Bullfighting: Justify Cruelty with Tradition

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So this girl, seemingly unaware of the horse’s stamina level, pushed it and both got injured. And we’re not supposed to feel sorry for the injured girl, but are for the horse?

Very, very misplaced sympathies. Sadly so.
No offense, but honestly, I couldn’t care any less than I do now. When one abuses and animal and gets hurt in the process, they don’t deserve sympathy. The girl, ‘unaware’ of the horse’s stamina should not have 1) been on the horse in the first place and 2) shouldn’t have run it to death until it was seriously injured. No, I don’t feel sorry for her one bit. My friend, the horse’s owner, now I empathize with her and feel for her as she’s heartbroken and wasn’t around to interfere with her son’s lack of judgement and lack of respect. And yeah, I feel sorry for the horse who may not make it.
 
No offense, but honestly, I couldn’t care any less than I do now. When one abuses and animal and gets hurt in the process, they don’t deserve sympathy. The girl, ‘unaware’ of the horse’s stamina should not have 1) been on the horse in the first place and 2) shouldn’t have run it to death until it was seriously injured. No, I don’t feel sorry for her one bit. My friend, the horse’s owner, now I empathize with her and feel for her as she’s heartbroken and wasn’t around to interfere with her son’s lack of judgement and lack of respect. And yeah, I feel sorry for the horse who may not make it.
Wowowowow!

Horses vary a LOT in what they can and cannot do. Apparently neither she nor the owner’s son really had the measure of this particular horse. This girl might have cracked her skull and/or suffered brain injury for all one knows.

And if I, not knowing where all the deer trails are, but might have known if I had studied it out sufficiently, hit a deer on the highway and go through the windshield, your sympathy is with the deer and you figure I deserved what happened to me.

Just wow!
 
Wowowowow!

Horses vary a LOT in what they can and cannot do. Apparently neither she nor the owner’s son really had the measure of this particular horse. This girl might have cracked her skull and/or suffered brain injury for all one knows.

And if I, not knowing where all the deer trails are, but might have known if I had studied it out sufficiently, hit a deer on the highway and go through the windshield, your sympathy is with the deer and you figure I deserved what happened to me.

Just wow!
Yeah WOOOW…there’s quite a bit of difference between hitting a deer that ran across the road in front of one’s car and taking someone’s animal without permission and acting like a moron and running the horse on a gravel road until it was injured insteading of having a bit of respect and just riding the horse like a normal person. Wooooowowowowoowowowow!
 
Yeah WOOOW…there’s quite a bit of difference between hitting a deer that ran across the road in front of one’s car and taking someone’s animal without permission and acting like a moron and running the horse on a gravel road until it was injured insteading of having a bit of respect and just riding the horse like a normal person. Wooooowowowowoowowowow!
And yet in the eyes of God there is an infinite difference between horses and humans.

The lowest, most worthless, depraved, drug addicted prostitute, mass murdering, rapist, death-row inmate, stupid horse driving idiot has infinitely more value to God than the most magestic and awe inspiring horse that ever lived.

I willingly accept that I will be accused of ignorance at a minimum, and of hating horses.

-Tim-
 
And yet in the eyes of God there is an infinite difference between horses and humans.

The lowest, most worthless, depraved, drug addicted prostitute, mass murdering, rapist, death-row inmate, stupid horse driving idiot has infinitely more value to God than the most magestic and awe inspiring horse that ever lived.

I willingly accept that I will be accused of ignorance at a minimum, and of hating horses.

-Tim-
It’s okay really Tim. The world is a big place with many people. You can take care of the girl (or any of the above you list) and I will take care of the horse (or any other injured animal), and both will be tended to 🙂
 
Yeah WOOOW…there’s quite a bit of difference between hitting a deer that ran across the road in front of one’s car and taking someone’s animal without permission and acting like a moron and running the horse on a gravel road until it was injured insteading of having a bit of respect and just riding the horse like a normal person. Wooooowowowowoowowowow!
How do you know she acted like a moron? You are aware, are you not, that some horses have greatly more stamina than do others? She had the son’s permission. And how does a person “ride a horse like a normal person”? Does one walk it only? What? Horses are, by the way, capable of running on gravel.

My brother was riding his horse one day; a very good horse. Since horses generally are capable of running without dying or getting injured and do it all the time by themselves, and my brother knew what he was doing, he galloped the horse. Because horses are often bred more for appearance and speed than stamina, the horse broke a leg simply running. That’s not an infrequent thing with horses. My brother, of course, took a terrific tumble when it did. But my brother didn’t have the horse’s legs x-rayed before running it.

Would your sympathies exclude my brother in this event?
 
It’s okay really Tim. The world is a big place with many people. You can take care of the girl (or any of the above you list) and I will take care of the horse (or any other injured animal), and both will be tended to 🙂
I met a fellow not long ago who was studying veterinary medicine then decided to go to medical school instead. Perhaps he should have if his dedication to people was greater than his dedication to animals.

The reverse is also possible for some, and perhaps advisable.
 
abidewithme:

If you take take the time to do a search you will find actual pictures of horses being gored by the bulls. It is a known fact that the horses vocal chords are slit so the crowd is not turned off by their screams in pain as they are gored.

Below is only one of many articles written against the abuses of bullfighting. It is unreasonable to think I should have to reprint every article to satisfy you. However, you can take the time and research this to educate yourself. Fortunately, the graphic pictures of horses being gored have not followed this article but please do a search on you tube if you must see all the gorey details of the cruelity the horses are subjected to.

Furthermore, I do not fox hunt. I rode jumpers in the 60’s and have been riding dressage since the early 70’s when it was brought to this country Since then I have been traied to the Grand Prix level and have brought many horses along to different levels. While there are Nuno lovers out there I am trained in the Spanish riding school methods (German).

I do hope you are not trying to equate actual Dressage with what one will see in the bull ring of terrified horses frantically twisting themselves into pretzels trying desperately to escape from a raging terrified bull as one has zero to do with the other no matter what one uneducated eye may think it sees.

I suppose you feel dog fighting is ok too since some people feel it is a tradition.

Horses - the forgotten victims of bullfighting

June 26, 2006

by Maria Lopes

What is a bullfight, and who suffers in this bloody so-called sport?

This photo is from 2001 in the bullring of Madrid.

A horse is blind-folded before
being used in a bullfight.

In Anglo-Saxon countries it is regarded as a sport, perhaps due to lack of knowledge.

It is, after all, banned throughout the UK and the Commonwealth nations, as well as most of Europe. In countries where bullfighting is allowed it is increasingly becoming recognised as sheer barbarity. This savagery involves two beautiful animals, bulls and horses. While the bulls are guaranteed to die, the future of the horses is often no brighter.

Bullfights take place in three European countries, France, Portugal and Spain and in some parts of Latin America. In some states of North America a form of bullfight is permitted but the animal is covered with velcro and the spears used are imitation.

It’s commonly believed that in Portuguese bullfights bulls or horses don’t suffer unlike the Spanish versions. This is unfortunately a myth since the suffering is the same in both bullfight styles.

The only difference is that in Spanish bullrings the bull is killed in the ring instead of in the slaughterhouse when the “entertainment” is over.

Every year more than 50,000 bulls are killed in bullfights in Europe alone. Countless horses die or suffer severe injuries.

Bullfighters claim that bulls bred for bullfights are aggressive and fearsome animals. This is also untrue. They fight because they are fighting for their lives.

This photo was taken during a bullfight in Spain. The horse was killed.

But bulls are not the only creatures to suffer in bullrings. The tormented bull does not understand that it is the man on the horse’s back that is causing his pain, only that he is in agony. He therefore sees the horse as his enemy as much as the man.
It’s not unusual for horses used in bullfights to be so badly gored by the bulls that they have to be killed, but only after they have been dragged from the ring and the view of the spectators.

Spanish bullfights also employ “picadors”, men on horseback armed with spears.

These horses are often gored even though they are protected by what is termed a “peto”, or a protective cape. These petos often do little more than hide the horses wounds.

Scene from a Portuguese bullfight.
The horses are blind-folded to prevent them from becoming terror stricken at the charge of the bull. It is commonly believed that their ears are stuffed with cottonwool to prevent them from panicking and their vocal cords cut to stop them screaming with fear at the bull’s attack.

As little as 12 days ago in Madrid another horse was gored by a bull and had to be killed.

This is the fate of these beautiful animals. To be used to entertain a crowd that lusts for blood and claims that bullfighting is a tradition and “cultural heritage”.

What about the brave matadors, picadors and their ilk? Bullfighters are rarely injured and seldom killed in the ring. With their armoury of weapons to weaken the bull until it can no longer fight, their lives are not at great risk. In fact, in the last 50 years only 10 bullfighters have been killed worldwide.

Should you ever find yourself in a country where bullfighting is practiced, please do not be tempted to attend one of these sadistic displays. The continuation of bullfighting depends on government subsidies and the tourist industry. Don’t be an accomplice to this savagery by supporting it with your dollars.

Maria Lopes is the Co-ordinator of the International Movement Against Bullfights
© www.iwab.org 2006
This article may not be reproduced in any form without prior permission.
Further information:
Take a look at the International Movement Against Bullfights website.
We suggest you read the “ongoing campaigns” section.
 
abidewithme:

If you take take the time to do a search you will find actual pictures of horses being gored by the bulls. It is a known fact that the horses vocal chords are slit so the crowd is not turned off by their screams in pain as they are gored.

Below is only one of many articles written against the abuses of bullfighting. It is unreasonable to think I should have to reprint every article to satisfy you. However, you can take the time and research this to educate yourself. Fortunately, the graphic pictures of horses being gored have not followed this article but please do a search on you tube if you must see all the gorey details of the cruelity the horses are subjected to.

Furthermore, I do not fox hunt. I rode jumpers in the 60’s and have been riding dressage since the early 70’s when it was brought to this country Since then I have been traied to the Grand Prix level and have brought many horses along to different levels. While there are Nuno lovers out there I am trained in the Spanish riding school methods (German).

I do hope you are not trying to equate actual Dressage with what one will see in the bull ring of terrified horses frantically twisting themselves into pretzels trying desperately to escape from a raging terrified bull as one has zero to do with the other no matter what one uneducated eye may think it sees.

I suppose you feel dog fighting is ok too since some people feel it is a tradition.

Horses - the forgotten victims of bullfighting

June 26, 2006

by Maria Lopes

What is a bullfight, and who suffers in this bloody so-called sport?

This photo is from 2001 in the bullring of Madrid.

A horse is blind-folded before
being used in a bullfight.

In Anglo-Saxon countries it is regarded as a sport, perhaps due to lack of knowledge.

It is, after all, banned throughout the UK and the Commonwealth nations, as well as most of Europe. In countries where bullfighting is allowed it is increasingly becoming recognised as sheer barbarity. This savagery involves two beautiful animals, bulls and horses. While the bulls are guaranteed to die, the future of the horses is often no brighter.

Bullfights take place in three European countries, France, Portugal and Spain and in some parts of Latin America. In some states of North America a form of bullfight is permitted but the animal is covered with velcro and the spears used are imitation.

It’s commonly believed that in Portuguese bullfights bulls or horses don’t suffer unlike the Spanish versions. This is unfortunately a myth since the suffering is the same in both bullfight styles.

The only difference is that in Spanish bullrings the bull is killed in the ring instead of in the slaughterhouse when the “entertainment” is over.

Every year more than 50,000 bulls are killed in bullfights in Europe alone. Countless horses die or suffer severe injuries.

Bullfighters claim that bulls bred for bullfights are aggressive and fearsome animals. This is also untrue. They fight because they are fighting for their lives.

This photo was taken during a bullfight in Spain. The horse was killed.

But bulls are not the only creatures to suffer in bullrings. The tormented bull does not understand that it is the man on the horse’s back that is causing his pain, only that he is in agony. He therefore sees the horse as his enemy as much as the man.
It’s not unusual for horses used in bullfights to be so badly gored by the bulls that they have to be killed, but only after they have been dragged from the ring and the view of the spectators.

Spanish bullfights also employ “picadors”, men on horseback armed with spears.

These horses are often gored even though they are protected by what is termed a “peto”, or a protective cape. These petos often do little more than hide the horses wounds.

Scene from a Portuguese bullfight.
The horses are blind-folded to prevent them from becoming terror stricken at the charge of the bull. It is commonly believed that their ears are stuffed with cottonwool to prevent them from panicking and their vocal cords cut to stop them screaming with fear at the bull’s attack.

As little as 12 days ago in Madrid another horse was gored by a bull and had to be killed.

This is the fate of these beautiful animals. To be used to entertain a crowd that lusts for blood and claims that bullfighting is a tradition and “cultural heritage”.

What about the brave matadors, picadors and their ilk? Bullfighters are rarely injured and seldom killed in the ring. With their armoury of weapons to weaken the bull until it can no longer fight, their lives are not at great risk. In fact, in the last 50 years only 10 bullfighters have been killed worldwide.

Should you ever find yourself in a country where bullfighting is practiced, please do not be tempted to attend one of these sadistic displays. The continuation of bullfighting depends on government subsidies and the tourist industry. Don’t be an accomplice to this savagery by supporting it with your dollars.

Maria Lopes is the Co-ordinator of the International Movement Against Bullfights
© www.iwab.org 2006
This article may not be reproduced in any form without prior permission.
Further information:
Take a look at the International Movement Against Bullfights website.
We suggest you read the “ongoing campaigns” section.
 
Something tells me that Spencelo had abandoned this thread seeing as how he’s making new threads. 🙂
His passion is protecting the animals. We all have our passions and callings. He’s not fighting for them any less than any of us fight for that which we believe in.
 
I wouldn’t be very pleased if someone ran my horse on gravel. As a matter of fact, I would probably be hauled off to the pokey.😃 Why would you run a horse on gravel if you don’t mind my asking? Are you aware that there are footing materials specifically made to work horses on and not one is gravel. This is to prevent any un-necessary injury to the concussion points in the feet and legs.

Running a horse on gravel is heartless. A horse only has so much running distance in him anyway before he expires from exhaustion.

They are pretty much like us, flesh and bone. They feel pain, they bleed, they even mourn the passing of their pasture mate.

Their middle name is not Mattel and they are not sold at Toy’s Are Us.
 
His passion is protecting the animals. We all have our passions and callings. He’s not fighting for them any less than any of us fight for that which we believe in.
He believes that animals deserve the same rights as humans, and in certain cases MORE rights than humans. Not exactly the same thing
 
I wouldn’t be very pleased if someone ran my horse on gravel. As a matter of fact, I would probably be hauled off to the pokey.😃 Why would you run a horse on gravel if you don’t mind my asking? Are you aware that there are footing materials specifically made to work horses on and not one is gravel. This is to prevent any un-necessary injury to the concussion points in the feet and legs.

Running a horse on gravel is heartless. A horse only has so much running distance in him anyway before he expires from exhaustion.

They are pretty much like us, flesh and bone. They feel pain, they bleed, they even mourn the passing of their pasture mate.

Their middle name is not Mattel and they are not sold at Toy’s Are Us.
Because the person was a complete moron, that’s why. That’s why I said: people who abuse animals get what they deserve, and I have no sympathy for this girl. At all. I don’t CARE what happens to her. And I don’t care who is offended by that. Whoever cares can put their money where their mouth is and pay for her to go to a hospital because she doesn’t even care enough about herself to do so and is ‘riding it out’. Good luck to her, I hope it turns out well. But that horse, on the other hand, has smashed teeth, a gashed up hock and several chucks of meat missing from this accident. She may not even be rideable again and that’s being optimistic. She may have to be put down over this. This was serious and it was because a human being was not being humane.
 
He believes that animals deserve the same rights as humans, and in certain cases MORE rights than humans. Not exactly the same thing
In some cases they do. The deserve to not be abused. A human being doesn’t have the right to abuse an animal. That animal’s right not to be abused trumps a moronic human who thinks they have the right to abuse an animal. And I’m thinking God might agree with that one 👍
 
Guys, let us focus on the discussion on bullfighting.
I cheer for the bull 😃

Seriously I do. And you that tradition of running the bull down the roads? I cheer when the people get run over and smashed and thrown across the road by the bulls.
 
Bulls aren’t “warriors,” but slaves forced to fight in a kind of gladiator ring - all for the purpose of crowd entertainment.
But even the slaves were spared sometimes if the crowd went thumbs up. All bulls die in a bull-]fight/-]kill.
 
But even the slaves were spared sometimes if the crowd went thumbs up. All bulls die in a bull-]fight/-]kill.
I think there may be rare exceptions to that, but even still, the whole practice is wrong.
 
"Respect for the integrity of creation

2415 The seventh commandment enjoins respect for the integrity of creation. Animals, like plants and inanimate beings, are by nature destined for the common good of past, present, and future humanity.195 Use of the mineral, vegetable, and animal resources of the universe cannot be divorced from respect for moral imperatives. Man’s dominion over inanimate and other living beings granted by the Creator is not absolute; it is limited by concern for the quality of life of his neighbor, including generations to come; it requires a religious respect for the integrity of creation.196

2416 Animals are God’s creatures. He surrounds them with his providential care. By their mere existence they bless him and give him glory.197 Thus men owe them kindness. We should recall the gentleness with which saints like St. Francis of Assisi or St. Philip Neri treated animals.

2417 God entrusted animals to the stewardship of those whom he created in his own image.198 Hence it is legitimate to use animals for food and clothing. They may be domesticated to help man in his work and leisure. Medical and scientific experimentation on animals is a morally acceptable practice if it remains within reasonable limits and contributes to caring for or saving human lives.

2418** It is contrary to human dignity to cause animals to suffer or die needlessly**. It is likewise unworthy to spend money on them that should as a priority go to the relief of human misery. One can love animals; one should not direct to them the affection due only to persons."
So yes, I do have a problem with bull fighting if there is needless suffering caused to the bull. I’m not aware of any kind of bull fight which doesn’t cause such needless suffering to bulls (if there are such fights, please let me know). Therefore, I am opposed to bull fighting.
Spencelo, this answers your question to what Catholics are at least supposed to believe.
And I would guess that most Catholics do believe this teaching in the catechism to be true.

Notice the red bolded part mentions that this is contrary to human dignity- I love that.
 
In some cases they do. The deserve to not be abused. A human being doesn’t have the right to abuse an animal. That animal’s right not to be abused trumps a moronic human who thinks they have the right to abuse an animal. And I’m thinking God might agree with that one 👍
Rence, what I meant was he thinks that dogs and mentally disabled humans are equals; depending on the level of mental disability, dogs can possibly be superior.

I am HUGE against animal abuse, and am very against bullfighting, but I also don’t want humans killed because of harm done to animals, no matter how cruel. Prosecuted and incarcerated, yes, but not killed. Even during a bullfight.
 
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