Born Again?

[sara888]

**I concur , this born again stuff, is just a belief or acceptance, what they dont apply is the obedience to Gods Commandments.They will claim they are essential to Faith however, nothing to do with ones salvation…

Jan**

 

[Syele]

**I concur , this born again stuff, is just a belief or acceptance, what they dont apply is the obedience to Gods Commandments.

Jan**

that is not accurate at all, While there may be Some people who are “Faking it” as I said before, the point is not to just believe but to Turn over our WHOLE lives to God. that means Obeying Him. 100% of the time it is supposed to be about obeying Him. It is taught to protestants that we are to Obey God. It is explained the sinner’s prayer is the beginning of a new life of Following and trusting and obeying God. No one who truly loves God and decides to Follow Him is going to just go out after and sin “Just beacuse they can” If we love God, we keep His commandments. If you love your spouse you don’t do things every day to hurt them. If you love your parents as a child you obey them. Why? Because you don’t want to hurt those you love! God adpots us into His family, He is our Father. We Obey Him because we love Him. This IS taught to protestants.

 

[MariaG]

that is not accurate at all, While there may be Some people who are “Faking it” as I said before, the point is not to just believe but to Turn over our WHOLE lives to God. that means Obeying Him. 100% of the time it is supposed to be about obeying Him. It is taught to protestants that we are to Obey God. It is explained the sinner’s prayer is the beginning of a new life of Following and trusting and obeying God. No one who truly loves God and decides to Follow Him is going to just go out after and sin “Just beacuse they can” If we love God, we keep His commandments. If you love your spouse you don’t do things every day to hurt them. If you love your parents as a child you obey them. Why? Because you don’t want to hurt those you love! God adpots us into His family, He is our Father. We Obey Him because we love Him. This IS taught to protestants.

Syele is correct. Even among “born again Christians” who define being born again as when we make an adult(child) decision to follow Christ, there is disagreement as to what exactly that means. The OSAS crowd are not the only ones who believe in the believers baptism. There are many who believe that one can lose one’s salvation and one must “walk the walk” or you are a “back slidden” Christian.

These groups definitely believe that “born again” is defined as a life changing moment and not born again through baptism. But as Syele said and I say, not all these groups believe that one can just rest on that one time moment for salvation.

No more than Catholics who believe that an infant baptism will save a sinfull adult.

And even among the OSAS crowd, few that I have talked to in real life actually believe that that one can have a “born again” moment and go out and sin like hell. This is a gross characterization of what a few OSAS people believe. Most would believe that a person who went out to sin like hell was never saved to begin with since someone who is born again in Christ will show a changed life.

God Bless,
Maria

 

[ALLFORHIM]

**I concur , this born again stuff, is just a belief or acceptance, what they dont apply is the obedience to Gods Commandments.

Jan**

Hi Jan,
You’ll be happy to know that we are taught to obey God’s commandments. In fact our sermon today was on just that. If we truly love God we need to obey Him. Anyone who says they are born again and then says they can sin and sin and not follow God’s commandments is simply a liar.

 

[rbarcia]

LOL! Your second baptism was merely a bath. There is no such thing as re-baptism. Don’t fret, the Holy Spirit got it right the first time!

We await your return home with open arms also, sandusky!

Why were these people baptised again?

**

Acts 19

1And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples,

2He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.

3And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John’s baptism.

4Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.

5When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

6And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

**

 

[Mickey]

Why were these people baptised again?

I repeat. The Holy Spirit got it right the first time.

In baptism we partake of the mysterion of the death, burial, and resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[StMarkEofE]

To all evangelical and fundamentalist protestants, this question is for you. Many of you say that one is “born again” by accepting into their hearts Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and savior. But my question is this: Where in the Bible does it say that we are “born again” by accepting Jesus Christ into our hearts as our personal Lord and Savior (and yes, show me a verse saying it the way you guys say it, in that “formula”).

I dont know about you but I was “Born again” when I was baptized.

 

[Mr.Ex_Nihilo]

Why were these people baptised again?

I could be wrong, but I myself think it’s because they were not baptized in the name of Jesus. John’s baptism was indeed a baptism, just like many non-Christian Jews practised in mitvak even though they did not believe in Jesus as the Christ.

John himself as a genuine Hebrew prophet said that he must become lesser so that the Lord can become greater. Consequently, after the Lord was revealed as the Messiah, a shift in the Baptist’s momentum is noted-- it comes to a sharp end and the apostles begin to baptize in the name of the Father, the Son, and Holy Spirit even if it’s not explicitly stated every time a baptism of the Spirit is mentioned.

That’s my thoughts on it anyway.

 

[Syele]

Why were these people baptised again?

Some are baptized agin because their first baptism was not done by people who believed in the Trinity or didn’t baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Others disagree with your belief about Baptism and Believe that Baptism MUST include a public confession of Faith by the one being baptized. If they believe this, they will not count the infant Baptism.

 

[lak611]

I was baptized when I was 2 weeks old. Then I went to CCD classes, got confirmed, went to Catholic high school, and Catholic college. I never “got it”. After college, I fell away from the Church and did not attend any church at all. I became “born again” after I read a KJV Bible that was given to me by a Baptist at a Christian music festival a friend took me to. I finally understood what it meant to have a personal relationship with Christ. I also finally understood what the Catholic Church had been teaching me my whole life prior to this. I confessed my sin, first to God the Father, then asked Jesus to come into my life, then I went to a priest the next day and confessed my sin to him. Since then, I have joined an adult Sunday school class at my parish (right now, we are studying Romans and Galatians), volunteered at an ecumenical mission meal for the poor at a Methodist parish in my neighborhood (there are Methodists, Catholics, Lutherans, and Presbyterians involved in it), and become an EMHC. Just getting baptized or just saying a prayer at an altar call does not cut it! We need to have a personal relationship with Christ, accept Him as our Lord and Saviour, and obey His commandments. “Born again” is not a Protestant term. It is something that applies to all Christians, Catholic, Protestant and Orthodox.

 

[lak611]

Some are baptized agin because their first baptism was not done by people who believed in the Trinity or didn’t baptize in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Others disagree with your belief about Baptism and Believe that Baptism MUST include a public confession of Faith by the one being baptized. If they believe this, they will not count the infant Baptism.

I have a family member who is Lutheran. Her parish was closed because of declining membership She started going to services at a Baptist church nearby. They told her that she would need to be baptized in order to join the church. She told them that she already was baptized, and since she had a valid baptism (as an infant), she could not and would not be baptized again. She found another Lutheran parish to join and does not attend Baptist services anymore.

 

[MariaG]

I was baptized when I was 2 weeks old. Then I went to CCD classes, got confirmed, went to Catholic high school, and Catholic college. I never “got it”. After college, I fell away from the Church and did not attend any church at all. I became “born again” after I read a KJV Bible that was given to me by a Baptist at a Christian music festival a friend took me to. I finally understood what it meant to have a personal relationship with Christ. I also finally understood what the Catholic Church had been teaching me my whole life prior to this. I confessed my sin, first to God the Father, then asked Jesus to come into my life, then I went to a priest the next day and confessed my sin to him. Since then, I have joined an adult Sunday school class at my parish (right now, we are studying Romans and Galatians), volunteered at an ecumenical mission meal for the poor at a Methodist parish in my neighborhood (there are Methodists, Catholics, Lutherans, and Presbyterians involved in it), and become an EMHC. Just getting baptized or just saying a prayer at an altar call does not cut it! We need to have a personal relationship with Christ, accept Him as our Lord and Saviour, and obey His commandments. “Born again” is not a Protestant term. It is something that applies to all Christians, Catholic, Protestant and Orthodox.

The Catholic Church defines born again as the miraculous moment when God removes original sin and any personal sin from our souls when we are baptized. We are born again into the family of Christ. Infants are born again. Keep not the little children from me. (Born Again in Baptism)

But we all need to renew those baptizmal promises and have “born again experiences” throughout our life.

God Bless,
Maria

 

[Syele]

I have a family member who is Lutheran. Her parish was closed because of declining membership She started going to services at a Baptist church nearby. They told her that she would need to be baptized in order to join the church. She told them that she already was baptized, and since she had a valid baptism (as an infant), she could not and would not be baptized again. She found another Lutheran parish to join and does not attend Baptist services anymore.

If she only left the Catholic Church because her parish closed, a Lutheran Chruch would be closer to her beliefs than a Baptist one anyways. But, yes, the Baptist church is one of the ones I mentioned that believes the Baptism is not valid if the person could not confirm their beliefs at the time they were baptized.

 

[lak611]

If she only left the Catholic Church because her parish closed, a Lutheran Chruch would be closer to her beliefs than a Baptist one anyways. But, yes, the Baptist church is one of the ones I mentioned that believes the Baptism is not valid if the person could not confirm their beliefs at the time they were baptized.

This aunt of mine was always a Lutheran. She never was a Catholic. She was baptized as an infant in the Lutheran Church, but tried out the Baptist Church briefly because her Lutheran parish closed and the Baptist Church was close by. She now attends another Lutheran parish that is quite a bit of a drive, because she did not agree with the Baptist doctrine on baptism (and on several other issues).

 

[lak611]

The Catholic Church defines born again as the miraculous moment when God removes original sin and any personal sin from our souls when we are baptized. We are born again into the family of Christ. Infants are born again. Keep not the little children from me. (Born Again in Baptism)

But we all need to renew those baptizmal promises and have “born again experiences” throughout our life.

God Bless,
Maria

Maria, you are right. I do agree with you. Basically, though, the same thing applies to either the Catholic or Protestant definition of “born again” though, in that whether you believe you are born again when baptized or born again when you make a decision to accept Christ that’s not the end-all. You still must abide in your faith and follow God’s commandments. Catholics who get baptized and leave the church are not any better off than Protestants who have one experience at the altar call and never follow their faith. All of us need to grow in our faith, learn more, receive the Sacraments (if Catholic), and follow God’s commandments.

 

[MariaG]

Maria, you are right. I do agree with you. Basically, though, the same thing applies to either the Catholic or Protestant definition of “born again” though, in that whether you believe you are born again when baptized or born again when you make a decision to accept Christ that’s not the end-all. You still must abide in your faith and follow God’s commandments. Catholics who get baptized and leave the church are not any better off than Protestants who have one experience at the altar call and never follow their faith. All of us need to grow in our faith, learn more, receive the Sacraments (if Catholic), and follow God’s commandments.

Yes, that is quite true .

But I do feel that while in the interests of communication of what we mean, while we can (and should in my opinion) use the phrase “born again”, as Catholic Christians as in order to properly represent the biblical teaching of being born again through baptism, we should call what they define as born again, a born again experience.

In that we communicate the meaning without using biblical terms improperly, in a way that is in fact, not biblical at all.

God Bless,
Maria

 

[lak611]

Yes, that is quite true .

But I do feel that while in the interests of communication of what we mean, while we can (and should in my opinion) use the phrase “born again”, as Catholic Christians as in order to properly represent the biblical teaching of being born again through baptism, we should call what they define as born again, a born again experience.

In that we communicate the meaning without using biblical terms improperly, in a way that is in fact, not biblical at all.

God Bless,
Maria

Yes, you are correct!

 

[sara888]

Hi Jan,
You’ll be happy to know that we are taught to obey God’s commandments. In fact our sermon today was on just that. If we truly love God we need to obey Him. Anyone who says they are born again and then says they can sin and sin and not follow God’s commandments is simply a liar.

**
You believe commandments are essential to Faith, yet they have nothing to do with your salvation…!!!

Most, who believe they have been born again, also believe that they are saved. They have the idea that once saved always saved. This concept seems to flow from the idea that since they have already been born again, that they now cannot be lost or go astray from God.

Here is the TERRIBLE CONSEQUENCE OF BELIEVING that people are already ‘born again’ because some preacher says so. Instead of growing as unborn babes need to do in order to come to birth, those who trust in a false new birth believe that there is NO NEED OF SPIRITUAL GROWTH NOW OR 0BEDIENCE to the commandments because they think they are already saved.They have not grown or developed into the stature of Jesus’ character by obeying the commandments of God.

Jan**

 

[sara888]

that is not accurate at all, While there may be Some people who are “Faking it” as I said before, the point is not to just believe but to Turn over our WHOLE lives to God. that means Obeying Him. 100% of the time it is supposed to be about obeying Him. It is taught to protestants that we are to Obey God. It is explained the sinner’s prayer is the beginning of a new life of Following and trusting and obeying God. No one who truly loves God and decides to Follow Him is going to just go out after and sin “Just beacuse they can” If we love God, we keep His commandments. If you love your spouse you don’t do things every day to hurt them. If you love your parents as a child you obey them. Why? Because you don’t want to hurt those you love! God adpots us into His family, He is our Father. We Obey Him because we love Him. This IS taught to protestants.

**Since you feel commandments are essential to Faith, do they have anything to do with your salvation . or judgment with CHrist.?

Most, who believe they have been born again, also believe that they are saved. They have the idea that once saved always saved. This concept seems to flow from the idea that since they have already been born again, that they now cannot be lost or go astray from God.

Here is the TERRIBLE CONSEQUENCE OF BELIEVING that people are already ‘born again’ because some preacher says so. Instead of growing as unborn babes need to do in order to come to birth, those who trust in a false new birth believe that there is NO NEED OF SPIRITUAL GROWTH NOW OR 0BEDIENCE to the commandments because they think they are already saved.They have not grown or developed into the stature of Jesus character by obeying the commandments of God**

Jan

 

[sara888]

Syele is correct. Even among “born again Christians” who define being born again as when we make an adult(child) decision to follow Christ, there is disagreement as to what exactly that means. The OSAS crowd are not the only ones who believe in the believers baptism. There are many who believe that one can lose one’s salvation and one must “walk the walk” or you are a “back slidden” Christian.

These groups definitely believe that “born again” is defined as a life changing moment and not born again through baptism. But as Syele said and I say, not all these groups believe that one can just rest on that one time moment for salvation.

No more than Catholics who believe that an infant baptism will save a sinfull adult.

And even among the OSAS crowd, few that I have talked to in real life actually believe that that one can have a “born again” moment and go out and sin like hell. This is a gross characterization of what a few OSAS people believe. Most would believe that a person who went out to sin like hell was never saved to begin with since someone who is born again in Christ will show a changed life.

God Bless,
Maria

**Marie, OSAS simply means assured salvation. that nothing can take away their guranteed ticket to Heaven. The gross characterization is when a OSAS follower or Born Again believer explains commandments are essential to faith , however have nothing to do with ones salvation.

I am not suggesting these sects go out and sin, what I am stating is they do not profess a doctrine of Holiness to follow, which is what Christ calls all of us so called Christians to abide by.

Jan**