Bowing before men.

[deb1]

Christian4life:

And as for being respectful, I find it funny that I have only ever been treated unkindly on these forums when I posted something that you all don’t agree with.

.

I should point out that not everyone on this thread has been disrespectful and mean to you. Some are trying to honestly answer your question. You are certainly welcome to defend yourself if you feel that you are being attacked but to say that you have only been treated unkindly is an insult to those who are taking you seriously.

 

[miguel_delgado]

come on guys wake up!!! you are playing there game,

I CONFESS IN NAME OF ALL CATHOLICS:
1.-we are idol worshippers
2.-the pope is evil
3.-there is a UFO burried under the vatican
4.-batman is an agent of the batican (batican is the secret police if the vatican)
if you think of more conspiracy theories please let me know, i love them. hahahahahahaha

THINK OF US CATHOLICS WHATEVER YOU WANT BUT REMEMBER:
JUDGE NOT, AND YOU WILL NOT BE JUDGED, CONDEMN NOT AND YOU WILL NOT BE CONDEMNED (LUKE 6,37)
AND
YOUSHALL NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS AGAINS THY NEIGHBOR.

 

[Jew_Man_73]

Christian4life:

Yeah, and you are really making me want to learn more with your snide comments and insults. Gee, I hope to be more like you, then I’d be a TRUE Christian!!!

Yes, same here! Try growing up and stop with the deliberate antagonizing comments, “Christian!” Maybe if you actually showed some Christian love, you’d receive some in return! If you had actually come to this forum with some respect to begin with, without antagonizing people and insulting the Catholic faith, you would not only have gotten better results, but maybe would have been showing some Christianity yourself! Out of all the Christians I’ve ever known, the Catholics have been the most loving, and the most harassed and misunderstood. Protestants have always been the ones who have been insulting and antagonizing, in my experience. Not that you would care. People like you only care about holding on to their cold dead forms of religion while you condemn everyone who doesn’t belong to your little tiny sect!

 

[ProdigalSun]

Christian4life:

Umm…Okay but I"m just curious, by that logic, IS there ever a point where you are worshipping someone instead of loving them?

Love & respect is due to all the people of the earth, Worship(adoration) is due our heavenly Father.

If cathoics or any human makes the mistake of making man God, that is strictly the mistake of a human.

Since you canot see into a mans heart to that which he truly believes it only makes sense that one should allow his brother the benefit of the doubt especially when that person explains his true belief.

May Christ be with you,

h

 

[Racer_X]

FYI - the Hebrew word translated in the OT as “worship” literally means “to bow down.” It used in the OT both homage to God and men. Example:

And when Abigail saw David, she hasted, and lighted off the a_ss, and fell before David on her face, and bowed (shachah) herself to the ground, - 1 Samuel 25:23

And this a perfect example of a type of biased translation practice that really bugs me. In some translations the word *shachah is *given as “worship” when done for God and as simply “bowing down” when to a human.

 

[Jew_Man_73]

I would like to extend an apology to the posters here. I’m sorry I fell for this woman’s childish, un-Christian bait tactics. She obvioulsy needs G-d in a big way. She came here to insult and antagonize faithful Catholics, and I fell for her pathetic ruse. From now on, she’ll be on my ignore list. I’m going to go pray now. For her soul, mine, and for Christian unity.

 

[Church_Militant]

Christian4life:

Yeah, and you are really making me want to learn more with your snide comments and insults. Gee, I hope to be more like you, then I’d be a TRUE Christian!!!

I don’t think I blasted ya did I…Do you have any comment on the stuff I gave you in post 19, or did ya miss it? Insidious motives…whew! Sounds more like a loaded diaper if you have a baby…LOL

 

[Christian4life]

deb1:

I should point out that not everyone on this thread has been disrespectful and mean to you. Some are trying to honestly answer your question. You are certainly welcome to defend yourself if you feel that you are being attacked but to say that you have only been treated unkindly is an insult to those who are taking you seriously.

Okay, you misunderstood me there. What I said was, “I have only ever been treated unkindly on these forums when I posted something that you all disagree with.” I’m not saying I have only been treated unkindly on this thread, I’m saying I’ve always been treated kindly on these forums UNTIL I posted something that the majority disagreed with.

I guess that’s human nature though. It is much easier to love others when they agree with you.

I never said that SOME of you weren’t truly trying to be nice and helpful. Just that some were not.

 

[MariaG]

posted by Christian4life

Well I read this again and I THINK I sort of understand where you all are coming from now. I mean if you are talking about the OT where people bowed before kings and that was alright because at that point the king was like an archetype of Christ on earth. Which would make sense in the context of the Pope since many Catholics consider him in the same way, and the same thing would apply assuming it is the case.

Just in case this has been overlooked through all this “discussion”.

 

[MonicaC]

Christian4life:

Last time I checked, bowing was considered a form of worship, not respect by my culture. So I guess if it’s part of your culture, that’s different. But being an American Catholic, if you bowed before the priest, I guess I’m thinking like fully on the ground. If you mean bow as in halfway like a butler would bow to his master, that’s different too.

But full on the ground bowing is what we’re talking about isn’t it?

I was unaware that you are basing the catholic reliegon on your culture. We really need to step out of the box here. The catholic religon is not and will never be a product of the culture. This is 2000 years of tradition. Lets not lose sight of this.

I really hope that after reading through the post you will see how judgemental you have been on everyone and maybe you can see why some have been a little mean, I am not saying that we should have been mean but I hope you can undersatand.

If you are truely looking for answers, I would suggest that you read first of all the bible, The imatation of Christ; Kempis, The Lambs supper; Hahn, and there are many other books to help educate yourself with the religon.

I truely wish you luck!

 

[Christian4life]

Jew_Man_73:

Yes, same here! Try growing up and stop with the deliberate antagonizing comments, “Christian!” Maybe if you actually showed some Christian love, you’d receive some in return! If you had actually come to this forum with some respect to begin with, without antagonizing people and insulting the Catholic faith, you would not only have gotten better results, but maybe would have been showing some Christianity yourself! Out of all the Christians I’ve ever known, the Catholics have been the most loving, and the most harassed and misunderstood. Protestants have always been the ones who have been insulting and antagonizing, in my experience. Not that you would care. People like you only care about holding on to their cold dead forms of religion while you condemn everyone who doesn’t belong to your little tiny sect!

See this is exactly what I mean, why the anger? Why the being so judgemental? Saying things like “people like you only do this” and saying that I’m “antagonizing people and insulting the Catholic faith.” Okay, I may have a few qualms with the Catholic faith, but I certianly never antagonized anyone. I am just trying to see things from both sides, and that’s kinda WHY I’m asking, to see what the other side has to say. Of course I could just go on my merry way and say, “Oh well, I know what you people think”.

In my experience there can be a very fine line when it comes to sinning. And so what I said, I’m not saying it to judge anyone, but just stating that I personally wouldn’t want to do it BECAUSE it might be sinning.

 

[Christian4life]

BTW I did re-read all my posts and the only thing I could find that was mean was when I said that I have never seen anyone stretch the truth so much. So I apologize for that as that isn’t even true, I have seen people in the media stretch the truth a lot more than that.

Other than that though I was not being mean, except perhaps to one certain big meaniehead on here, I was simply disagreeing with all of you. Because I think if you bow down to someone, that is a form of worship - from my point of view and a biblical point of view. You guys think it’s all about what goes on in the heart - and that is important, but what you do on the outside is a reflection of what is in your heart. I do understand where you’re coming from now as you give the Pope a certain amount of honor, and though it’s more than I would give anyone but God, I can see your reasons for feeling that it is alright.

Still, if you bow to the Pope, do you reserve some other form of worship for God? Or, rather, what do you consider worship?

 

[MariaG]

posted by Christian4life
I was simply disagreeing with all of you. Because I think if you bow down to someone, that is a form of worship - from my point of view and a biblical point of view. You guys think it’s all about what goes on in the heart - and that is important, but what you do on the outside is a reflection of what is in your heart.

Your point of view? Yes. Biblical? Many more Scriptures were cited that showed bowing to a human can be just that a bow. Bow =/= Worship. The scripture cited said not to bow and worship man.

One should never bow and worship anything or anybody except God.

That does not mean one should never physically bow down before anyone. You yourself said you can tell the difference between bowing in a marriage proposal and worship.

Isn’t there even a veggie tale story about a Christian or was it OT who was a slave and had to help his master bow down and worship a false god? He said although he will have to help his master down and bow, his heart would not be worshipping the false god?

Still, if you bow to the Pope, do you reserve some other form of worship for God? Or, rather, what do you consider worship?

Mass is the highest form of worship. Worship is when you involve your body, soul and mind to the worship, glory and honor of God. Worship is not what I can get out of something, but giving all that I was, am or ever will be to God and God alone.