Calling All Catholics!

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O.S.Luke

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I’ve been posting here for a few years, and these types of posts come in cycles:

“Calling all non-Catholic Christians”
“Non-Catholic Christians - Did You Know?”
“For All the Protestants On This Forum”

The thread then starts off with something like “Let us assume that the Catholic Church is wrong”, or “Hypothetically…” or some similar sentiment.

Let’s just call it what it is: it’s baiting for a fight, pure and simple.

Is this just backlash against Catholic bigotry? If it is, I would suggest that Catholics not lower themselves to respond to such immoral behavior against people that should know better.

However, If it’s an honest attempt for conversation, do you see how it’s really not helpful?

Were I a wandering Christian without a church or communion to call home, I suspect I would feel more invited by kind and gentle sentiment than chastisement and less-than-genuine sentiment such as baiting and taunting.

My :twocents:
 
I feel it too, and I am Catholic. I think some of it is backlash, but nto all. Honestly, I think that many people mean well but are not going about it the right way. Some of these baiting threads have lead to some good discussion and some of the more innocent threads have lead to some poor exchanges. It seems like the board goes through stages of this. When it first started, there was not much baiting on the Catholic part and very little from the non-Catholic. It seems to be in a antagonistic stage right now. It will pass.

One thing that bothers me is the percieved level of anti-semitism on here. I am not accusing anyone of anything, but many people seem to read it from some posters. I don’t mind anti-Catholic attacks. But, all non-Catholics are visitors and should be treated with respect.
 
Yeah, I also think it’s baiting. If I’d seen some of those posts when I was converting, I’d probably still be Baptist. :eek: Just kidding. Still, I think the threads could be worded in a more non-bait way. I tend to avoid those posts these days.
 
As a participant in the latest “Calling all non-Catholics” thread, I’ve found it beneficial in some ways. One individual and I picked our piece of territory to cover and have been discussing it, keeping each other on topic, even if it has been tempting at times to stray. 😃 I believe we’ve come to better understand each others’ presuppositions regarding how God works and the nature of the church, although there is still room for more discussion.

I’ve noted with interest that most other posters on the thread have left our discussion alone, some option for the lines of discussion that have more “fireworks” and others carving out small niches of their own.

What I’ve taken from it is that some have a need to self-assure that they are “right” and some have a need to “win”. Others have an actual interest in understanding the non-Catholic POV and some prompted from from a genuine desire to share their understanding of truth with others believe this might be a good way to get the ball rolling. I’ve found a half-dozen posts or so usually makes it clear which category someone belongs in.

The other benefit that I’ve found is that if one is truly interested in evaluating the Catholic position and clearly articulates one’s concerns in a thread, then many people who might be hesitant to “enter the fray” are more than will to send suggestions for research sources and other materials via private message.

Cheers! 🙂
 
Ok got the list. I am calling all Catholic’s right now. WOW over a billion on this list…this could take awhile…I will report back when I’m done…😃

BTW…anyone have a snicker bar…
 
O.S. I agree. I hope to think that I’m getting better at discerning those who are really open to dialogue and those who just want a fight.
 
O.S.Luke said:
I’ve been posting here for a few years, and these types of posts come in cycles:

“Calling all non-Catholic Christians”
“Non-Catholic Christians - Did You Know?”
“For All the Protestants On This Forum”

The thread then starts off with something like “Let us assume that the Catholic Church is wrong”, or “Hypothetically…” or some similar sentiment.

Let’s just call it what it is: it’s baiting for a fight, pure and simple.

Is this just backlash against Catholic bigotry? If it is, I would suggest that Catholics not lower themselves to respond to such immoral behavior against people that should know better.

However, If it’s an honest attempt for conversation, do you see how it’s really not helpful?

Were I a wandering Christian without a church or communion to call home, I suspect I would feel more invited by kind and gentle sentiment than chastisement and less-than-genuine sentiment such as baiting and taunting.

My :twocents:
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I understand where you’re coming from completely. Some posters do come across that way, however many of them are well-intentioned. They might not be the most prudent posters, but their hearts are there, wouldn’t you say?

Alaha minokhoun
Andrew
 
Unfortunately, OS is right alot of the time. I have been reading lots of posts lately that seem to have a slight edge to them, and that really is sad. I am not a Catholic, but I certainly intend to not treat anyone with disrespect, and its nice in turn to be treated as such.
Getting into arguements is very counterproductive, but I also think that alot of comments that seem to be arguementive are just a person who is really passionate about what they believe, and that they dont really mean to sound sharp, but unfortunately, there are a few probably from both sides that should use thoughtfulness before hitting the send key. I enjoy reading what you guys believe. Its always a good thing to be willing to learn!
God bless!🙂
 
Stephen_C said:
Ok got the list. I am calling all Catholic’s right now. WOW over a billion on this list…this could take awhile…I will report back when I’m done…😃

BTW…anyone have a snicker bar…
Click to expand...
Ok just got done calling all Catholic’s…but I was just handed another list to call… My fellow Christian brothers and sisters who are not in full communion with us Catholic’s…oh well I did stock up on snickers… 🙂
 
Bible_Believer said:
I have been reading lots of posts lately that seem to have a slight edge to them,
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…a “slight edge”???

Did you happen to catch the last thread on Sedevacanists? (Before the mods pulled it)

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

You’re far more charitable than most 👍
 
Brother_John said:
…a “slight edge”???

Did you happen to catch the last thread on Sedevacanists? (Before the mods pulled it)

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

You’re far more charitable than most 👍
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Sedavac WHO??? LOL!! Afraid I mustve missed out! What is a Sedevacanist??
And thank you!! I just happen to think its possible to talk as friends even if we do differ in what we believe. My dearest friend of 30 years is the most devout Roman Catholic you will ever meet, and she is incredibly dear to me!
🙂
 
Bible_Believer said:
Sedavac WHO??? LOL!! Afraid I mustve missed out! What is a Sedevacanist??
And thank you!! I just happen to think its possible to talk as friends even if we do differ in what we believe. My dearest friend of 30 years is the most devout Roman Catholic you will ever meet, and she is incredibly dear to me!
🙂
Click to expand...
In order of hostility that I have seen:
  1. “Mainstream” Catholics vs. Sedevacanists
  2. Catholics vs Catholics
  3. RC vs EO
  4. Catholics vs Protestants
A sedevacanist beleives that there has not been a valid pope in decades. They are Catholic, but think the wheels have flat run off the bus. THere is no valid pope and the current cardinals are all invalid, too. The word means “the chair is vacant”
 
O.S.Luke said:
I’ve been posting here for a few years, and these types of posts come in cycles:

“Calling all non-Catholic Christians”
“Non-Catholic Christians - Did You Know?”
“For All the Protestants On This Forum”

The thread then starts off with something like “Let us assume that the Catholic Church is wrong”, or “Hypothetically…” or some similar sentiment.

Let’s just call it what it is: it’s baiting for a fight, pure and simple.

Is this just backlash against Catholic bigotry? If it is, I would suggest that Catholics not lower themselves to respond to such immoral behavior against people that should know better.

However, If it’s an honest attempt for conversation, do you see how it’s really not helpful?

Were I a wandering Christian without a church or communion to call home, I suspect I would feel more invited by kind and gentle sentiment than chastisement and less-than-genuine sentiment such as baiting and taunting.

My :twocents:
Click to expand...
Outside of the forums it seems the Catholics are the ones who are at the receiving end of the baiting stick. When coming here though it is easy to vent ones frustrations because let’s face it, it’s easier to say things here in a relatively anonymous environment than it is face to face with a real person. I doubt that most of the people here posting these threads have the same kinds of conversations outside the forums or even debates.

Not to say that if someone is just looking for a fight is ok whether Catholic or not. It isn’t. Then again some people do come here with the best intentions but after being accused of ‘Mary Worship’ ‘Idolotry’ and ‘Whore of Babylon’ for the umpteenth time they just let loose and want to know why they are being accused of and labled something they are not. Their intentions are honorable. But unfortunately many things can get misconstrued in this type of communication.

Some just need to cool off and think it through before posting. I think that would give them a chance to post in a more charitble manner.

:irish3:
 
Years ago, I used to participate in newsgroups, especially in the alt categories. The Mac newsgroup was heavily trolled by Windows users…you can imagine the rumbles. 😦

It’s human nature, a particularly immature manifestation.

The Alt.Christianity.Roman Catholic newsgroup (whatever that’s called, I forget now) was a real cesspool back then, it could not be worse now. It attracted every possible kind of critic: from Pagans to Atheists to other Christians, plus angry feminists and abortion rights activists.

If you didn’t have a strong constitution, it could be upsetting.

So there is definitely a place for these moderated HTML discussion forums. Especially so when the focus is Catholic Christianity. But characters don’t improve just because the screen is nicer, it seems many people enjoy instigating a Battle Royale once in a while, especially when they think it is ultimately for a good cause (their cause). They should realize the approach is so off-putting that whatever cause they champion is going to lose big in the public mind; and most of the visitors here rarely post, they can read the nonsense, get offended, and form lasting negative impressions just because someone became unnecessarily ignorant.

Moderation is a thankless task (and not always 100% unbiased and even-handed), but absolutely necessary. The moderators here are pretty good, I have to admit, even on their bad days.

When I see a thread that is obvious bait, I do my best to avoid it. It reminds me of those immature bigots I used to read on the newsgroups. I cannot stand the headaches, and it isn’t worth putting up with just so someone else can get their internet jollies.

Michael
 
Of late… I don’t see much that is edifying here for Catholic - non-Catholic debate. The more recent threads appear, at least to me, to contain a lot of Catholic backlash and payback for the anti-Catholicism people have experienced over the years. There are of course some wonderful exceptions, but I fear they are just that - exceptions.

If Catholics aren’t going to budge an inch with the Orthodox, I really don’t see much point in Catholic-Protestant dialogue. Do you?

I have a lot of respect for the Catholic faith. I don’t feel that is returned in many of the conversations here, tho. Perhaps this dialogue is just fruitless.

O+
 
O.S.Luke said:
Of late… I don’t see much that is edifying here for Catholic - non-Catholic debate. The more recent threads appear, at least to me, to contain a lot of Catholic backlash and payback for the anti-Catholicism people have experienced over the years. There are of course some wonderful exceptions, but I fear they are just that - exceptions.

If Catholics aren’t going to budge an inch with the Orthodox, I really don’t see much point in Catholic-Protestant dialogue. Do you?

I have a lot of respect for the Catholic faith. I don’t feel that is returned in many of the conversations here, tho. Perhaps this dialogue is just fruitless.

O+
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I am in general agreement with the comments here.
**
Michael
 
I do have a question for anyone on here. There are many who want more unity between the various branches of Christianity. However, some of the divisions are caused by a difference in doctrine. How can you compromise on this when changing the doctrine changes your faith? This is not only a Catholic issue. All denominations that have doctrinal differences are included in this. How can we be one when we do not agree on essentials?
 
O.S.Luke said:
Of late… I don’t see much that is edifying here for Catholic - non-Catholic debate. The more recent threads appear, at least to me, to contain a lot of Catholic backlash and payback for the anti-Catholicism people have experienced over the years. There are of course some wonderful exceptions, but I fear they are just that - exceptions.

If Catholics aren’t going to budge an inch with the Orthodox, I really don’t see much point in Catholic-Protestant dialogue. Do you?

I have a lot of respect for the Catholic faith. I don’t feel that is returned in many of the conversations here, tho. Perhaps this dialogue is just fruitless.

O+
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Dialogue between us will not likely result in a unification. As a Catholic, I have no authority to do so. I don’t know how much authority you have OS in the Methodist Church. However, conversation/dialogue can gain greater understanding which does have a fruit.

And you are right, I do think that sometimes there is too much “payback”. But that doesn’t mean you and I can’t talk.
 
ralphinal said:
I do have a question for anyone on here. There are many who want more unity between the various branches of Christianity. However, some of the divisions are caused by a difference in doctrine. How can you compromise on this when changing the doctrine changes your faith? This is not only a Catholic issue. All denominations that have doctrinal differences are included in this. How can we be one when we do not agree on essentials?
Click to expand...
I hate to state this, because it may sound like a stereotypical Orthodox answer. But really I believe it and have been expounding on this in different ways lately.

We need to return to the mystery with awe and wonder.

If you think just for a minute about the Christological agreements and Justification statements and all those other things that are happening between churches, what do you suppose is the actual ratioanale for them?

The churches are agreeing that, in theory, they have been believing the same things all along but using different words to describe them. The two parties never admit that they use THE WRONG words, just different words that don’t carry the ideas well!

What is that if it’s not mystery? Perhaps they are not WRONG words at all (giving the benefit of the doubt) just confusing words and terms to be applied to creatures like us. Terms that have divided us, like the ancients were divided at the Tower of Babel.

The problem is, these “developments” were intended to clarify, and instead have split the church wide open. By doing this, the words, terms, phrases have lost their legitimacy, they have confused the faithful rather than clarified.

When we can say something like “we have believed the same things all along, but used different words” we are saying that the doctrine has been a mystery.

Gods ways are not our ways. What makes logical good sense to we human creatures may be foolishness to God. Ours is a religion of paradox and wonder, we might just as well accept it.

Let us return to the revealed Truth, and back away as far as is possible from the derivative explanations of that Truth, which are all naturally inadequate, because they come from us.

Michael
 
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