Can a married Catholic in good conscience use contraception?

[setter]

Both man and law are made for God, though. And by him. Maybe NFP is indeed too risky. That leaves one option - abstinence.

According to the monsignor, “marital instablity” due to prolonged marital continence is in itself justification for introducing some form of contracpetion …along the lines of the lesser of two evils. Though he did qualify that sterilization is more serious becuse it is permanent, versus other temporary non-abortifacient forms, and that both partners must be “comfortable” with whatever form of contraception is chosen.

 

[MilesXpisti]

According to the priests that I consulted, the prohibition against contraception and not everything in the Catechism is infallible teaching. Who am I to believe or trust? Why would any priest lead me astray? Thay are there to teach and guide the flock, are they not? Btw – What are your credentials?

What were the credentials of the Arius, priest and presbyter of the Church when he denied the truth of the Most Holy Trinity? What were the credentials of the priest Pelagius when he challenged that men where born free of original sin? They too were priests and they were wrong.

 

[setter]

Of course there is no way to debate you on any of this. We post the teachigs of the Church and link to the source and you dismiss it by saying “oh well a Priest told me otherwise”.

Quite a debating tactic-you never really have to justify your views, you dont have to reconcile them with Church teaching-you just dismiss them by quoting some “priest” you supposedly talked to you that told you the Church didnt know what they were talking about.

What are you insinuating …that I have fabricated or embellished this stuff …all that I have attrbuted as being stated by these priests at the hands and price of my personal experience, actually did occur. Not very nice of you.

 

[setter]

What were the credentials of the Arius, priest and presbyter of the Church when he denied the truth of the Most Holy Trinity? What were the credentials of the priest Pelagius when he challenged that men where born free of original sin? They too were priests and they were wrong.

Good point.

 

[estesbob]

According to the priests that I consulted, the prohibition against contraception and not everything in the Catechism is infallible teaching. Who am I to believe or trust? Why would any priest lead me astray? Thay are there to teach and guide the flock, are they not? Btw – What are your credentials?

Have you read Huamae Vitae? Ask your Preist about that…

I can see you have decided that contraception is OK for you so I am at a loss as to why you continue to try and justify it to us. Why would you care what we think? Every comment that is made to you you either dismiss as being “judgemental” or being contradicted by what some Priest told you. What is the purpose of this discussion?

 

[setter]

You can trust the Vicar of Christ, men who through the ages have consistently and unswervingly condemn contraception. Priests do not enjoy the charism of infallibility. Even the bishops don’t have it, unless they are teaching in unity, of spirit and orthodoxy, with the Holy Father. Humanae Vitae is both infallible through ordinary magisterium, as it is the consistent teaching of the Universal Church, and extraordinary as it very clearly meets the requirements of ex cathedra infallibility as set down in Vatican I. There is no wiggle room, no matter what any Catholic, lay or religious, has to say about it. Rome has spoken, the cause is ended.

Succinctly and clearly put …I cannot see how anyone can dispute that.

 

[MilesXpisti]

Good point.

Thank you. But this situtation is precisely why Catholics must be well-informed of the faith, because there are a multitude of Catholic religious, extending even into the Cardinalate (for example Cardinal Martini of Milan), that believe that the Church must change its views to coincide with the world at large. Some have an agenda, others were just as poorly catechized in liberal seminaries. Whether they mean well or ill is irrelevant…they are wrong and the perennial faith is eternal truth.

 

[estesbob]

What are you insinuating …that I have fabricated or embellished this stuff …all that I have attrbuted as being stated by these priests at the hands and price of my personal experience, actually did occur. Not very nice of you.

iI am not insinuating anything and if you tookl it that way i apologize. I am just pointing out the fultilty of having a discussion where you dismiss everything said by saying a Priest told you otherwise.

I am, BTW, not completely dismissive of your position. I struggled with the Church teaching on Contraception for years. it took lots of Prayer and several readings of Haumane Vita to realize the wisdom of what teach. i also recognize. It is avery easy for us to recite church teaching to while you, OTH you are obviously emeshed in a situation none of can relate to . All i can do is tell you what the Church teaches and you can take it fromthere

 

[setter]

Have you read Huamae Vitae? Ask your Preist about that…

I can see you have decided that contraception is OK for you so I am at a loss as to why you continue to try and justify it to us. Why would you care what we think? Every comment that is made to you you either dismiss as being “judgemental” or being contradicted by what some Priest told you. What is the purpose of this discussion?

Thank you estesbob and everyone else for your persistent and charitable presentation of the faith. The purpose of this discussion was 1) to allow me to indulge myself in trying to understand the mind set of those I have repeatidly encounterd who take dissident positions and have tried to lead me into error and plant doubt that authoritative Church teaching can be trusted; 2) demonstrate the lack of intellectual basis and honesty put forth, by those clergy and laity alike that I have personally encountered, who actively dissent from Church teaching in matters of faith and morals.

I apologize if anyone found this debate tactic offensive …but I found these personal encounters with clerical and confident laity dissidents highly offensive and deceiving.

 

[MilesXpisti]

Thank you estesbob and everyone else for your persistent and charitable presentation of the faith. The purpose of this discussion was 1) to allow me to indulge myself in trying to understand the mind set of those I have repeatidly encounterd who take dissident positions and have tried to lead me into error and plant doubt that authoritative Church teaching can be trusted; 2) demonstrate the lack of intellectual basis and honesty put forth, by those clergy and laity alike that I have personally encountered, who actively dissent from Church teaching in matters of faith and morals.

So this was the theological equivalent of a readiness drill?

 

[Mommyof02green]

Can a married Catholic in good conscience use contraception? In my opinion the answer is “NO”. John M. makes what I consider to be a valid point:

Q: As Catholics, do we have to accept everything the Church teaches?

A: If you want to call yourself Catholic, but you want to pick and choose for yourself which of the Church’s teachings to accept and which to reject, you give everyone else who calls themselves Catholic the right to do the same thing.
For example, you believe women should be priests…in the Catechism of the Catholic Church, paragraph 1577 states, “Only a baptized man validly receives ordination…For this reason the ordination of women is not possible!” You don’t believe that…well, that’s fine…[RIP] just tear that page out of your Catechism…you just made it a Catechism of your Catholic Church…not mine.

But remember, if you can throw doctrines out, so can everyone else who calls themselves Catholic. That gives Joe Parishioner over at St. Doubting Thomas Catholic Church the right to throw out the Church’s social justice teachings…he doesn’t feel like feeding the hungry, caring for the poor, and all that other “bleeding heart” stuff - Paragraphs 2401 -2463 [RIP] …he just made it a Catechism of his Catholic Church…not mine and not yours.

You believe contraception is okay? Paragraph 2370 says contraception is intrinsically evil! [RIP] Joe Parishioner doesn’t like what the Church teaches on the death penalty - Paragraphs 2266-2267 [RIP]. You don’t like what it teaches on pages 55-60 [RIP]. He doesn’t like what it teaches on pages 128-140 [RIP]

Can you see what’s happening? I heard it said once that there is a shortage of vocations to the priesthood in the United States, but no shortage of vocations to the Papacy! If we don’t believe in all of it, if we each appoint ourselves Pope and throw out a doctrine here or a doctrine there, then our faith is no longer Catholic.

Source: biblechristiansociety.com/2min_apologetics.php?id=5

If we went around picking what we like and dislike about our Faith then we aren’t really Catholic. It is for this reason that I believe it’s impossible for a Catholic to in “good” conscience to use contraception.

Therefore can a Christian in good conscience use contraception? My opinion is still “NO”. One of the side affects of BCP (Birth Control Pills) is that they are Abortifacient. In other words they can cause an abortion. This shocked me when I learned this…

The question you have to ask yourself is when does life beginning? If you state at the moment of conception, then you should read up more on BCP (Birth Control Pills) and what they do and do not do. Just do a Google search. Here is a quote from one of these pages:

“The contraceptive pill doesn’t always prevent ovulation. As often as 30% of the time, ovulation may occur and if that happens, fertilization may occur,” Dr Jones-Nosacek says.

“Then there are other mechanisms that can prevent that being from surviving. It’s called a chemical abortion.”

Source: news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/3652462.stm

After reading up on the information regarding BCP I came to personally believe that it’s true. BCPs are an abortifacient. Seeing I believe BCP are abortifacient I believe that a Christian in “good” conscience cannot use BCP. I believe abortions are prohibited by the commandment “Thou shall not kill”.

What about other forms of Birth Control like condoms? Well why would a married man want to use a condom when have relations with his wife?

Besides I believe that the in the Bible a person can find a prohibition about using condoms. catholic.com/library/birth_control.asp

I hope that this helps! May God bless you and your spouse.
I wish you the best of luck while trying to discern what God wants from you.
It is HIS ways that we are to follow. God Bless

 

[setter]

So this was the theological equivalent of a readiness drill?

You got it … …what’s the Boy Scouts’ motto …“Be Prepared!”

 

[MilesXpisti]

You got it … …what’s the Boy Scouts’ motto …“Be Prepared!”

Too right…I’ve had the much the same experience as you have, and it’s made me my fair share of enemies in pulpit and pew. But we’re soldiers right?

 

[setter]

I hope that this helps! May God bless you and your spouse.
I wish you the best of luck while trying to discern what God wants from you.
It is HIS ways that we are to follow. God Bless

Many thanks …God is faithful to those who persist in faith and obedience to the truth.

 

[mercygate]

NFP as our only method of family planning was summarily dismissed as not a viable option by each of the three priests consulted. It received the same endorsement as playing Russian Roulette with my wife’s life given the assessed serious health risk that a future pregnancy would pose. They made the appeal to be “reasonable”, and as a couple we have already fulfilled our procreative potential to be fruitful, and that the law is made for man, not man made for the law.

NFP is not the old rhythm method. After a few months of abstinence, while your wife learns to monitor her cycles, you can rely on the method as well as you can on barrier methods or the pill.

Think of it as a positive thing. Good Christians in the old days would have had no option other than total abstinence.

Where in the world do people get the idea that ad lib access to the conjugal embrace is part of the marriage contract?

'The “already fulfilled your procreative potential” is a well taken point but it smacks of “fundamental option.” Gotta be careful of that. It’s baaaaaad theology and bad spirituality.

 

[mercygate]

Thank you estesbob and everyone else for your persistent and charitable presentation of the faith. The purpose of this discussion was 1) to allow me to indulge myself in trying to understand the mind set of those I have repeatidly encounterd who take dissident positions and have tried to lead me into error and plant doubt that authoritative Church teaching can be trusted; 2) demonstrate the lack of intellectual basis and honesty put forth, by those clergy and laity alike that I have personally encountered, who actively dissent from Church teaching in matters of faith and morals.

I apologize if anyone found this debate tactic offensive …but I found these personal encounters with clerical and confident laity dissidents highly offensive and deceiving.

**Setter! **I wondered what was goin’ on with you! You are one of the steadiest, most reliable, most charitable defenders of the faith on these forums. I thought some space alien had come in and taken over your brain!

 

[setter]

**Setter! **I wondered what was goin’ on with you! You are one of the steadiest, most reliable, most charitable defenders of the faith on these forums. I thought some space alien had come in and taken over your brain!

It is still me …but I have to admit, it was difficult hanging in there and arguing from the other side. Thank you for your always ardent defense and explanation of the faith.

 

[larry85704]

Well, it is true that the majority of Catholics us birth control not approved by the Pope. What should be done with them?

Kick them out of the Church?

Egg their house?

After all, they are going to hell. Why waste time on them here in this life?

Don’t we want Catholics to conform to the Churches teaching?

 

[estesbob]

Well, it is true that the majority of Catholics us birth control not approved by the Pope. What should be done with them?

Kick them out of the Church?

Egg their house?

After all, they are going to hell. Why waste time on them here in this life?

Don’t we want Catholics to conform to the Churches teaching?

We should pray for them and patiently explain to them what the Church teaches on Contraception and just as important WHY.

Two more points:

If we start throwing sinners out of the Church there will be no one left

I suggest you study up on the conditions necessary for one to commit a mortal sin before you start condemning massive numbers of people to hell.

 

[LJN21]

Well, it is true that the majority of Catholics us birth control not approved by the Pope. What should be done with them?

Kick them out of the Church?

Egg their house?

After all, they are going to hell. Why waste time on them here in this life?

Don’t we want Catholics to conform to the Churches teaching?

Well in general I’d say its not our place to judge. We know the teaching it is our job to make sure we are doing what we are supposed to. What their doing is largely their problem. If you know someone personally that is using the Pill for poor reasons you do have a responsibility to say something (admonish the sinner) but it should be done very carefully. Mostly we should pray for them and hope in Gods mercy.

I suppose if someone really wanted to try and make an impact they could beginning some adult education classes done with LOTS of Charity.