Can a married Catholic in good conscience use contraception?

[setter]

I think they did that to themselves. I’m just pointing out the facts of the case.

How about chewing on some “judge not lest you be judged” humble pie?

 

[jmcrae]

Being a “compliant puppet” is not the ideal, but it is often the first step to sanctification. Often times people begin doing God’s will out of servile fear, but we must continue to grow so that we do so out of love of Him.

Cervantes put something into the mouth of Don Quixote that has always stuck with me - he said (I’m paraphrasing), “If you can’t be a good person, then you ought to be a hypocrite, since it is better to be a dishonest person who has the appearance of being a good person (thus setting a good example to the young in spite of your bad tendencies) than it would be to be a bad person who is open and honest about being bad. After all, think of the women and children.”

I always thought that made good sense.

 

[LilyM]

This sounds awfully heavy handed …are folks supposed to be simply a bunch of compliant puppets?

“He who loves me will keep my commands” - not just the easy ones or the ones that SOUND good.

 

[setter]

No. People misunderstand what conscience is. It’s not whatever you feel you can do. St. Catherine of Siena, a great Doctor of the Church, described our conscience like a watchdog, that barks and alerts us when we shouldn’t do something or when there is something we should do. But, if we fail to feed that dog, he will become weak, and his barking will become softer and softer and until he can’t bark anymore. This is what has happened to a lot of Catholics–they have not fed their conscience with the sacraments (especially confession, without which their Communions become sacrligious) and the word of God as proclaimed by the Pope and bishops throughout the centuries.

It is not their conscience saying contraception is ok–it is their lower appetite which they have allowed to cloud their judgment.

But I have had more than one parsih priest say that one can in good conscience choose to contracept given the psecifics of my marital situation. Am I to believe a forum poster, or any lay Catholicv for that matter, over an ordained priest?

 

[jmcrae]

How about chewing on some “judge not lest you be judged” humble pie?

Who am I judging? It is God who judges. But He’s not going to judge us by surprise, or by some unknown criteria. If we knew what was good, and failed to do good, we will go to Hell. If we had the ability to know what was good, and we deliberately failed to learn it in order that we could pretend to be ignorant of the good, in order to justify our evil-doing, then we will go even deeper into Hell.

We can deceive ourselves, but we cannot deceive God.

 

[setter]

Being a “compliant puppet” is not the ideal, but it is often the first step to sanctification. Often times people begin doing God’s will out of servile fear, but we must continue to grow so that we do so out of love of Him.

So you are suggesting that I violate my person integrity, become a compliant puppet, then this better postions me to accept more wholeheartidly what the Church teaches over my own God given conscience? Why should I compromise my self as such?

 

[mercygate]

How about chewing on some “judge not lest you be judged” humble pie?

No judgment of people here. Discernment in a case like this is a gift of the Holy Spirit called “Counsel.” That scripture about not judging can be used to deny the differences between Mother Teresa and Adolf Hitler. It’s the justification of relativism 101.

 

[mercygate]

So you are suggesting that I violate my person integrity, become a compliant puppet, then this better postions me to accept more wholeheartidly what the Church teaches over my own God given conscience? Why should I compromise my self as such?

If the Church is Who you know her to be (if you are Catholic), then you KNOW that where your so-called conscience stands in contravention of a clear and well articulated teaching, you are the one who needs to change. That’s not being a puppet. That is being a son. That is placing the desires of your flesh under the command of your powers of reason, intellect and will.

 

[Cari]

But I have had more than one parsih priest say that one can in good conscience choose to contracept given the psecifics of my marital situation. Am I to believe a forum poster, or any lay Catholicv for that matter, over an ordained priest?

I’ve had my parish priest tell me that the nature of NFP means that it can never be used as a contraceptive. My parish priest was completely flummoxed when I pressed him, asking about couples who developed a “contraceptive mentality” and used NFP to avoid having children even though no reason to do so existed.

My son’s godfather was informed by his parish priest that, since they had 10 children already, a vasectomy would be ok.

And we all know about that horrible expose by that Italian paper, where someone posed as a penetent and went from confessional to confessional, recording the wide variety of responses he got about topics such as contraception (which several priests sanctioned).

I don’t know the specifics of your situation. I am simply posting this to point out that one can hear things from one’s priest that are not in line with Church teachings.

Cheers,
Cari

 

[mercygate]

But I have had more than one parsih priest say that one can in good conscience choose to contracept given the psecifics of my marital situation. Am I to believe a forum poster, or any lay Catholicv for that matter, over an ordained priest?

Did your priest ask you about NFP?

 

[Genesis315]

So you are suggesting that I violate my person integrity, become a compliant puppet, then this better postions me to accept more wholeheartidly what the Church teaches over my own God given conscience? Why should I compromise my self as such?

Because, God calls us to love Him selflessly–like Jesus who loved so selflessly He was obedient to death, death on a cross. We must love Him and our neighbor without regard to self–abandon your self to God. Self centeredness is our downfall if we remain entrenched in it. St. Catherine wrote a lot about this in her *Dialogue *(dictated in ecstacy) in which she also discussed our conscience.

Likewise, you have to feed our conscience and free it from being repressed by our concupiscence. If your conscience is conflicting with the truth that has been handed down, it means you have allowed your flesh to overcome the Spirit. The best remedy is penance, prayer, and self-denial.

 

[Della]

But I have had more than one parsih priest say that one can in good conscience choose to contracept given the psecifics of my marital situation. Am I to believe a forum poster, or any lay Catholicv for that matter, over an ordained priest?

So we have to ask: Why bring it up on the forum if you already have an answer from priests? I ask in all seriousness and absolutely no snarkiness at all, believe me.

Our doctors have been trained and brought up in the contraception mentality. They pass out contraceptives to women for all sorts of things like candy at Halloween.

You should look into the Pope Paul VI Institute. There are other options for women than “the pill”. It could certainly do you no harm to see if the options they present might be helpful to you. Yes?

 

[guanophore]

Okay …but what if a Catholic is convinced that they are acting in good conscience, virtuous and exercising prudence in their decision to use contraception …because they have ample and serious reason to do so and in heart of heart have no qualms with using contraception based on their specific circumstances. Does this not constitute “good” conscience?

I recommend you read theology of the body by JP II. Then you will understand why this decision will always go against God;s intention for marriage.

 

[Genesis315]

Priests are sinners like us all. They are under a lot of pressure and often, like any of us, they give the easier answer even if it is erroneous. When a lower authority contradicts a higher one, we must obey the higher one. The Pope and bishops currently and for the last 2000 years or so are higher than a priest

 

[jmcrae]

So you are suggesting that I violate my person integrity, become a compliant puppet, then this better postions me to accept more wholeheartidly what the Church teaches over my own God given conscience? Why should I compromise my self as such?

If you are worried about compromising yourself, why do you fill your body (or your loved one’s body) with harmful chemicals that interfere with your (her) God-given fertility and compromise your (her) physical health?

 

[mercygate]

. . . accept more wholeheartidly what the Church teaches over my own God given conscience? . . .

Come to think of it, your “God given conscience” would have no problem with this teaching of the Church because it is based in natural law. It is your corrupted, culturally conditioned, worldly conscience that is aggrieved.

 

[LJN21]

But I have had more than one parsih priest say that one can in good conscience choose to contracept given the psecifics of my marital situation. Am I to believe a forum poster, or any lay Catholicv for that matter, over an ordained priest?

You have the responsibility to know your Catholic faith. If anyone regardless of who it is tells you something contrary to what the Church teaches, you are to believe the traditional teaching of the Church. Priest and Bishop do not have the authority to contract the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

If your priest told you it was okay to go kill someone you dislike does that make it okay?

 

[jmcrae]

Come to think of it, your “God given conscience” would have no problem with this teaching of the Church because it is based in natural law. It is your corrupted, culturally conditioned, worldly conscience that is aggrieved.

 

[kage_ar]

So you are suggesting that I violate my person integrity, become a compliant puppet, then this better postions me to accept more wholeheartidly what the Church teaches over my own God given conscience? Why should I compromise my self as such?

You should become TRANSFORMED!

Romans 12 - give it a read, it is the passage that begins:

"1 I urge you therefore, brothers, by the mercies of God, to offer your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and pleasing to God, your spiritual worship. 2 Do not conform yourselves to this age but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and pleasing and perfect. 3 For by the grace given to me I tell everyone among you not to think of himself more highly than one ought to think, but to think soberly, each according to the measure of faith that God has apportioned.

 

[gardenswithkids]

But I have had more than one parsih priest say that one can in good conscience choose to contracept given the psecifics of my marital situation. Am I to believe a forum poster, or any lay Catholicv for that matter, over an ordained priest?

Setter, I don’t know your individual circumstances.

In some situations, people can legitimately use medicine that has the side effect of preventing pregnancy. The hormones found in birth control pills can be used for other medicinal purposes beyond contraception. Some may argue that those artificial hormones just mask the real problem and that doctors are too quick to prescribe birth control pills as magic cure-all instead of finding the root cause of the problem. Nevertheless, if used to attempt correct a problem, such medicines can be used legitimately. If they regard fertility and children as the problem that requires correction, then, IMHO, a problem lies deeper within their hearts.