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In Scripture we are told that those who teach doctrine contrary to that of God that was given to the Apostles they will be condemned. And in Revelation, the last chapter, it tells us that if anyone takes or adds to this book his name will be taken from the Book of Life. Now Im not a scholar by any means, but i would assume that the creation of other books and passing it as doctrinal fact as far as the Catholic Church is concerned, would be considered grounds for adding to the doctrine that we were given in THE WORD OF GOD. The Apocrypha and Maccabees were not considered to be written with the divinity the Bible was. And as far as the catechism is concerned, well…Im not even gonna get into that. The Christian canon of Scripture is a culmination of either Biblical Historical fact as it relates to the chronology at which events came to pass during the dispensation of the law, which we as gentiles are not under, and the divinely inspired Word of God that was given to Spirit-filled apostles. Catholics arent Christians, they are catholics. A roman denomination that is arguably responsible for the Dark Ages. Im on board with being unified, but not with those that dont take heed to Scripture and live according the promises of the New Covenant God cut with us. Im sorry guys, im not trying to argue nor am i in a position where i need to. The doctrine i live according to is pulled right out of the Infallible Word of God. If i were to come across a passage of Scripture that taught me a Pope will come to us, and be recognized as an infallible being and that i should receive scriptural interpretation from him, than maybe I would. But until then, Im gonna go ahead and let the Holy Spirit be my teacher and counselor.
 
In Scripture we are told that those who teach doctrine contrary to that of God that was given to the Apostles they will be condemned. And in Revelation, the last chapter, it tells us that if anyone takes or adds to this book his name will be taken from the Book of Life. Now Im not a scholar by any means, but i would assume that the creation of other books and passing it as doctrinal fact as far as the Catholic Church is concerned, would be considered grounds for adding to the doctrine that we were given in THE WORD OF GOD. The Apocrypha and Maccabees were not considered to be written with the divinity the Bible was. And as far as the catechism is concerned, well…Im not even gonna get into that. The Christian canon of Scripture is a culmination of either Biblical Historical fact as it relates to the chronology at which events came to pass during the dispensation of the law, which we as gentiles are not under, and the divinely inspired Word of God that was given to Spirit-filled apostles. Catholics arent Christians, they are catholics. A roman denomination that is arguably responsible for the Dark Ages. Im on board with being unified, but not with those that dont take heed to Scripture and live according the promises of the New Covenant God cut with us. Im sorry guys, im not trying to argue nor am i in a position where i need to. The doctrine i live according to is pulled right out of the Infallible Word of God. If i were to come across a passage of Scripture that taught me a Pope will come to us, and be recognized as an infallible being and that i should receive scriptural interpretation from him, than maybe I would. But until then, Im gonna go ahead and let the Holy Spirit be my teacher and counselor.
Wow, where to start. First off you are right following doctrine opposed to what was given to the Apostles can bring codemnation. As for the verse in Revelations, here is a word of advice to you as you start your journey here on Catholic Answers. Catholics read verses in context to the chapter and book they are written in. You are applying a meaning to that verse that it does not intend. Now I will agree that your overall statement is still a correct one, but the verse in Revelations is not speaking to Bible as a whole. It is speaking to the book of Revelations.

Now on to the construction of the Canon. First off you are not in a position to be dictating what should or should not be in the Canon. Catholic Bishops in Unity with the Pope did that in the 300’s. The composition was not changed until the 1500’s. Protestants later REMOVED the OT Deutercanon. So far you have condemned yourself pretty handily.

Catholics aren’t Christians huh? OK, I’ll bite who exactly were the Christian for the first 1500 years of Church history? I’ll give you hint, for the first 1000 it was the Catholics for next 500 it was the Catholics and Orthodox. Now if we take you seriously we’d have to assume that when Christ died the Church died with Him until Martin Luther reinvented it. That really just doesn’t logically or historically add up does it?

“Roman denomination”? Denomination of what? There were no denominations in the Dark Ages There was The Church what today you would call Catholics and Orthodox.

As an aside here some history. The Dark Ages was caused by loss of Roman Imperial power in Western and Northern Europe. Thus allowing Germanic tribes to overrun the continent.

Finally so its you the Holy Spirit and your Bible eh? So you and you alone are privy to the Truth? Jesus Christ died so that you alone would “get it” huh? You realize that is essentially what you’re saying right? You’re saying that all the ancient Church Fathers were wrong, but you’re right. That every other Christian who disagrees with your view of Scripture is wrong but you’re right because what you know came from the Holy Spirit.

You realize that evey single Evangelical out there is thinking the same thing right? So when you guys disagree who’s wrong? Or is the Holy Spirit just messing you? All that private interpretation like what you’re doing has given the world is chaos and a new denomination a day. If the Holy Spirit was leading you guys don’t you think there would be some sort of unity?

Also I bet you’re glad you born after the Catholic Church put the Bible together for you too huh? Because what would have happened if you had been born before then and didn’t have access to one? I guess you could have never known about Jesus or the gospel message. Or what about if circumstances had occurred that kept you from being litterate? What would you have done then. No Bible so there would have been nothing for the Holy Spirit to interpret for you. Phew! Lucky you!

Sorry, no, I’ll keep the doctrines passed down by the Apostles to the bishops of the Church. If you want to keep making up your own doctrine based on part of the Bible then go ahead but I’d re-think it if I was you.
 
Im not implying that Ive arrived or have it all on the ball…Im just merely revealing the scriptural contradiction the catholic doctrine harbors. True followers of Christ, not of forefathers, wouldnt leave anything out of the Bible as it relates to their doctrine. Show me the reference God makes to the Church as Catholics in the Bible. PLEASE!!!It says In Acts that the Apostles were referred to as Christians and I dont recall the tradition of the Apostles’ Acts having anything to do with calling a man that supposedly harbors the ability to reconcile us to God (as if Christ didnt do that for us at Calvary) father. So before you conclude that i dont read scripture thoroughly take a look at what you call your priests(which doesnt make sense anyways since we, who follow Christ, are called to be a royal priesthood) and let me know what Scripture says about that. And perhaps the vain repetition of the Rosary prayer and what Scripture says about that. I could go for days if you would like. Im not trying to start arguments but if you are gonna call me out and say I leave Scripture out of my doctrine, think again. Im not saying i harbor the whole and thorough understanding of every passage I just know what I am taught by those appointed by God and by the Holy Spirit. We could talk about the images of Heaven catholics bow and pray to and kiss the feet of and what Scripture has to say about that. I mean come on.
 
In Scripture we are told that those who teach doctrine contrary to that of God that was given to the Apostles they will be condemned.
so there is no mistake would you give the specific Ch & verse you’re referring to? Thanks
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And in Revelation, the last chapter, it tells us that if anyone takes or adds to this book his name will be taken from the Book of Life.
You realize of course THAT passage refers to the book of Revelation only.
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Now Im not a scholar by any means, but i would assume that the creation of other books and passing it as doctrinal fact as far as the Catholic Church is concerned, would be considered grounds for adding to the doctrine that we were given in THE WORD OF GOD. The Apocrypha and Maccabees were not considered to be written with the divinity the Bible was.
As to your 1st point, the Catholic Church added nothing. The Jewish community was divided in the first century. To put it simply, Jews who followed Jesus and those who didn’t. The Church in the beginning was 100% Jewish. The Jews who followed Jesus and the apostles followed the Septuagint which was written in Greek. And as you know the NT was written in Greek also. The Septuagint has what you call the apocrypha. Catholics call those books the deutero canon.

The Jews who did NOT follow Jesus formed THEIR canon, minus those 7 books. The bible the Protestants received from the Catholic Church in the 16th century had all the books in them. Luther decided to go with the canon of the Jews who did NOT follow Jesus and the apostles, and he removed those books, and this is the canon the Protestants use as their OT canon today.
Luther also admitted to changing words in scripture to fit his theology. Like being saved by faith ***ALONE ***
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And as far as the catechism is concerned, well…Im not even gonna get into that. The Christian canon of Scripture is a culmination of either Biblical Historical fact as it relates to the chronology at which events came to pass during the dispensation of the law, which we as gentiles are not under, and the divinely inspired Word of God that was given to Spirit-filled apostles.
The scriptures were written by the Catholic Church, for the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church selected which writings would be canonical and which ones would not. And the same Catholic Church wrote the Catechism
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Catholics arent Christians, they are catholics. A roman denomination that is arguably responsible for the Dark Ages.

  1. *]Catholics are the first Christians. The Church was called Catholic from the 1st century.
    *]People who make the kind of argument you make are usually some brand of Protestant. You can’t trace your origins further back than the 16th century at best.
    *]The Church of Rome is who Paul writes to in his book to the Romans. He praises them for their obedience to faith in the beginning of the 1st chapter and says their faith has been heard of everywhere. He closes the book of Romans praising them again for their obedience to faith. And in the last chapter of the book says Satan will be crushed under the feet of the Church of Rome. And we know God keeps His promises, and He also finishes what He starts. I belong to the Church of Rome.
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    If i were to come across a passage of Scripture that taught me a Pope will come to us, and be recognized as an infallible being and that i should receive scriptural interpretation from him, than maybe I would. But until then, Im gonna go ahead and let the Holy Spirit be my teacher and counselor.
    Since Jesus is the one who gave us the office that Peter held, and said it would continue till the end of time, I guess you missed those passages in scripture. And since He promised even the gates of Hell would not prevail against the Church He builds on Peter, I have an iron clad God given gurantee…
 
And what if your interpretation of scripture is different form someone elses? Who is the Spirit leading? If it is meant to be just you, scripture, and Jesus, why is that formula not spelled out in Scripture? Why is the word for you in the N.T. almost always plural? When was the Bible assembled and by whom? Please help me understand you better, New.
 

… I dont recall the tradition of the Apostles’ Acts having anything to do with calling a man that supposedly harbors the ability to reconcile us to God (as if Christ didnt do that for us at Calvary) father. So before you conclude that i dont read scripture thoroughly take a look at what you call your priests(which doesnt make sense anyways since we, who follow Christ, are called to be a royal priesthood) and let me know what Scripture says about that. …
Please try to refrain from taking a shotgun approach. If you ask one question at a time, we can discuss it and give you thorough and solid answers. I will take the above part of your post and deal with it.

Reconciliation by a priest/bishop is spoken of in the scriptures. Paul himself tells us the following:

2 Corinthians 5:18-21
All this is from God, who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us the ministry of reconciliation; that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation. So we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us. We beseech you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God. For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.

cont. on next post
 
cont. from prior post

The issue of Priests

Please note that both the Old and New Testaments share much in common. The OT covenants are a foreshadowing of the New Covenant. You quoted 1 Peter 2:9 which says, “But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, God’s own people,”

Please compare this verse to the following from the OT.

Exodus 19:5-6
Now therefore, if you will obey my voice and keep my covenant, you shall be my own possession among all peoples; for all the earth is mine, and you shall be to me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation. These are the words which you shall speak to the children of Israel."

Obviously, the Jews were a priestly people in the Old Covenant just as Christians are a priestly people in the New Covenant. The declaration that we are a “priestly people” does not negate the ministerial priesthood. After God makes the declaration in Exodus concerning the people as a kingdom of priests, he then tells Moses the following:

Exodus 19:22-25
And also let the priests who come near to the Lord consecrate themselves, lest the Lord break out upon them." And Moses said to the Lord, “The people cannot come up to Mount Sinai; for thou thyself didst charge us, saying, ‘Set bounds about the mountain, and consecrate it.’” And the Lord said to him, “Go down, and come up bringing Aaron with you; but do not let the priests and the people break through to come up to the Lord, lest he break out against them.” So Moses went down to the people and told them.

Exodus 28:1-3
"THEN BRING near to you Aaron your brother, and his sons with him, from among the people of Israel, to serve me as priests–Aaron and Aaron’s sons, Nadab and Abihu, Eleazar and Ithamar. And you shall make holy garments for Aaron your brother, for glory and for beauty. And you shall speak to all who have ability, whom I have endowed with an able mind, that they make Aaron’s garments to consecrate him for my priesthood.

Exodus 28:41
And you shall put them upon Aaron your brother, and upon his sons with him, and shall anoint them and ordain them and consecrate them, that they may serve me as priests.

Likewise in the New Covenant we have deacons, presbyters/priests, and bishops. This is the ministerial priesthood of the New Covenant and it is in no way negated by your contentions.

In the OT we read about Korah’s rebellion in Numbers 16:1-33. It says in part: "NOW KORAH the son of Izhar, son of Kohath, son of Levi, and Dathan and Abiram the sons of Eliab, and On the son of Peleth, sons of Reuben, took men; and they rose up before Moses, with a number of the people of Israel, two hundred and fifty leaders of the congregation, chosen from the assembly, well-known men; and they assembled themselves together against Moses and against Aaron, and said to them, “You have gone too far! For all the congregation are holy, every one of them, and the Lord is among them; why then do you exalt yourselves above the assembly of the Lord?” When Moses heard it, he fell on his face;


Moses responds to Korah with this]

And would you seek the priesthood also? Therefore it is against the Lord that you and all your company have gathered together; what is Aaron that you murmur against him?"

Later in the narrative we read that God destroys Korah and his followers that attempted to usurp the ministerial priesthood. Likewise there is a warning in the NT. In Jude 1:11-13 it says, " Woe to them! For they walk in the way of Cain, and abandon themselves for the sake of gain to Balaam’s error, and perish in Korah’s rebellion."

The only conclusion that can be drawn from the book of Jude concerning Korah’s rebellion is that there are those that would attempt to usurp the ministerial priesthood of the New Covenant just as Korah did in the Old Covenant. Any denial of the proper place of the ministerial priesthood in the New Covenant is synonymous with Korah’s rebellion.

I hope this helps.
 
Im not implying that Ive arrived or have it all on the ball…Im just merely revealing the scriptural contradiction the catholic doctrine harbors. True followers of Christ, not of forefathers, wouldnt leave anything out of the Bible as it relates to their doctrine. Show me the reference God makes to the Church as Catholics in the Bible. PLEASE!!! It says In Acts that the Apostles were referred to as Christians and I dont recall the tradition of the Apostles’ Acts having anything to do with calling a man that supposedly harbors the ability to reconcile us to God (as if Christ didnt do that for us at Calvary) father.
Well you won’t find the term in the Bible because there was no need to create the term until people started to question the teachings of Christianity and the Apostles (and that happened pretty early on). The word “catholic”, as you may or may not know, is simply an English word that is a synonym for “universal”, although it is not commonly used outside of the context of religion anymore. The earliest recorded usage of the word is from a document from St. Ignatius of Antioch dating to around 110 AD. It is likely from the way that it is assumed that the reader would understand the term that it was probably already in common usage. Here is the quote:

Chapter 6. Unbelievers in the blood of Christ shall be condemned.

Let no man deceive himself. Both the things which are in heaven, and the glorious angels, and rulers, both visible and invisible, if they believe not in the blood of Christ, shall, in consequence, incur condemnation. “He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.” Matthew 19:12 Let not [high] place puff any one up: for that which is worth all is faith and love, to which nothing is to be preferred. But consider those who are of a different opinion with respect to the grace of Christ which has come unto us, how opposed they are to the will of God. They have no regard for love; no care for the widow, or the orphan, or the oppressed; of the bond, or of the free; of the hungry, or of the thirsty.
**
Chapter 7. Let us stand aloof from such heretics.**

They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer, because they confess not the Eucharist to be the flesh of our Saviour Jesus Christ, which suffered for our sins, and which the Father, of His goodness, raised up again. Those, therefore, who speak against this gift of God, incur death in the midst of their disputes. But it were better for them to treat it with respect, that they also might rise again. It is fitting, therefore, that you should keep aloof from such persons, and not to speak of them either in private or in public, but to give heed to the prophets, and above all, to the Gospel, in which the passion [of Christ] has been revealed to us, and the resurrection has been fully proved. But avoid all divisions, as the beginning of evils.

Chapter 8. Let nothing be done without the bishop.

See that you all follow the bishop, even as Jesus Christ does the Father, and the presbytery as you would the apostles; and reverence the deacons, as being the institution of God. Let no man do anything connected with the Church without the bishop. Let that be deemed a proper Eucharist, which is [administered] either by the bishop, or by one to whom he has entrusted it. Wherever the bishop shall appear, there let the multitude [of the people] also be; even as, wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church. It is not lawful without the bishop either to baptize or to celebrate a love-feast; but whatsoever he shall approve of, that is also pleasing to God, so that everything that is done may be secure and valid.

I have included some of the surrounding material to put it into context. I’d also like to point out the particularly interesting fact that the reason the term came into use, a term used to refer to those who accepted the minimum universal (or Catholic) requirements deemed necessary to be considered Christian, was because a few groups were questioning the doctrines of the Real Presence in the Eucharist and the authority of Bishops. So, the document also proves that these other ideas were around from the very beginnings of Christianity. Oh, and keep in mind the date of the document. These “bishops” that a few groups were failing to obey would likely have been appointed by the Apostles themselves (or at the most, been a single generation removed). 110 AD is only 10 years after the death of John. If the bishops indeed had it wrong, then the Apostles must have been terrible teachers! 🤷

Other early references to the use of the term Catholic are included in the Martyrdom of Polycarp from 155 AD, and the Muratorian Fragment, dated to around 177 AD.
 
Do yourself a favor and read some of the writings of the Early Church Fathers. To make it easy for you they can even be accessed on this site. Look at what the first generation Christians believed. Did they believe what you believe? I won’t spoil it for you, you’ll have to read for yourself.
 
In Scripture we are told that those who teach doctrine contrary to that of God that was given to the Apostles they will be condemned
Lets begin with Sola Scriptura (aka the Bible Alone). This is a doctrine which contradicts Scripture. Scripture teaches that we must keep the traditions:

2 Thessalonians 2
14 Therefore, brethren, stand fast; and hold the traditions which you have learned, whether by word, or by our epistle.

That the Word of God is passed on orally:

1 Thessalonians 2

13 Therefore, we also give thanks to God without ceasing: because, that when you had received of us the word of the hearing of God, you received it not as the word of men, but (as it is indeed) the word of God, who worketh in you that have believed.

That the Church is the final arbiter in matters of faith:

Matthew 18 Found phrase
17 And if he will not hear them: tell the church. And if he will not hear the church, let him be to thee as the heathen and publican.

That the Church is the Pillar of Truth:

1 Timothy 3

15 But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

Nowhere does the Bible say that the Bible is the sole source of doctrine nor the sole rule of faith.
And in Revelation, the last chapter, it tells us that if anyone takes or adds to this book his name will be taken from the Book of Life.
Well, Luther took out the Apocrypha (what we call the Deuterocanonicals) and added the word “alone” to faith in order to come up with another man made doctrine which contradicts the word of God:

James 2
24 Do you see that by works a man is justified; and not by faith only?
Now Im not a scholar by any means, but i would assume that the creation of other books and passing it as doctrinal fact as far as the Catholic Church is concerned, would be considered grounds for adding to the doctrine that we were given in THE WORD OF GOD. The Apocrypha and Maccabees were not considered to be written with the divinity the Bible was.
Yes, they were. The Church has accepted them from the beginning.

Cont’d
 
Cont’d
And as far as the catechism is concerned, well…Im not even gonna get into that.
That is too bad. The Catechism is the most complete commentary on the Word of God in existence.
The Christian canon of Scripture is a culmination of either Biblical Historical fact as it relates to the chronology at which events came to pass during the dispensation of the law, which we as gentiles are not under, and the divinely inspired Word of God that was given to Spirit-filled apostles. Catholics arent Christians, they are catholics.
I don’t know where you got your history. The fact is that Catholics are the original Christians and the only Christians who can trace their origins through history directly to Jesus Christ founding the Church upon Peter. I don’t know what denomination you belong to, but at the most, you can trace yourself to Luther.
A roman denomination that is arguably responsible for the Dark Ages.
Not true. The Catholic Church is responsible for the greatest universities and the greatest schools of thought of any other institution that ever existed.
Im on board with being unified, but not with those that dont take heed to Scripture
Then I suggest you leave the Protestant faith to which you belong and get on the barque of Peter. Because every doctrine which you believe which contradicts the Catholic Church also contradicts Scripture.
and live according the promises of the New Covenant God cut with us.
The New Covenant in Jesus’ blood is being lived to the full in the Catholic Church. Your covenant is a man made thing which is a horrible abomination of the truth.
Im sorry guys, im not trying to argue nor am i in a position where i need to. The doctrine i live according to is pulled right out of the Infallible Word of God.
You’ll have to prove that statement. We can begin with the pillars of your faith, Scripture alone and faith alone. Prove that those doctrines are biblical.
If i were to come across a passage of Scripture that taught me a Pope will come to us, and be recognized as an infallible being and that i should receive scriptural interpretation from him, than maybe I would. But until then, Im gonna go ahead and let the Holy Spirit be my teacher and counselor.
When and if you ever let the Holy Spirit be your teacher, you will become a Catholic. Until then, you are following traditions of men.

I’m looking forward to your explanations of your doctrines. Make sure and provide the Scripture reference.

Sincerely,

De Maria
 
Im not implying that Ive arrived or have it all on the ball…Im just merely revealing the scriptural contradiction the catholic doctrine harbors. True followers of Christ, not of forefathers, wouldnt leave anything out of the Bible as it relates to their doctrine. Show me the reference God makes to the Church as Catholics in the Bible. PLEASE!!!It says In Acts that the Apostles were referred to as Christians and I dont recall the tradition of the Apostles’ Acts having anything to do with calling a man that supposedly harbors the ability to reconcile us to God (as if Christ didnt do that for us at Calvary) father. So before you conclude that i dont read scripture thoroughly take a look at what you call your priests(which doesnt make sense anyways since we, who follow Christ, are called to be a royal priesthood) and let me know what Scripture says about that. And perhaps the vain repetition of the Rosary prayer and what Scripture says about that. I could go for days if you would like. Im not trying to start arguments but if you are gonna call me out and say I leave Scripture out of my doctrine, think again. Im not saying i harbor the whole and thorough understanding of every passage I just know what I am taught by those appointed by God and by the Holy Spirit. We could talk about the images of Heaven catholics bow and pray to and kiss the feet of and what Scripture has to say about that. I mean come on.
I’ve got a “bottom line” for ya.

You have alleged that the Catholic faith is based upon a “different gospel” and is therefore condemned.

Let me share with you my own thinking on this issue.
**Who REALLY Preaches “A Different Gospel”?

**BTW, you need to bear in mind that the passage that you refer to in Acts 11:26 is actually where non-believers (in Antioch) call us Christians and not that we ever called ourselves.

However, since you bring up Antioch, perhaps you should consider what the bishop of that very church wrote in a letter to the church at Smyrna. "CHAP. VIII.–LET NOTHING BE DONE WITHOUT THE BISHOP.

See that ye all follow the bishop, even as Christ Jesus does the Father, and the presbytery as ye would the apostles. Do ye also reverence the deacons, as those that carry out [through their office] the appointment of God. Let no man do anything connected with the Church without the bishop. Let that be deemed a proper(18) Eucharist, which is[administered] either by the bishop, or by one to whom he has entrusted it. Wherever the bishop shall appear, there let the multitude [of the people] also be; by the bishop, or by one to whom he has entrusted it. Wherever the bishop shall appear, there let the multitude [of the people] also be; even as, wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church." and since we are talking about references to the Catholic Church in scripture, let me offer you something very interesting also in the book of Acts, the 9th chapter and 31st verse of the Greek.
9:31 η μεν ουν εκκλησια καθ ολης της ιουδαιας και γαλιλαιας και σαμαρειας ειχεν ειρηνην οικοδομουμενη και πορευομενη τω φοβω του κυριου και τη παρακλησει του αγιου πνευματος επληθυνετο

The words I underlined are “ekklesia kath olos” and in most translations is rendered, “the church throughout all” which is the same as “church universal”, which is also exactly what Catholic Church means. So…are you still going to maintain that Catholic Church is not in the Bible?
 
Wow, I just want to say thanks to rtconstant, steve b, ralphinal, Pax, Rolltide, flyersfan1088, De Maria, and Church Militant… I was ready to reply to this thread but I read each of your answers and just about every point I was about to make was covered by you fine people. As I read your answers… It made me happy and proud that not only did I know the answers, but you all did too… We all express things in our own style and our own words but the meaning was clear… Excellent job!

New Perspective… when you have read these posts, I recommend that you read about the Early Church Fathers… they were the church leaders that were once removed from Christ… taught directly by the apostles. I think you will find that as they describe the early church you will see that it more resembles the Catholic and Orthodox Churches than any other.

One other thing for you to ponder NewPerspective… My priest can trace the line of bishops that he was ordained by all the way back to the Apostles… can your Pastor? This is what we call Apostolic Progression… found unbroken only in the Catholic and Orthodox priesthoods…
 
Wow, I just want to say thanks to rtconstant, steve b, ralphinal, Pax, Rolltide, flyersfan1088, De Maria, and Church Militant… I was ready to reply to this thread but I read each of your answers and just about every point I was about to make was covered by you fine people. As I read your answers… It made me happy and proud that not only did I know the answers, but you all did too… We all express things in our own style and our own words but the meaning was clear… Excellent job!

New Perspective… when you have read these posts, I recommend that you read about the Early Church Fathers… they were the church leaders that were once removed from Christ… taught directly by the apostles. I think you will find that as they describe the early church you will see that it more resembles the Catholic and Orthodox Churches than any other.

One other thing for you to ponder NewPerspective… My priest can trace the line of bishops that he was ordained by all the way back to the Apostles… can your Pastor? This is what we call Apostolic Progression… found unbroken only in the Catholic and Orthodox priesthoods…
My thoughts exactly!!! You guys did an awesome job defending the faith!! Excellent question, Paar!! Show references!!👍
 
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