Born Again Christian Catholic

  • Thread starter Thread starter rolandjames
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
R

rolandjames

Guest
I consider myself a born again Christian because I completed the Alpha Program through a Catholic Church and accepted Jesus as my Lord and Savior. I made a commitment to follow Jesus for the rest of my life. The Catholic Church I attend is charismatic and has a paid lay minister who leads an evangelization program. We are also ecumenical and refer to the protestants as our separated brothers. Am I wrong to call myself a born again Christian when I still believe in the sacraments of the Catholic Church and practice them.
 
A lot of it is verbage. So much of our separation from other Christians is based on jargon. Just try to explain to a Southern Baptist that we Catholics don’t “pray to Mary” and see where it gets you.

If you call yourself a “Born Again Christian Catholic” you may be fully within the theology of our Holy Mother Church (you may not be, but for the sake of this discussion, I’ll assume you are). Which doesn’t mean you won’t irritate both Catholics and Evangelicals with that description. I have no problem, when someone asks me if I have “accepted Jesus Christ as my personal savior,” with responding “yes, yes, yes, YES!!!” That doesn’t mean I mean exactly what they think I mean.
 
I consider myself a born again Christian because I completed the Alpha Program through a Catholic Church and accepted Jesus as my Lord and Savior. I made a commitment to follow Jesus for the rest of my life. The Catholic Church I attend is charismatic and has a paid lay minister who leads an evangelization program. We are also ecumenical and refer to the protestants as our separated brothers. Am I wrong to call myself a born again Christian when I still believe in the sacraments of the Catholic Church and practice them.
Kinda redundant. When you say you are Catholic that says it all.

I
 
1 Peter 5:7 “Cast all your worries upon him because he cares for you.” Thank you brother. That’s good advice but I’m born again in the protestant sense of the word. I even considered leaving the church because of Mary. However, after searching alone for answers regarding Mary I discovered we can’t have Jesus without Mary so I stayed. I also stayed because the sacraments give me structure and keep me in line.
 
I consider myself a born again Christian because I completed the Alpha Program through a Catholic Church and accepted Jesus as my Lord and Savior. I made a commitment to follow Jesus for the rest of my life. The Catholic Church I attend is charismatic and has a paid lay minister who leads an evangelization program. We are also ecumenical and refer to the protestants as our separated brothers. Am I wrong to call myself a born again Christian when I still believe in the sacraments of the Catholic Church and practice them.
I suspect the basic theological differences between Protestantism and Catholicism remain an issue for you. Martin Luther launched his rebellion in 1517, in essence, by advancing three fundamental principles that forever set his version of Christianity apart from Catholicism: 1) priesthood of all believers (e.g., every Christian is his or her own clergyman); 2) salvation through faith alone; 3) sole authority of the Bible. These three beliefs still serve as the foundation of almost all forms of evangelical Christianity. The ‘born-again’ variety falls smack dab into the middle of the mix. They are all in direct and irreconcilable conflict with traditional Catholic theology. 😦
 
I believe that Jesus’ death on the cross paid the price for my sins and there is nothing I can do to earn my salvation. He has already paid the price. If someone truly believes this he can go to heaven no mater what his theological preferences are. That’s the bottom line. Regardless of this, I can practice the Catholic faith to keep things in perspective and for sanctification.
 
I believe that Jesus’ death on the cross paid the price for my sins and there is nothing I can do to earn my salvation. He has already paid the price. If someone truly believes this he can go to heaven no mater what his theological preferences are. That’s the bottom line. Regardless of this, I can practice the Catholic faith to keep things in perspective and for sanctification.
I suspect you dont realize how condescedning your posts come across as. At any rate you can call yourself anything you like-there is not much use carrying on a discussion with someone with as muddled a theology as you profess.
 
Am I wrong to call myself a born again Christian when I still believe in the sacraments of the Catholic Church and practice them.
You had a significant conversion experience – but when you were baptized in the Catholic Church, that’s when you were “born again” or reborn, adopted into the family of God.

You are using Protestant terminology. Catholics believe we are “born again” (spiritually) when we are baptized. In Scripture, “born again” refers to baptism. “Accepting Jesus into our heart” or accepting a personal relationship with Jesus is something we do repeatedly through our lives. All Catholics are called to lifetime continuing conversion.

catholiceducation.org/articles/apologetics/ap0022.html

catholic.com/library/Are_Catholics_Born_Again.asp
I believe that Jesus’ death on the cross paid the price for my sins and there is nothing I can do to earn my salvation. He has already paid the price. If someone truly believes this he can go to heaven no mater what his theological preferences are. That’s the bottom line. Regardless of this, I can practice the Catholic faith to keep things in perspective and for sanctification.
The bottom line actually is that we MUST do something in order to attain salvation. Jesus’ act of redemption unlocked the gates of heaven to make it possible for each of us to be saved. But our salvation is not automatic. Baptism is an initial “act” of salvation, but salvation is a process. Scripture is quite clear that faith is not enough – we must have an obedient faith. We must love, by obeying the commandments. None of us “earn” or deserve heaven, because we fall short in how we love. But we can rely on God’s mercy, by seeking his forgiveness when we do sin, by participating in the sacraments, and by living righteously.

I’m glad you’ve made a commitment to follow Jesus for the rest of your life. That means a commitment every day to love, to try not to sin, and to participate fully in the Church he established.
 
I believe that Jesus’ death on the cross paid the price for my sins and there is nothing I can do to earn my salvation. He has already paid the price. If someone truly believes this he can go to heaven no mater what his theological preferences are. That’s the bottom line. Regardless of this, I can practice the Catholic faith to keep things in perspective and for sanctification.
I’m sorry, Roland, but that is not part of Catholic theology. That belief is distinctly Protestant. The Church teaches that one cannot be guaranteed of salvation in this life. That decision is made by God on Judgment Day, which of course occurs after one has died. There is no such thing as being ‘saved’ while one is still alive. That’s a basic, all-enduring difference between Catholicism and evangelical Christianity.😦
 
I’m sorry, Roland, but that is not part of Catholic theology. That belief is distinctly Protestant. The Church teaches that one cannot be guaranteed of salvation in this life. That decision is made by God on Judgment Day, which of course occurs after one has died. There is no such thing as being ‘saved’ while one is still alive. That’s a basic, all-enduring difference between Catholicism and evangelical Christianity.😦
I’ve had some very lively discussions with Protestant acquaintances on this very topic. I could almost always befuddle them with something like, “So, a guy says “I accept you Jesus as my personal Lord and Savior” then goes around killing people and keeps on doing it will go to heaven?”. I mean, with that kind of theology all it takes is saying that one sentence fervently and with all your heart, and then you can fall later and commit all sorts of heinous crimes but still are guaranteed a place in heaven. I just don’t get how sensible, well-meaning, loving folks can accept that. I’ve listened to Protestant radio programs where prominent Protestant scholars said exactly those things. That one’s salvation cannot be lost no matter what. What that tells me is in the end hell may be full of sensible, well-meaning, loving folks. God only knows. As for me, I’ll cling to Christ’s true church, His teachings and His sacraments and hope and pray for salvation until I draw my last breath, then see what happens next.

Simon
 
I consider myself a born again Christian because I completed the Alpha Program through a Catholic Church and accepted Jesus as my Lord and Savior. I made a commitment to follow Jesus for the rest of my life. The Catholic Church I attend is charismatic and has a paid lay minister who leads an evangelization program. We are also ecumenical and refer to the protestants as our separated brothers. Am I wrong to call myself a born again Christian when I still believe in the sacraments of the Catholic Church and practice them.
Until the time you accepted Christ in your life, you were a Catholic. On the day you chose to follow Jesus, you became a Christian.

Many find themselves in Christianity, and having some respect for the doctrines, remain so, but never become Christian. Others, become Christian, because of the gift of faith they’ve received in Jesus Christ.

Those who have experienced the birth of new life in Jesus Christ, will understand.

God Bless
Jim
 
I wouldn’t say there’s anything “wrong” with it, although it’s redundant. We are “born again” at baptism, and Catholics define a “Christian” as a person who has received a valid trinitarian baptism. So saying “born again Christian Catholic” is like saying the same thing three times. But some people need to hear the same thing three times.
 
I believe that Jesus’ death on the cross paid the price for my sins and there is nothing I can do to earn my salvation. He has already paid the price. If someone truly believes this he can go to heaven no mater what his theological preferences are. That’s the bottom line. Regardless of this, I can practice the Catholic faith to keep things in perspective and for sanctification.
“What does it profit, my brethren, if a man says he has faith but has not works? Can his faith save him? If a brother or sister is ill-clad and in lack of daily food, and one of you says to them, ‘Go in peace, be warmed and filled,’ without giving them the things needed for the body, what does it profit? So faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead.” (James 2:14-17)
 
I wouldn’t say there’s anything “wrong” with it, although it’s redundant. We are “born again” at baptism, and Catholics define a “Christian” as a person who has received a valid trinitarian baptism. So saying “born again Christian Catholic” is like saying the same thing three times. But some people need to hear the same thing three times.
True, but until you’ve experienced faith, its all meaningless.

I was Baptized as an infant, raised Catholic, and pretty much had no faith until I was 26 years of age. Heck, there was a period I was nothing more than an agnostic.

Then, when I accepted Christ into my life, my life was transformed. I became a new person, the old person died.

For some, who had faith all of their lives, they don’t know the difference between a life without faith and one with it. For them, faith only got stronger.

The term, “born again,” is actually nothing more than a comparison of one’s life before he/she knew Christ, and after.

For those who experience it, it is profound and nothing can compare to the joy, once faith is received.

In Daniel Defoe’s book, Robinson Caruso after receiving faith he says, “of all the things I’ve suffered in life, nothing gives as much relief and joy, as the forgiveness of my sins.” This is the “born again” experience.

Jim
 
Until the time you accepted Christ in your life, you were a Catholic. On the day you chose to follow Jesus, you became a Christian.

Many find themselves in Christianity, and having some respect for the doctrines, remain so, but never become Christian. Others, become Christian, because of the gift of faith they’ve received in Jesus Christ.

Those who have experienced the birth of new life in Jesus Christ, will understand.

God Bless
Jim
I understand what you are saying Jim.

I became a Christian several years ago when I received the gift of faith in Jesus Christ. I became on fire for Jesus - totally in love, and I could not get enough of His word - it literally came alive to me. It was through my study of the Bible - specifically John 6 which led me to the Catholic Church.

I was a born again Christian - and now I am Catholic, and I praise God for the fullness of His truth every single day.

To the OP: Yay that you feel closer to Jesus! That is just wonderful… and I’m also happy that you are going to remain Catholic … there is nothing more “personal” than receiving Him in the Eucharist.
 
yellowbird
I became a Christian several years ago when I received the gift of faith in Jesus Christ. I became on fire for Jesus - totally in love, and I could not get enough of His word - it literally came alive to me. It was through my study of the Bible - specifically John 6 which led me to the Catholic Church.
I was a born again Christian - and now I am Catholic, and I praise God for the fullness of His truth every single day.
Its the same experience I had, except that I returned to the Catholic Church.

Thanks for sharing

Jim
 
True, but until you’ve experienced faith, its all meaningless.

I was Baptized as an infant, raised Catholic, and pretty much had no faith until I was 26 years of age. Heck, there was a period I was nothing more than an agnostic.

Then, when I accepted Christ into my life, my life was transformed. I became a new person, the old person died.

For some, who had faith all of their lives, they don’t know the difference between a life without faith and one with it. For them, faith only got stronger.

The term, “born again,” is actually nothing more than a comparison of one’s life before he/she knew Christ, and after.

For those who experience it, it is profound and nothing can compare to the joy, once faith is received.

In Daniel Defoe’s book, Robinson Caruso after receiving faith he says, “of all the things I’ve suffered in life, nothing gives as much relief and joy, as the forgiveness of my sins.” This is the “born again” experience.

Jim
I understand that that is the new interpretation some people give to the term “born again,” but that isn’t how the Catholic Church interprets it. The Catechism of the Catholic Church says that we are born anew in the sacrament of baptism. “Baptism gives us the grace of new birth in God the Father, though his Son, in the Holy Spirit,” CCC 683. Incidentally, the Catechism’s language used there comes directly from St. Iraneus of Lyons, who lived immediately after the Apostolic age. Only in the past couple of centuries has the term “born again” been interpreted as being only a spiritual awakening or revival rather than a baptism.

Other spiritual events can be very significant, life-changing, enlightening moments, but only baptism constitutes being “born again.”
 
Gamera,
of course technically and according to the Church teachings, you are correct. However, I heard my local Bishop talk about it at Confirmation just recently, and he used the term, “born again,” in giving an understanding to what people experience when they accept the faith they have received.

Also, it was Jesus words where the term actually derives from;
Jesus answered, "Amen, amen, I say to you, no one can enter the kingdom of God without being born of water and Spirit. What is born of flesh is flesh and what is born of spirit is spirit. John 3:6.
Remember, Baptism is a sacrament of faith, and being Baptized as infants, it is our parents faith, not ours, that we are Baptized.

Although we have been reborn into the faith, it is not alive and is dead, until we accept it. This is the “born again,” experience that people have.

The Charismatics use the term, “Baptism of the Holy Spirit,” when we receive the gift of faith.

Regardless of how the Church teaches it, is all meaningless until faith comes into the person’s life.

Jim
 
I’ve had some very lively discussions with Protestant acquaintances on this very topic. I could almost always befuddle them with something like, “So, a guy says “I accept you Jesus as my personal Lord and Savior” then goes around killing people and keeps on doing it will go to heaven?”. I mean, with that kind of theology all it takes is saying that one sentence fervently and with all your heart, and then you can fall later and commit all sorts of heinous crimes but still are guaranteed a place in heaven. I just don’t get how sensible, well-meaning, loving folks can accept that. I’ve listened to Protestant radio programs where prominent Protestant scholars said exactly those things. That one’s salvation cannot be lost no matter what. What that tells me is in the end hell may be full of sensible, well-meaning, loving folks. God only knows. As for me, I’ll cling to Christ’s true church, His teachings and His sacraments and hope and pray for salvation until I draw my last breath, then see what happens next.

Simon
Simon, it’s a heresy called Antinomianism. It first arose during the time of the ancient Church, and then experienced a rebirth in the aftermath of the Reformation (1517), given Luther’s revolutionary and popular teaching of salvation through faith alone. Its adherents argue that evil acts don’t hinder one’s salvation, since good acts don’t, either. Even Luther repudiated it. Today it thrives, however, particularly in ‘born-again’, supposedly ‘non-denominational’, Biblically based, Christian communities, most of which have no sense of the historical context of their theological orientation. Most of these believers have no clue who Martin Luther was, much less the formative impact he and his movement had on their Christian understanding. I mean them no disrespect, however errant I consider their beliefs. Like you, I cling to the Church, for it is my life.🙂
 
“However, I heard my local Bishop talk about it at Confirmation just recently, and he used the term, “born again,” in giving an understanding to what people experience when they accept the faith they have received.”

As a bishop, he must have been reinforcing the age-old Catholic teaching that we become new people in Christ, as practicing Catholics. That’s traditional. He could not have meant it in the same sense as born-again Christians. To them, what is meant by being ‘born-again’, is that the Christian, having read certain passages in the Bible, usually as a discerning adult, particularly those common to Saint Paul’s writings concerning salvation through faith alone, feels himself or herself suddenly filled with grace, after making certain, Biblically-based affirmations, and declares himself or herself ‘saved’, as in being forgiven of all sin, and admitted into Heaven in advance of dying.

That condition, in this person’s opinion, is permanent, and acquits that person from the penalties of all future sin, in *this *life. The Catholic Church considers this theory and practice wrong, theologically, and teaches something quite different. The bottom line is that Catholics are not to believe in any such guarantee of salvation in this life. Salvation is determined by God, on Judgment Day, which comes after death, and no time before. As long as we are alive, we are capable of sinning, and whenever we sin, we are subject to the consequences therein. There is no such thing as being ‘acquitted’ in this life, of all sin, and admitted into Heaven in advance of our death.

It’s complicated, and ties into many other theological concepts, such as free will versus predestination, child-baptism versus adult baptism, sacramental theology versus a strictly Biblical theology, Church authority versus ‘sola scriptura’, etc., etc. It also has a lot do to do with the intellectual geneology that bound together Saint Paul, Saint Augustine and Martin Luther. All three were legally trained before becoming clerics. All three were rather obsessed with incorporating into Christianity legal concepts and definitions, obsessed with grace and the perception of God as a courtroom judge. It’s no coincidence that Luther was an Augustinian monk, one who developed most of his revolutionary theology based on his interpretation of Saint Paul.

The issue of salvation highlights and defines the fundamental differences between Catholicism and evangelical Christianity, differences which are still unreconciled, and probably always will be because of their ontological nature and huge ramifications on all Christian worship and psychology. 🙂
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top