if you and your friends could provide appropriate music for the Mass or if you know of others who could. Ask adults who are knowledgeable in this area to help you. Most would be glad to pass on what they know to the next generation. You do not have to argue about what is wrong with what the parish is doing now, but that it would bring diversity (a great word these days) to provide an option for those who prefer a more traditional liturgy. Good luck and let us all know what happens!
 
Well its been a while since I’ve seen this thread. Since I’ve written this thread, our Parish priest has brought in a crucifix behind the alter. Occasional they do the ringing of the bells now. Also he has holy water at the exits and robes for the alter servers too now. Slowly but surely he is bringing more tradition back in the Church. I will talk with him and comment what a great job he is doing and to keep up the good work.

Marysann

Thank you for your kind comment. How is Israel. I plan to visit later this year and was wondering how things have. The News hasn’t said a lot. And they really only say something if its bad news. I take things have been doing well?
 
I much prefer the dirge… maybe it is the Catholic guilt in my but I enjoy feeling like a peasant in a huge Cathedral or during a quiet TLM. I was in St. Patrick’s tonight in NYC and it really is stunning!
 
A.Pelliccio said:
I much prefer the dirge… maybe it is the Catholic guilt in my but I enjoy feeling like a peasant in a huge Cathedral or during a quiet TLM. I was in St. Patrick’s tonight in NYC and it really is stunning!
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I love St. Patricks. My family was in New York for spring break this year and i tried to get my mom to stay an hour for mass (it was a sunday during Lent), but she had other ideas… oh well.

Have you had the chance to come to D.C. and see the basilica of the National Shrine of the Immaculate conception? It is perhaps the most amazing church I’ve ever been inside, maaaaybe except the cathedral of Koln (Cologne, Germany), or Sacred Heart (Paris). Its built in a beautiful Byzantine style, and is the largest Catholic Church in the Western hemisphere.
 
Bean, I am glad to hear that things are improving in your parish. It is a good idea to complement Father on what you have seen, and encourage your friends to do the same. A little note to him would really be appreciated, I am sure, since priests often hear nothing but complaints. Remember that you attract more flies with honey than with vinegar! Don’t be discouraged if things do not completely turn around overnight. Father probably is only able to change gradually especially if he bought into liberalism when he was young. Don’t be too hard on us older folks! Just keep encouraging him. As for Israel, it is a great place for a vacation. The holy places are so inspiring. We have lived here for over two and a half years, and I can assure you that it is safe to visit. Check the State Department website for the latest information. As long as you stay out of Gaza (nothing to see there anyway), and the West Bank, you should not have any problems. The Israelis are interested in promoting tourism, and keep the tourist areas very secure.
 
A.Pelliccio said:
I much prefer the dirge… maybe it is the Catholic guilt in my but I enjoy feeling like a peasant in a huge Cathedral or during a quiet TLM. I was in St. Patrick’s tonight in NYC and it really is stunning!
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Are there any pictures of St. Patrick’s on the web? I’d love to see it in person; wish I could bi-locate! 😃 I think that’s where Fr. Rutler was filmed by EWTN doing a series.
 
belgianwaffles9 said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._Patrick’s_Cathedral,_New_York
nyc-architecture.com/MID/MID054.htm
saintpatrickscathedral.org/
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I was just there for 12:00 mass today. I’ve visited there many times before, but minus a fireman’s mass which was a very sad occassion, it was the first time I was in St. Patrick’s and experienced a true spiritual beauty. The Cathedral, itself, is and has always been beautiful, but it seemed brighter and alive. I really liked the priest saying the mass, too. He was very nice and humble, but said things like they were. Unfortunately, some people got up and walked out after he mentioned that missing mass was a mortal sin. But there were tons of people coming in and out, so I’m not sure if they were just tourists and if this is just a common thing. I’ve only attended mass there maybe four times. I was just so happy that it was only a couple blocks away from the place where I was performing today.

I guess to keep it within the thread topic, there were no “bongo drums, modern songs or waving hands”. I missed the mass with the choir with was at 10:15, but from the looks of the program they had and what I could remember, they were doing Charpentier’s Agnus Dei from Messe de Minuit pour Noel, Palestrina’s “Tribus Miraculis” and mass parts by the director of music which was much nicer than the usual. Organ played Bach Fugue in B Minor for the postlude. They use St. Michael’s Hymnal.
 
I’d to go to St. Patrick’s sometime. There are some really beautiful Cathedrals out there. One near my home is the Cathedral of the Incarnation in Nashville.
 
stringbeanduck said:
Okay I may be 14 but I do know what is traditional and what is not. When we moved down south the masses were different but still had tradition in them. Over the course of ten year it has quickly started to die out. Our parish now has these bongo drums modern songs, and, has just recently a few members are starting to wave their hands during songs. Al right last time I check this is not southern hills rocken mega church of Christ. I believe it is called a Roman Catholic Church. What happened to the ringing of the bells during communion and older songs derived from latten? I ask you all to keep these traditions alive in our troubled world. Do any of you notice tradition fading in your area?
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When we first moved back to Florida this past summer, we visited a few different parishes before settling on this one…and bongo drums was …wow. (at the first parish we attended) lol My husband said…what’s next? A belly dancer is going to come running up the aisle? lol He is a steadfast conservative thinker, and Catholic–so that church was out. Then we visited another one, and it was smothering…people on top of everyone…no pews…head priest was very liberal, just didn’t seem like we could connect there. Now, we are on our third, and love it. The songs range from traditional (which have been so since Thanksgiving) but with modern beats added to them…not just organ or piano for example. I love the piano version of most traditional songs, actually…I am very moved especially during Communion, when the piano is the only instrument being played, and soft singing…But, there have been some tambourines and guitar playing…for different songs, but it is not often.

I think that in some ways, that can appear too theatrical, and people are paying attention to ‘the band’ instead of to the priest…or in reverent prayer. It can at times, be too loud and distracting even, which I can’t imagine that should be the intent of the music program at a parish. But, it’s not often that that happens…

I hear you though about the bongos…maybe you could drop a suggestion in the suggestion box? Usually all parishes have them…or have your parents talk with your priest? (My son is 15, and he agrees with you, too–so age has nothing to do with it…it’s great that your admire church tradition!)🙂
 
I have not been to the Basilica in D.C. I still need to get to my own Archdiocese’s Basilica in Newark.
 
A-R-G-H!!! We have a trap set used during mass. The lady who plays them is so nice but I don’t feel drums are appropriate. And modern songs can be ok. But mostly they are insipid.
Thank goodness we do not have waving hands. Sadly we are still a holding hands parish during the Our Father.
 
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