Can a defrocked priest remain in the faith?

[TracyJ]

Interesting to note what Can. 291 says:

In other words, unless a priest’s ordination is declared invalid, he is still bound by the law to be celibate even if he is laicized or is booted from the priesthood.

Peace,
Dante

That’s odd, I know a man who was a priest, met a woman he fell in love with, was laicized and who married and remained a Catholic in good standing.

 

[TracyJ]

What disturbs me about some priests’ sexual affairs is that they seem to come to light involuntarily. It sounds to my ears something along the lines of . . .

“It’s OK so long as you don’t get caught.”

Wouldn’t have it been better if Fr. Cutie had gone privately to his superiors and discussed his relationship with this woman because he was troubled by it rather than be forced to bring it into the spotlight by having photographs published?

How long would the inappropriate relationship continued if there hadn’t been photographs? If they hadn’t been caught?

I’m just a new Catholic middle-aged married woman, but is seems to me that if a priest goes to his superiors saying

*“This is wrong, I know, but I was weak and one thing led to another and now what do I do - will you help me?” *

then he should be given all the caring assistance we can give him to discern what his future holds. If he requests to leave the priesthood or chooses to stay, then I feel he should be treated with the utmost compassion and respect.

But if he was caught in the act, then to my thinking, the situation might have gone on indefinitely and there is little evidence of remorse or repentance. This would make a difference in what the next steps would be, if I were the a position of authority.

And, yes, the same thinking applies to a spouse. If my husband were to come to me with an admission of guilt for something he did, it would feel different to me than if I caught him by happenstance. I’m guessing many parents feel the same way about their children’s behavior also.

Just my 2 cents.

Are you questioning his remorse?
I figured that he was truly sorry for causing scandal, such as it is, but that he wasn’t
sorry that he had fallen in love with a woman.

 

[TracyJ]

i dont like to judge no one. but this priest could have avoid embarassment to the Church, instead he went to a beach where the outside world could see him and cause scandal to the Church. all he had to do was go to the Bishop and ask for a leave so could marry.

i think this priest let fame and beauty get to his head.

sorry, just my opinion.

He may have wanted to be caught so he could stop living a double life, so perhaps on
a subconscious level he did set himself up.
Love does crazy things to people.
Personally, I find the entire situation very romantic, but that’s just me.
It’s pretty clear from his comments that he still loves the Church and he wants both.

 

[anlej]

Wasn’t there a time when priests were able to marry, raise a family and remain priests in the Catholic church but, because of financial pressures ( the church being obliged to maintain the widows and children of the clergy) this was altered and celibacy was enforced?

 

[7_Sorrows]

The Church, like the Father, is always ready to welcome back. But it takes two to reconcile. Before the part where the Father forgives the prodigal son, the son had to undergo a “conversion”- a “change of mind”. Same in this case- Fr Cutie will have to undergo a similar conversion. Right now it is not looking good since he keeps speaking out against celibacy and the Church. His supporters also seem to ignore the fact that he is in an adulterous relationship, clearly spoken of against in the Bible. But I keep praying for him and all those people who are in danger of leaving the Church beacuse of him.

i heard him speak in an interview the other morning on a morning show and he is NOT speaking out against celibacy. he says that he has respect for celibacy in the priesthood and does not want to be the poster boy for why priests should not be celibate.

someone mentioned that the episcopal church were opening their arms to him.
he seems very intelligent and said that this woman had been a friend for many years and they had been in a relationship the last two years and he should have come out in the open about it back then or at least a year ago.

 

[7_Sorrows]

He may have wanted to be caught so he could stop living a double life, so perhaps on
a subconscious level he did set himself up.
Love does crazy things to people.
Personally, I find the entire situation very romantic, but that’s just me.
It’s pretty clear from his comments that he still loves the Church and he wants both.

i also wonder if he did not set himself up. after all, he did have his own radio show or tv show or both and probably knew the right people to call and let them know when they would be at the beach and snap some photos and this way, he would have to come forward.

it must make them feel bad when men from other religions who convert and join the priesthood are able to remain married. they just cannot remarry if their spouse dies.

 

[tee_eff_em]

Wasn’t there a time when priests were able to marry, raise a family and remain priests in the Catholic church but, because of financial pressures ( the church being obliged to maintain the widows and children of the clergy) this was altered and celibacy was enforced?

To my knowledge, there has never been a time when priests have been routinely allowed to marry.

Married men, however, are routinely allowed to be ordained.

tee

 

[anlej]

It was Pope Gregory VII in the 11th c who decreed that priests should be celibate, this was ratified by subsequent Popes, so presumably priests where allowed to marry before this time

 

[Aramis]

That’s odd, I know a man who was a priest, met a woman he fell in love with, was laicized and who married and remained a Catholic in good standing.

I’m related to one:
Thomas B

I know another…
Kent B

Plus two brothers who’d taken final vows, and got dispensation to leave the dominicans and marry women they met while dominican brothers:
Tony B
Joseph W

Last I heard, Jo and Cathy were doing youth ministry in Cour d’ Lane, ID
Kent was in Seattle, still deprogramming cultists
Tony recently became elligible to retire, and his wife works in the public schools, teaching music.

Tom’s wife recently left him; Please pray for him. He was, after all, the priest who baptized me! (He’s also a second cousin of mine.)

 

[marlo]

The tradition of clerical celibacy was solemnly proclaimed by the church through the following

the Council of Nicaea, the First Ecumenical Council, in 325. Canon No. 3,

This great synod absolutely forbids a bishop, presbyter, deacon or any of the clergy to keep a woman who has been brought in to live with him, with the exception of course of his mother or sister or aunt, or of any person who is above suspicion.

The Council of Carthage in 390 stated that celibacy of is Apostolic origin.

The Council of Carthage, 390 AD, canon 3:It is fitting that the holy bishops and priests of God as well as the Levites, i.e. those who are in the service of the divine sacraments, observe perfect continence, so that they may obtain in all simplicity what they are asking from God; what the Apostles taught and what antiquity itself observed, let us also endeavour to keep

The bishops declared unanimously: It pleases us all that bishop, priest and deacon, guardians of purity, abstain from conjugal intercourse with their wives, so that those who serve at the altar may keep a perfect chastity.

St. Epiphanius of Salamis (ca. 315-403): “It is the Apostles themselves who decreed this law.”

    St. Jerome (ca. 342-420):  "Priests and deacons must be either virgins or widowers before being ordained, or at least observe perpetual continence after their ordination....  If married men find this difficult to endure, they should not turn against me, but rather against Holy Writ and the entire ecclesiastical order."

    Pope St. Innocent I (401-417):  "This is not a matter of imposing upon the clergy new and arbitrary obligations, but rather of reminding them of those which the tradition of the Apostles and the Fathers has

transmitted to us."

    St. Peter Damian (1007-1072) wrote:  "No one can be ignorant of the fact that all the Fathers of the Catholic Church unanimously imposed the inviolable rule of continence on clerics in major orders."

en.allexperts.com/q/Catholics-955/chastity.htm

It was Pope Gregory VII in the 11th c who decreed that priests should be celibate, this was ratified by subsequent Popes, so presumably priests where allowed to marry before this time

 

[tee_eff_em]

It was Pope Gregory VII in the 11th c who decreed that priests should be celibate, this was ratified by subsequent Popes, so presumably priests where allowed to marry before this time

I presume no such thing.

Prior to the imposition of clerical celibacy in the Latin Rite were priests routinely allowed to marry? Or were married men allowed to become ordained?

The order is important.

tee

 

[rinnie]

While I am very sorry for what has happened to this Priest, I give him credit for a couple of things. He admitted he was wrong. admitted he is confused and never tried to blame the Church or the Church teaching’s for his sin.

I think that like every one of us he has one problem. He is human. And humans sin. Its just his sin is judged by many, rightly so. because he is to be a role model for all.

I pray for him, and that he can get the guidence from God to get back where God wants him to be. I have faith in my Religion and God that this will indeed happen. God understands his struggles, and I am sure the devil is in his glory. But I trust God, and know that whatever happens we have a forgiving God and he loves us. It will work out according to Gods Plan. And I will continue to pray for his struggles, we all know how difficult it could be to choose. I would not want to be in his shoes.

 

[palmas85]

I presume no such thing.

Prior to the imposition of clerical celibacy in the Latin Rite were priests routinely allowed to marry? Or were married men allowed to become ordained?

The order is important.

tee

Look to the Eastern Churches for your answer. Married men could become Priests. A Priest **could not **marry after ordination. If the wife of a Priest died he **could not **re marry . ALL Bishops were and still are required to be unmarried.

 

[tee_eff_em]

Look to the Eastern Churches for your answer. Married men could become Priests. A Priest **could not **marry after ordination. If the wife of a Priest died he **could not **re marry . ALL Bishops were and still are required to be unmarried.

Yes, I know.

But does [user]anlej[/user]?

I know too: Sometimes my Socratic-method posting style is too subtle for my own good.

tee

 

[PacoG]

i think this priest let fame and beauty get to his head.

sorry, just my opinion.

First, don’t apologize for your opinion. However, it seems like fame is a bad thing for good priests. Look at what happened to Fr. John Mary Klobuchar and Fr. Francis Mary Stone from EWTN.

There are very few priests like Bishop Fulton Sheen and Fr. Mitch Pacwa who have the special charism to preach on TV and have the special grace that comes with such a charism that enables them to resist the pomps of the devil.