BREAKING: Episcopal Church suspended from Anglican Communion

[7_Sorrows]

How far behind the Episcopal Church can the Church of England be in performing same-sex marriages? Already this last October, an openly married gay vicar, Andrew Foreshew-Cain, was elected to the Church of England’s General Synod. In another generation, SSM will probably be performed in the Church of England. So will the Church of England also be expelled from the Anglican Communion and how Anglican would the Anglican Communion be without England?

theguardian.com/world/2015/oct/12/britains-only-openly-married-gay-vicar-elected-to-church-of-england-synod

that is my point as well. The Anglican churches in England, Canada, Australia and New Zealand probably cannot be far behind.

Also I forgot what GAFCON stands for? I used to know back in the day I was Episcopalian and then Anglican before converting to Catholicism.

 

[GKC]

The ‘Splainer: Can the Anglican-Episcopalian marriage be saved?

religionnews.com/2016/01/14/splainer-can-anglican-episcopalian-marriage-saved/

One or two minor factual faux pas, but no one is blaming you, CB.

 

[7_Sorrows]

A wet noodle across the wrists of TEC it might be, but it is somewhat more robust a rebuke than some had anticipated.

wet noodle is a good analogy!

 

[GKC]

wet noodle is a good analogy!

As an opening move to some sort of endgame, it was not bad. Doesn’t sting much, but leaves the next step clearly in TEC’s court.

 

[GKC]

that is my point as well. The Anglican churches in England, Canada, Australia and New Zealand probably cannot be far behind.

Also I forgot what GAFCON stands for? I used to know back in the day I was Episcopalian and then Anglican before converting to Catholicism.

gafcon.org/

They are primarily from the evangelical side, so not precisely what a traditional Anglo-Catholic like me is looking for. But they are fighting as much of the good fight as I could expect anyone to.

 

[commenter]

Just a reminder, prayer is the most productive response that liberals, conservatives, and anyone else on this thread can make. It’s tempting to focus on the political and other dynamics involved, but remember human beings are being impacted by all this.

 

[GKC]

Just a reminder, prayer is the most productive response that liberals, conservatives, and anyone else on this thread can make. It’s tempting to focus on the political and other dynamics involved, but remember human beings are being impacted by all this.

And have been for over 50 years.

 

[7_Sorrows]

gafcon.org/

They are primarily from the evangelical side, so not precisely what a traditional Anglo-Catholic like me is looking for. But they are fighting as much of the good fight as I could expect anyone to.

I was so disappointed when I returned to the Episcopal church around 2002-2003 and saw all the turmoil that was taking place. I had not been a church attending Christian for many many years although baptised and confirmed in the Episcopal church. It literally wore me out the infighting going on between conservative priests battling with liberal bishops and reading what was happening at the national level. I used to read pamphlets by Stand Firm in Faith and I was just so torn inside by what was happening. I don’t know how any Episcopalians wanting to hang on to orthodox teaching has been able to hang on and remain Episcopalian unless they had a conservative bishop in their diocese that stood by the conservative priests. the liberal bishop in my diocese did not make life easy for the conservative priest I had. it took away any peace I was trying to attain by returning to church and trying to figure out how to lead a Christian life because I had principles and morals I was trying to uphold.

 

[7_Sorrows]

Just a reminder, prayer is the most productive response that liberals, conservatives, and anyone else on this thread can make. It’s tempting to focus on the political and other dynamics involved, but remember human beings are being impacted by all this.

yes! greatly impacted!

 

[GKC]

I was so disappointed when I returned to the Episcopal church around 2002-2003 and saw all the turmoil that was taking place. I had not been a church attending Christian for many many years although baptised and confirmed in the Episcopal church. It literally wore me out the infighting going on between conservative priests battling with liberal bishops and reading what was happening at the national level. I used to read pamphlets by Stand Firm in Faith and I was just so torn inside by what was happening. I don’t know how any Episcopalians wanting to hang on to orthodox teaching has been able to hang on and remain Episcopalian unless they had a conservative bishop in their diocese that stood by the conservative priests. the liberal bishop in my diocese did not make life easy for the conservative priest I had. it took away any peace I was trying to attain by returning to church and trying to figure out how to lead a Christian life because I had principles and morals I was trying to uphold.

You are well out of that. And your story is one I’ve seen before, in my parish, for those who took the Continuum path, in my family. for some who went to Rome.

 

[7_Sorrows]

You are well out of that. And your story is one I’ve seen before, in my parish, for those who took the Continuum path, in my family. for some who went to Rome.

it hasn’t been easy and I will always feel there is a part of me missing.

 

[Picky_Picky]

Thanks for the insight. The last I had seen was ++Welby saying a conference hadn’t been called yet, but that was sometime last year.

2020, the Primates decided.

The full communique, by the way, bears reading. Here;

primates2016.org/articles/2016/01/15/communique-primates/

 

[GKC]

2020, the Primates decided.

The full communique, by the way, bears reading. Here;

primates2016.org/articles/2016/01/15/communique-primates/

Thank you. I had somehow missed that, in its fullness.

Many interesting words.

 

[Usige]

2020, the Primates decided.

The full communique, by the way, bears reading. Here;

primates2016.org/articles/2016/01/15/communique-primates/

Thanks. I wonder if ACNA will be accepted into the communion and invited to the 202 Lambeth conference as a full member before then?

I guess the real question then will be if supporters of GAFCON will attend or boycott. If I was reading it correctly, GAFCON was formed before the last Lambeth conference because they felt many in the communion had abandoned biblical teachings on morality. If the 3 year “time out” for TEC doesn’t have any impact (and their recent letter doesn’t imply it will) I am curious to see if the more conservative primates will even attend if TEC and other liberal constituencies are also invited.

 

[Sy_Noe]

That means he hopes not to be voted out of the Communion, and that some form of restructuring of the Communion and the relationships of its constituent Provinces might make that possible .

Being voted out would make TEC an autocephalous Anglican Church, not belonging to the Anglican Communion (those Anglican entities who are in formal communion with themselves, and the Archbishop of Canterbury). Like the Anglican Continuum, which would be ironic. Or like the ACNA, which, currently, is not formally in the Communion.

GKC, thank you, This helps me to make more sense out of Bishop Curry’s statement. You have said though the ball is clearly in TEC’s court now. I understand your reluctance to reach any guesstimate this soon in the process. But if you were to go out on a limb and give odds or rank the possibilities for the end game in order of most likelihood, do you sense the end game will be:

1. Such a restructuring allowing TEC to remain.

2 TEC caves and no longer stands by SSM and whatever else conservatives within the Anglican Communion don’t like about TEC.

3 TEC takes Bishop Curry’s message of inclusiveness and runs away with it.

4 Merges with ELCA

5 Some other end game

 

[GKC]

GKC, thank you, This helps me to make more sense out of Bishop Curry’s statement. You have said though the ball is clearly in TEC’s court now. I understand your reluctance to reach any guesstimate this soon in the process. But if you were to go out on a limb and give odds or rank the possibilities for the end game in order of most likelihood, do you sense the end game will be:

1. Such a restructuring allowing TEC to remain.

2 TEC caves and no longer stands by SSM and whatever else conservatives within the Anglican Communion don’t like about TEC.

3 TEC takes Bishop Curry’s message of inclusiveness and runs away with it.

4 Merges with ELCA

5 Some other end game

I chose 3, 5, and 4, in decreasing likelihood, starting from some unknown level of maybeness.

Possibly.

2 is right out of the game. Only thing I wouldn’t caveat with professions of uncertainty. Absent divine intervention.

Three years is a long time. One notes that the vote of the Primates was against the enormities of TEC by a vote in excess of the GAFCON and other hardliner miters in place. There were some moderates joining in. Will this alliance hold? Or will it fade away. Will the deep pockets (or maybe not so deep) of TEC cause a rethinking of the matter? Will the ABC skillfully manage another tightrope act? What will the ACoC do at their Convention, re: SS marriages? What of the CoE, as Picky Picky has pondered?

Interesting times.

 

[GKC]

Thanks. I wonder if ACNA will be accepted into the communion and invited to the 202 Lambeth conference as a full member before then?

I guess the real question then will be if supporters of GAFCON will attend or boycott. If I was reading it correctly, GAFCON was formed before the last Lambeth conference because they felt many in the communion had abandoned biblical teachings on morality. If the 3 year “time out” for TEC doesn’t have any impact (and their recent letter doesn’t imply it will) I am curious to see if the more conservative primates will even attend if TEC and other liberal constituencies are also invited.

If the ACNA is accepted, than it means, perforce, that TEC is out of the Communion.

 

[Usige]

If the ACNA is accepted, than it means, perforce, that TEC is out of the Communion.

Assuming that is because only one province (not sure that is the right term?) can cover a geographic area, then that would mean the Anglican Church of Canada would be out also. Would that be a correct understanding of the fallout? I had read an article on CBC.ca that the Canadian Church was indirectly put on notice with the actions against the TEC.

Sorry, still trying to figure out how the communion works given it’s governing structure.

 

[theropod]

I’m not sure why it is impossible to have overlapping provinces. Rules can be changed.

 

[GKC]

I’m not sure why it is impossible to have overlapping provinces. Rules can be changed.

It’s the 1 Bishop rule.

Let us not encourage more deviations. That way lies madness.