CAF Bible Study - James

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Pug:

The Greek in that passage (StudyLight Strongs #1374 &182 & Side by Side) would seem to be talking about someone who isn’t commited to the Lord or who still isn’t submitted to him or is trying to do things his own ways. If you look later on in the Epistle of James, I think you’ll see them and their prayers described:

Draw near to God and he will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you men of double mind.
Your Brother in Christ, Michael

NT:1252

diakrinoo;

to be separated
  1. to separate, make a distinction, discriminate Acts 15:9
  2. to learn by discrimination, to try, decide: Matt 16:3
Passive voice and middle voice to be parted, to separate oneself from;
  1. to withdraw from one, desert him
  2. to separate oneself in a hostile spirit, to oppose, strive with, dispute, contend: with the dative of person Jude 9
  3. in a sense not found in secular authors, to be at variance with oneself, hesitate, doubt: Matt 21:21
    (from Thayer’s Greek Lexicon, Electronic Database. Copyright © 2000, 2003 by Biblesoft, Inc. All rights reserved.)
To me it almost has the sense of saying “Ok, God, I need wisdom, so I am asking You. You probably won’t really give it to me, but I am supposed to ask, so I am…”
 
Actually, I was referring to the fact that Ferdinand Mary and Church Militant expressly stated that this was not to be a debate thread. Since I’m terrible for getting myself into a debate of some sort anywhere I post, I thought it would be a good idea to stay off this thread as much as possible. 😉
Maria:

Several of us agreed to these stipulations because we felt we needed to work on that or a similar problem. Could it be that the Lord has brought you here so that He could deal with that area with your live?

One thing is certain - You wouldn’t be alone…
Thanks for the kind invitation. I’ll think about it. 😃 I’m sure I can jump in here and there, but frankly, I’m not very good at reflections or meditations. My words really flow mainly when I’m challenging something somebody else said! :o However, you have a good point.

Maria
…Although you can jump in and out, you’ll get the most benefit by participating on a daily basis. Not only will you learn the Scriptures, but you will learn how to reflect on Scripture and what others are saying and have said and to respond accordingly.

I invite you to try this just for Lent - You’ll be amazed at how much you’ll grow if you do this.

Your Brother in Christ, Michael
 
I actually sat doewn and read the whole book of James last night. I’ve never to my memory read an entire book of the Bible at one sitting. The comprehension wasn’t good, but the experience was.
 
What is this wisdom that we will receive (1:5) if we ask? I’ve met Mormons who think this means you can ask God a question about if the book of Mormon is true or not, and He will answer you. I think they are wrong.

I have heard this also. Jesus often told people be it done to you according to your faith". Therefore, I think if people approach the task of authenticating the book of Mormon faithfully, then this wisdom will be revealed to them. However, scripture also says “claiming to be wise, they became as fools”. So, I think both things will happen!

Later in the epistle, James talks about the “wisdom from above”. I think that wisdom is more likely to be intended (3:17). Or perhaps what wisdom we can have for the asking is the wisdom learned by trial, by suffering.
J
ames 3:17-18
17 But the wisdom from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, reasonable, full of mercy and good fruits, unwavering, without hypocrisy. 18 And the seed whose fruit is righteousness is sown in peace by those who make peace.

Another point that I wonder about is that God will give us this wisdom, but we must ask in faith, not doubting. If we are “double-minded” we must not expect anything. What is this “double-minded”? I wonder, especially in the context of the whole letter, which truly emphasizes that faith without works is useless. Is the faith that we ask with supposed to be a faith with works? Is being double-minded the same as being someone who says they have faith, but doesn’t help their brother? Is it the same thing as looking at yourself in the mirror, but walking away, forgetting what you look like? The double-minded are exhorted to be pure of heart in 4:8. Is it that they still partly follow the world that makes them double-minded?

This is very well said. If our faith is not the kind that is ready to take action on what has been revealed, then it is a very limited faith. I think double minded means that we are asking,but we are also assuming “well, probably He will not answer”
 
17: Every good endowment and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change.
How often to we take His gifts for granted! How often do we give thanks and acknowledge Him for our blessings!

27: Religion that is pure and undefiled before God and the Father is this: to visit orphans and widows in their affliction, and to keep oneself unstained from the world.
We must not forget charity (agape) when it comes to those in great need. I supose in those times not much different in our own, orphans were forgotten about and were in need of direction and examples of rightousness. These were most likely to stray of the right path. It is no wonder God requires us to look out after them. Our charity towards them reflects the goodness and love our Lord. Same thing with widows, in those days they were most likely dependant on their husbans for food and shelter. We can imagine the grief and hurt these women felt. These women needed encouragement ans support from the bretheren. Those involved in the charity do the work that God promised to take care of His children. Mt 10:29-31.
Although we have to remember to keep ourselves unstained from the those of the world. We have to remember that faith and works mean nothing if we don’t have love 1 Cor 13:1-13. We cannot be like the Pharisees who expected praise superficially for their works from others. We must do charity to those in need like if they were Christ themselves.
 
It always helps to have two or three different translations at hand when studying the Bible. Translating ancient writings is as much an art as a science.

That’s why I like to say, “Read the book as a book first.” Grasp the writer’s intent before picking verses apart – that makes things a lot easier.

I like to remember the first sentence of a book report, "The theme of this book is . . . " If you can write that sentence, you understand the book.
Vern:

Well said. I’ve even found it to be a good idea to have the links to 4 or more translations along with an interlinear, and that it’s a good idea to read book before discussing it (something that actually can be done with an Epistle such as James).

May hou have a happy fast.

Your Brother in Christ, Michael
 
NT:1252

diakrinoo;

to be separated
  1. to separate, make a distinction, discriminate Acts 15:9
  2. to learn by discrimination, to try, decide: Matt 16:3
Passive voice and middle voice to be parted, to separate oneself from;
  1. to withdraw from one, desert him
  2. to separate oneself in a hostile spirit, to oppose, strive with, dispute, contend: with the dative of person Jude 9
  3. in a sense not found in secular authors, to be at variance with oneself, hesitate, doubt: Matt 21:21
    (from Thayer’s Greek Lexicon, Electronic Database. Copyright © 2000, 2003 by Biblesoft, Inc. All rights reserved.)
To me it almost has the sense of saying “Ok, God, I need wisdom, so I am asking You. You probably won’t really give it to me, but I am supposed to ask, so I am…”
guanophore:

I’m sure it was obvious that I’m not a Greek scholar, but I saw no reason why I shouldn’t try to see if the Greek NT from StudyLight, etc. would help to clarify things.

Actually, in this case, you may have clarified things more than I, as I think your interpretation is correct (it also agrees with a few tanslations & commentries I’ve looked at). I was just trying to stay with the tenor of the letter and the situation of the people the Apostle James was writing to.

In a way, I think we make things harder, either by complicating things as we look for things that aren’t there or not seeing the obvious ones that are, or by forgetting that we have been bought at a dear price and begotten as Sons and Daughters of God.

Your Brother in Christ, Michael
 
Brothers & Sisters:

I know this is going back, but I “discovered” (got hit with God’s 2x4) 2 Scriptures that are both very appropriate for 2 of the sections in the 1st chapter:

James 1:2-4 RSV-CE

Count it all joy, my brethren, when you meet various trials, for you know that the testing of your faith produces steadfastness. And let steadfastness have its full effect, that you may be perfect and complete, lacking in nothing.

Romans 5:3-5 RSV-CE

*More than that, we rejoice in our sufferings, knowing that suffering produces endurance, and endurance produces character, and character produces hope, and hope does not disappoint us, because God’s love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit who has been given to us. *

The original RSV said “Holy Spirit which”. The CE changed “Which” to “who”, which changes the Holy Spirit from a thing to a PERSON. Huge difference.

James 1:5-8 RSV-CE

If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask God, who gives to all men generously and without reproaching, and it will be given him. But let him ask in faith, with no doubting, for he who doubts is like a wave of the sea that is driven and tossed by the wind. For that person must not suppose that a double-minded man, unstable in all his ways, will receive anything from the Lord.

Romans 8:26-27 RSV-CE

*Likewise the Spirit helps us in our weakness; for we do not know how to pray as we ought, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with sighs too deep for words. And he who searches the hearts of men knows what is the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God. *

When we submit to God and pray in the Spirit, we will not be “Double-minded”, and the Spirit will speak through and for us.

A preacher I used to know once said that James was for those who were ready for the MEAT of the Gospel. Was that guy ever right!

Your Brother in Christ, Michael
 
Romans 8:26-27 RSV-CE

*Likewise the Spirit helps us in our weakness; for we do not know how to pray as we ought, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with sighs too deep for words. And he who searches the hearts of men knows what is the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God. *

When we submit to God and pray in the Spirit, we will not be “Double-minded”, and the Spirit will speak through and for us.
Michael,

I find this passage comforting. It is so nice to know that prayer doesn’t just depend on us. I think James is a good letter for CM to have chosen for lent, perhaps especially since it is not so comforting. It gives me a little jolt.
 
I actually sat doewn and read the whole book of James last night. I’ve never to my memory read an entire book of the Bible at one sitting. The comprehension wasn’t good, but the experience was.
It will get there little sister of mine. It will get there. Try not to rush.👍
 
26: If any one thinks he is religious, and does not bridle his tongue but deceives his heart, this man’s religion is vain.
27: Religion that is pure and undefiled before God and the Father is this: to visit orphans and widows in their affliction, and to keep oneself unstained from the world.
This is one verse that I find relevant to those who tell me that they are not part of a religion but a relationship with Jesus.

It appears that the idea of religion is validly found in scripture while terminology that speaks of “a relationship with Jesus” per se is not.

Now, I am not saying that we don’t have a relationship with God, because I know that I certainly do. A very intimate one. However, to deny “religion” is unscriptural.

Look also at what a good religion consists of. “27: Religion that is pure and undefiled before God and the Father is this: to visit orphans and widows in their affliction, and to keep oneself unstained from the world.” Shhh, aren’t those works? :eek:
Pax Domini sit semper vobiscum.
 
Brothers and Sisters:

I grew up with this understanding of James 1:19-20:

So then, my beloved brethren, let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath; for the wrath of man does not produce the righteousness of God. James 1:19-20 NKJV

Partly because of this passage from the Epistle of the Apostle Paul to the Ephesians:

“In your anger do not sin”: Do not let the sun go down while you are still angry, and do not give the devil a foothold. Eph 4:26-27 NIV

You see, Our Lord Jesus was Righteously Indignant when he cleared the money changers and animal sellers out of the Court of the Gentiles - He had a purpose and never lost control.

OTOH, when we give in to Anger and allow it to control us, the result is WRATH, or Uncontrollable Anger, which can produce nothing but harm and sin while, at the same time, giving the Devil a foothold he can use to weaken, tempt and eventually oppress and enslave us.

One reason St. Paul said to do not the Sun go down on our anger is that Anger that we mull over can become WRATH.

Your Brother in Christ, Michael
 
Michael,

I find this passage comforting. It is so nice to know that prayer doesn’t just depend on us. I think James is a good letter for CM to have chosen for lent, perhaps especially since it is not so comforting. It gives me a little jolt.
Pug:

I hope that it will comfort you in the old sense of the word, that is, that it will strengthen you and provide you with a reason to pray (esp. for others who are in dire need) when you don’t feel like it or don’t feel that your prayers will do anything for them.

YBIC, Michael
 
James Chapter 2:
1: My brethren, show no partiality as you hold the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory.
2: For if a man with gold rings and in fine clothing comes into your assembly, and a poor man in shabby clothing also comes in,
3: and you pay attention to the one who wears the fine clothing and say, “Have a seat here, please,” while you say to the poor man, “Stand there,” or, “Sit at my feet,”
4: have you not made distinctions among yourselves, and become judges with evil thoughts?
5: Listen, my beloved brethren. Has not God chosen those who are poor in the world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom which he has promised to those who love him?
6: But you have dishonored the poor man. Is it not the rich who oppress you, is it not they who drag you into court?
7: Is it not they who blaspheme that honorable name which was invoked over you?
8: If you really fulfil the royal law, according to the scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well.
9: But if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by the law as transgressors.
10: For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become guilty of all of it.
11: For he who said, “Do not commit adultery,” said also, “Do not kill.” If you do not commit adultery but do kill, you have become a transgressor of the law.
12: So speak and so act as those who are to be judged under the law of liberty.
13: For judgment is without mercy to one who has shown no mercy; yet mercy triumphs over judgment.
14: What does it profit, my brethren, if a man says he has faith but has not works? Can his faith save him?
15: If a brother or sister is ill-clad and in lack of daily food,
16: and one of you says to them, “Go in peace, be warmed and filled,” without giving them the things needed for the body, what does it profit?
17: So faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead.
18: But some one will say, “You have faith and I have works.” Show me your faith apart from your works, and I by my works will show you my faith.
19: You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe – and shudder.
20: Do you want to be shown, you shallow man, that faith apart from works is barren?
21: Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he offered his son Isaac upon the altar?
22: You see that faith was active along with his works, and faith was completed by works,
23: and the scripture was fulfilled which says, “Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned to him as righteousness”; and he was called the friend of God.
24: You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone.
25: And in the same way was not also Rahab the harlot justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out another way?
26: For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, so faith apart from works is dead.
 
26: For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, so faith apart from works is dead.
And that, in my opinion is the major theme of the book – “Get off your Catholic butts and get to work.”😉
 
22: You see that faith was active along with his works, and faith was completed by works,
Works complete faith; this shows to me that “works” are an integral part of what is meant by “faith”. Works are the acts we perform in obedience to what Our Lord has told us to do. (There are several Scripture passages where obedience is equated with faith - eg. John 3:36; Hebrews 3:18-19; Romans 1:5)

Nita
 
James Chapter 2:

My brethren, show no partiality as you hold the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory. For if a man with gold rings and in fine clothing comes into your assembly, and a poor man in shabby clothing also comes in, and you pay attention to the one who wears the fine clothing and say, “Have a seat here, please,” while you say to the poor man, “Stand there,” or, “Sit at my feet,” have you not made distinctions among yourselves, and become judges with evil thoughts?

Listen, my beloved brethren. Has not God chosen those who are poor in the world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom which he has promised to those who love him? But you have dishonored the poor man. Is it not the rich who oppress you, is it not they who drag you into court? Is it not they who blaspheme that honorable name which was invoked over you?

If you really fulfil the royal law, according to the scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well. But if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by the law as transgressors. For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become guilty of all of it.
Church Militant:

This may be the most difficult and painful chapter in the Scriptures - This is the one that gave Martin Luther and the “Reformers” such fits, and the one we fall and stumble on the most.

I could spend a few days looking up and listing Scriptures where God tells the Israelites that they were oppressing the poor and denying them justice at the Gate while rigging the courts and the rest of life for the rich. And, That it for this (among other things) that He overthrow the Northern Kingdom of Samaria and the southern Kingdom of Judah.

James, here, is saying that the New Israel (the Church) has the same problem that the old Israel had, and that God won’t tolerate it any more from us than He did from them.

Someone I know went on a tour on one of the Pre-Revolutionary War Era churches in Boston. When the tour guide asked her name, he pointed to one of the front pews and said that was her pew - Her ex-husband’s ancesters had furnished all of the mohagany for the church, and that was one of the ways people had of “buying pews” in those days.

At St. Mary’s, we recently broke tradition and baptized a rich family’s baby on a Sat. instead of the Sunday as would have been usual - He was even allowed to bring in a guest priest. I’m extending mercy to my friend (there’s a long story I can’t talk about here, but there was a lot of acrimony and bad feelings, and some people behaved quite badly), But I really don’t know why he didn’t just do it at his new parish with his new pastor (also a friend of mine).

I understand the Church received a much needed grant of money which was used to repair the roof, but I don’t see that (+ what else I know) as valid and licit reason for breaking with the Christian Tradition of Baptizing into the Body of Christ in the presence of the Body of Christ.

And, I’m sure that we can all think when we’ve shown the front pew to the nicely dressed couple while telling the smelly homeless guy to sit in the back. or, Chosen the well dressed man with the squeeky voice instead the shabbily dressed man with the booming voice as a Lector for Mass. or, Invited the guy with the Mercedes S-Class and the “Investments” instead the guy who had to take the bus and was absolutely broke to join us at Mass and Bible Study. or, Brought the guy with the boat and the huge house instead of the one with the rusty bike and a rented hovel to the K of C meeting…

(Real pity, because the guys with the Merc & the boat doesn’t want to hear about it, while the guys who are broke are starving for it and would be so grateful to God you wouldn’t believe it)

Your Brother in Christ, Michael
 
In my little church, we have three people who are mentally handicapped and living in an assisted living facility. We see to it they get to Mass and other church activities, and encourage them to play productive roles – such as passing the collection basket, taking tickets at a fish fry and so on. Letting them contribute is our way of letting them sit at the head table.
 
17 So faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead.
Therefore what is this saved by faith only doctrine? Why remove the works part of the equation? Why choose death? :confused:
 
Hello everyone. I found this thread the other day. It took me a little while to read through everything but I’ve finally caught up with you. I don’t post very much but I am here.
 
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