R
rossum
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AIUI = As I Understand It.AIUI?
Then we have two things: unchanging substratum and changing appearance. The appearance is changing and not eternal. What of the substance? An acorn changes into an oak tree which changes/produces a lot of acorns, some of which turn into an oak tree and the cycle repeats. Hence, each acorn contains the substratum of an acorn/oak which originated from the original oak tree which produced the acorn. Hence the oak/acorn substratum changed from non-existent (at the time before the acorn was produced) to existent at the current time. Since there was a time when the acorn/oak substratum did not exist then it cannot be eternal.The ancient Greek view (the basis of Catholic philosophy of change) is that when a thing changes from one form to another form it happens in stages over time. That means there must be an unchanging but hidden substratum for the morphing to take place. This substratum is commonly called “matter”. The change is in its “form”. Clearly “form” means more than dimensions (shape) but includes all other qualities as well…
Matter can easily be seen. A water molecule can be observed with the correct instruments. It may present itself in the form of a gas as steam, in the form of a liquid as water or in the form of a solid as ice. The underlying molecules can be observed.“Matter” of course cannot be seen in its raw state (it has none) but is inferred from observing changing forms. How can change happen if there is nothing linking the starting form from the ending form.
You seem to be talking of a more philosophical Matter/Substance etc. To me that is just a reified concept which I reject.
If it is eternal than it was not created by God. Anything eternal does not have a beginning/cause/creation. Is God then the creator of most of the universe, but not all of it?It is eternal and like water does not change because it is itself formless…or rather “all forms” potentially.
Then you are denying the reality of causation, causation is mere appearance, not present in the substratum. There is no change or causation here, just eternal sameness.So yes, “form” (“organisation”) is fleeting, but the underlying substratum cannot be created or destroyed. So this Buddhist argument, at least at a metaphysical level, is not ironclad. its as much a mental construct, a hypothesis as this “hylomorphic” view of Aristotle.
If the acorn is the same as the oak tree, because their underlying substratum is the same, then there is no causation and no change. If the substratum of the cause is identical to the substratum of the effect then we have neither cause nor change.
rossum