Can a permantly impotent person marry?

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Marybeloved said:
I honestly have no idea what you’re trying to say here or how it relates to the topic of invalidity of marriage by permanently impotent persons in Catholic faith 🤷.
I wonder what real world you’re referring to. The OP asked based on an answer in the Apologetics section, why it is that permanent impotence invalidates marriage- A question on Catholic teaching, so your comment here is bizarre. Do you imagine that the majority of Catholic clergy “in the real world” teach something different from Catholic teaching on the matter?
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Ok. I’ll explain it again. A couple marries. They are impotent. They adopt instead. Is that marriage invalid because they are impotent?

The “real world” is the “non internet” world. Many people on the internet are much more fundamentalist leaning, cold and icy than those in the real, non electronic world.

Sorry you don’t understand where I’m coming from, but I stand by everything I said.
 
Rascalking said:
They’re getting a choice taken away from them because of nothing they did. It’s a punishment for something they have no control over. It’s grossly unfair.
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I am a man. Because of nothing I did, I cannot become a mother. How unfair! You miss the point that the Church is only stating a fact. Unless the marriage can be consumated there is no marriage. It is not a punishment, just a fact of life.
 
SteveVH said:
I am a man. Because of nothing I did, I cannot become a mother. How unfair! You miss the point that the Church is only stating a fact. Unless the marriage can be consumated there is no marriage. It is not a punishment, just a fact of life.
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Right, like I said before, I disagree. Simply put, I see things differently.
 
Rascalking said:
Ok. I’ll explain it again. A couple marries. They are impotent. They adopt instead. Is that marriage invalid because they are impotent?
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My friend, children cannot validate an invalid marriage anymore than lack of children can invalidate a valid marriage. 🤷
Many people on the internet are much more fundamentalist leaning, cold and icy than those in the real, non electronic world.
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This may perhaps be true- But I hope you are able to separate meanness from telling the truth. I honestly haven’t seen any real sign of meanness on this particular thread.
Sorry you don’t understand where I’m coming from, but I stand by everything I said.
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It’s your right to do so if that’s what you want ;).
 
SteveVH said:
I am a man. Because of nothing I did, I cannot become a mother. How unfair! You miss the point that the Church is only stating a fact. Unless the marriage can be consumated there is no marriage. It is not a punishment, just a fact of life.
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Sorry, I dont get arguments like that.

We are talking impotence, a medical condition.

Not nature. Male or female. Being male or female is not a medical condition. 🤷
 
Rascalking said:
I find it chiling that so many Catholics seem to look for reasons why others can’t do things in life. It’s creepy.
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Catholics are not looking for reasons why others can’t do things. The Church is responsible for teaching what is or isn’t morally correct. The Church has set requirements to determine what is a valid, sacramental marriage.

Christ said they are to become ‘one flesh’. The Church has defined what this means. If a person is incapable of physically joining with another they are incapable of becoming ‘one flesh’. This is not the same as two people mutually refraining from joining. If a man is blind he is not refraining from seeing.

If a man is impotent before marriage he can’t legitimately say his marriage vows. If he suffers an illness or accident after the marriage vows he is still validly married. It’s not about when the marriage is consummated but whether or not it CAN be consummated.

Fertility is not a requirement for marriage. Being open to life is a requirement of marriage. So a couple that finds themselves sterile but who can still have intercourse are still validly married.

So yes, it is sad that an impotent man can’t get married. It’s sad that people who’ve been married once can’t get remarried. It’s sad that women can’t be priests. It seems so unfair but life isn’t about fair. It’s about suffering and keeping true to Christ’s teachings. I believe Jesus taught his apostles and disciples well and that they faithfully passed those teachings on to their successors.

The Church does not ‘make up rules’ to be mean.
 
Rascalking said:
Ok. I’ll explain it again. A couple marries. They are impotent. They adopt instead. Is that marriage invalid because they are impotent?
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Are they marrying in the Catholic Church? did they know they were impotent before marriage?

Adoption isn’t relative to whether or not their marriage is invalid or not.
 
Marie5890 said:
Sorry, I dont get arguments like that.

We are talking impotence, a medical condition.

Not nature. Male or female. Being male or female is not a medical condition. 🤷
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Regardless of the particular analogy used, I think the point being made is the same one. You’re in a permanent condition that deprives you of certain capacities, which precludes you from taking on engagements that require the ability to exercise those very capacities that this condition deprives you of.

Whether the condition is natural, accidental, medical really doesn’t change things- You still can’t promise in good faith, the exercise of those capacities, while you’re incapacitated.
 
Rascalking said:
The “real world” is the “non internet” world. Many people on the internet are much more fundamentalist leaning, cold and icy than those in the real, non electronic world.
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facts and truth tend to be void of emotion and only ‘seem’ as though they are cold an icy. Also people seem to think being told ‘no’ is being mean.
 
Marybeloved said:
Regardless of the particular analogy used, I think the point being made is the same one. You’re in a permanent condition that deprives you of certain capacities, which precludes you from taking on engagements that require the ability to exercise those very capacities that this condition deprives you of.
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I do think that a better analogy is a wiser course. 🙂
 
vsedriver said:
facts and truth tend to be void of emotion and only ‘seem’ as though they are cold an icy. Also people seem to think being told ‘no’ is being mean.
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Maybe they “seem” to be cold and icy because of the people delivering them? I’ve seen the “truth” delivered in a way where it’s still true, but also pleasent. That’s possible.
 
Rascalking said:
Maybe they “seem” to be cold and icy because of the people delivering them? I’ve seen the “truth” delivered in a way where it’s still true, but also pleasent. That’s possible.
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I don’t think anyone is being cold or icy. In fact I think this thread has been conducted in a very temperate manner with no one getting abusive or argumentative. What is being put forward is the theology and laws of the Catholic Church. Abiding by one’s faith is not something that is unique to Internet users.
 
Matthew_Holford said:
. Abiding by one’s faith is not something that is unique to Internet users.
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No, but because internet users don’t have to see the people they are talking to face to face with body langauge, many times basic manners are forgotten. Also, when talking to someone face to face I’ve noticed that virtually no one talks the way they do on the internet.
 
Marybeloved said:
Whether the condition is natural, accidental, medical really doesn’t change things- You still can’t promise in good faith, the exercise of those capacities, while you’re incapacitated.
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I find the whole topic nutty and twisted though.

If you have a medical condition that leaves you impotent you can not have a canonical marriage.

BUT if you end up with a medical condition that leaves you impotent after marriage, you have a valid marriage…

It’s all that mental gymnastics, hoop jumping and cognitive dissonance that leaves me going…

:ehh:

It’s things like this that fuel the fire people have about Catholicism being nutty …

JMO. I know people will disagree and even try to explain the other side. I guess that is something that the Lord Himself will have to explain to me cause it comes across as really dopey to me… Just being honest. 🙂
 
Rence said:
I’m always assumed to be living in sin because I’m single. It’s not always practical (or necessary) to base our life choices on what other people think…
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Why would being single be an assumption of sin? Two people of the opposite sex living together is an occasion of scandal.
 
Marie5890 said:
I find the whole topic nutty and twisted though.

JMO. I know people will disagree and even try to explain the other side. I guess that is something that the Lord Himself will have to explain to me cause it comes across as really dopey to me… Just being honest. 🙂
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You and me both Marie. We’re a lonely island today! 😃
 
[BIBLEDRB]Matthew 19:12[/BIBLEDRB]

The case of “born eunuchs” is indeed unfortunate, but known even to our Lord.
 
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