Can a Priest Break the Seal of Confession by Accident?

[Jennifer_G]

I would like to know if the following is an example of breaking the seal of confession.

Wife goes to confession, face to face with priest.

Husband goes to confession, face to face with priest.

Husband exits. Priests comes out. Priest tells wife, in passing, “I would never allow him to raise the children”.

Priest knows both husband and wife.

Would that be a “slip” or a definite break?

That would be a definate break. A priest can’t even comment to another person anything that vaguely hints at wait someone said in the confessional, or even show an expression coming out of the confessional.

 

[ASimpleSinner]

I would like to know if the following is an example of breaking the seal of confession.

Wife goes to confession, face to face with priest.

Husband goes to confession, face to face with priest.

Husband exits. Priests comes out. Priest tells wife, in passing, “I would never allow him to raise the children”.

Priest knows both husband and wife.

Would that be a “slip” or a definite break?

We don’t have enough info on the situation. To use a radical example, if the husband wreaked of Old Crow and had track marks up and down his arm and was a known sinner (let’s go for the gold here and make it an extremem example!) the potential for a priest to make observations about fitness to a wife - with or without confession - is there.

If it happens on the heals of the husband’s confessing like this it looks pretty bad… but it there is still an unknown quantity there.

How hypothetical is this? Because if this is based on a real life incident, I would be VERY uncomfortable talking about it on the forum.

 

[Jennifer_G]

We don’t have enough info on the situation. To use a radical example, if the husband wreaked of Old Crow and had track marks up and down his arm and was a known sinner (let’s go for the gold here and make it an extremem example!) the potential for a priest to make observations about fitness to a wife - with or without confession - is there.

If it happens on the heals of the husband’s confessing like this it looks pretty bad… but it there is still an unknown quantity there.

How hypothetical is this? Because if this is based on a real life incident, I would be VERY uncomfortable talking about it on the forum.

I don’t know what “track marks” and “Old Crow” implies (I’m guessing it isn’t the bird… ). (And fitness as in what? Exercise, or being a good (fit) husband?) But, a priest can’t later say, “You haven’t been doing very good with XYZ, have you?”. That would still be breaking the confessional seal if XYZ was confessed. In fact, I don’t think a priest would make any hasty judgement - otherwise he would be judging.

 

[ASimpleSinner]

I don’t know what “track marks” and “Old Crow” implies (I’m guessing it isn’t the bird… ). (And fitness as in what? Exercise, or being a good (fit) husband?) But, a priest can’t later say, “You haven’t been doing very good with XYZ, have you?”. That would still be breaking the confessional seal if XYZ was confessed. In fact, I don’t think a priest would make any hasty judgement - otherwise he would be judging.

Old Crow is whiskey, track marks are the scars left from using IV drugs…

My point - using extreme examples of an inverterate drunk who wreaks of whiskey and has scars from drug use - was that with or without confession face to face, in the “hypothetical example” there is a possibility that no seal was broken. If the wife came in and said “My husband is passed out in the parking lot in the rain, AGAIN”… Well the point is we do NOT have enough details on this hypothetical.

 

[H_Opey]

A Simple Sinner,

You have enough to know what you propose is not possible because I said the husband also went to confession and in that, he received absolution. He could not receive ablsolution if he was drunk and the priest would have known since it was face to face confession. And, there is no drug abuse in this hypothetical situation.

 

[H_Opey]

The above story I mentioned is hypothetical.
We will leave it as information being gathered for a story.

We will assume that the priest did not leave the confessional with the intention of breaking the seal. It was careless. Very careless and inappropriate.
Would the seal still be broken? What would happen then?

I think, the seal is broken. But as far as proving it, would be hearsay.

 

[ASimpleSinner]

A Simple Sinner,

You have enough to know what you propose is not possible because I said the husband also went to confession and in that, he received absolution. He could not receive ablsolution if he was drunk and the priest would have known since it was face to face confession. And, there is no drug abuse in this hypothetical situation.

No, I didn’t.

Talking in hypotheticals opens the door fairly wide.

But if you are foisting a real-life scenario on the forum via hypotheticals, it is terribly difficult to make any sort of assesment on a real life situation (not that I would even try) by speaking in generalities here.

If you were directly involved in something, you have a right to take it to the proper authorities. If you are hearing about something that someone did according to what someone said who saw something…

This isn’t the way to get to the bottom of things, and if it doesn’t involve you, there is really nothing that can be done.

Hypothetically, of course.

 

[ASimpleSinner]

This may count…

There’s this old priest who got sick of all the people in his parish who kept confessing to adultery.

One Sunday, in the pulpit, he said, “if I hear one more person confess to adultery, I’ll quit!”

Well, everyone liked him, so they came up with a code word.

Someone who had committed adultery would say they had “fallen”.

This seemed to satisfy the old priest and things went well, until the priest died at a ripe old age.

About a week after the new priest arrived, he visited the Mayor of the town and seemed very concerned.

The priest said, “you have to do something about the sidewalks in town. When people come into the confessional, they keep talking about having fallen.”

The Mayor started to laugh, realizing that no-one had told the new priest about the code word.

Before the mayor could explain, the priest shook an accusing finger at the mayor and said, “I don’t know what you’re laughing about, Your wife fell three times this week.”

clericalwhispers.blogspot.com/2008/02/clerical-humour_22.html

 

[H_Opey]

A Simple Sinner,

Ok, who would be the proper authority for the characters?
Vicar General? Bishop?
And as I concluded, it would be hearsay.

My question was, IF the priest did not INTEND to break the seal, would it still be broken because of gross judgement and carelessness?

 

[ASimpleSinner]

A Simple Sinner,

Ok, who would be the proper authority for the characters?
Vicar General? Bishop?
And as I concluded, it would be hearsay.

My question was, IF the priest did not INTEND to break the seal, would it still be broken because of gross judgement and carelessness?

1. The bishop would be the one to see.
2. I don’t know what the rule is on accidents
3. Third parties have no obligations or rights in this sort of matter.

 

[turtle18]

Even with the pedophilia scandal, you still didn’t have priests “ratting” each other out–my guess is that the pedophile priests would admit to in in confession just so they could avoid being turned in by other priests. Because the other priest would be bound by the seal, then.

 

[H_Opey]

It would be hearsay b/c the husband, in this made up story, didn’t actually hear him say it.

So, we will take the story a step further.

The couple goes to the VG and tells him the situation. They feel, especially the husband, that the seal of the sacrament has been broken.

VG looks into the situation and calls said priest. Priest does not remember saying anything of the sort and denies any wrong doing.

VG consults with Bishop. Both are in agreement that this would be hard to prove BUT that the priest needs to be made aware of the seriousness of breaking the seal.

VG lets couple know that priest doesn’t remember and is denying all wrong doing BUT will be reprimanded and IF anything in the future causes them concern, please let him know right away.

Couple never goes back to confession to priest.

I am really gathering info for a future story.
I am still under the impression that the seal had been broken but because of circumstances, can not be proved.
Am I understanding this correctly?

 

[jmcrae]

Here is a little twist for your story.

What if someone goes to Confession that the priest doesn’t like. (She harrasses him - follows him around and criticizes everything she does, calls him rude names both to his face and behind his back, “borrows” money from him that she never returns, etc.)

She goes to Confession with him at a time when normally he doesn’t hear Confessions - he happens to be very tired and annoyed.

He comes out from the Confessional, wishes her “Goodbye” and she goes home.

He then goes over to someone who is a volunteer with the Church and starts venting about the trivial **** she was confessing in the Confessional, and makes a comment to the effect of, “Why can’t she confess her real sins - the gossipping, the backbiting, the name-calling?”

The volunteer is somewhat shocked by this, but doesn’t know how to deal with it, so she changes the subject and starts asking about how many candles need to be put out in the votive racks, and what time does he want to get together for a meeting regarding the progress of participants in the RCIA.

The volunteer never goes to Confession with that particular priest, again.

 

[jmcrae]

The stars make it look like I used a worse word than what I used. Is the “c” word really a swear word?

 

[H_Opey]

Yes, the stars do make it look like you were saying **** something else.

Yes, that would be a strange twist and I wouldn’t know what to do other than never go to that priest for confession.

More specifically, the question I have, when referring to “break in the seal of confession” can that term only be used when the Bishop or review board have said that they have ample evidence that there was a break?

 

[jmcrae]

Yes, the stars do make it look like you were saying **** something else.

Yes, that would be a strange twist and I wouldn’t know what to do other than never go to that priest for confession.

It was just for pretend, anyway - I don’t even know anyone who would treat a priest like that. But the strangest things come into my mind, sometimes.

More specifically, the question I have, when referring to “break in the seal of confession” can that term only be used when the Bishop or review board have said that they have ample evidence that there was a break?

I don’t know. One slip would most likely not do him in, but if he were in the habit of ratting husbands out to their wives, word would get around, and people would start to avoid him. The Bishop would then want to know why this guy can’t do his job very effectively.

 

[Zooey]

The stars make it look like I used a worse word than what I used. Is the “c” word really a swear word?

Yeah, that happens…I usually say “carp”. Some people write “c**p”, so that folks know they weren’t saying ****.

 

[Harmony1988]

There is nothing wrong with the priest using an ‘example’ to help others as long as YOU aren’t mentioned in it or referenced.

Humans can mistakes though, I don’t see why the priest by accident can’t, if you think they can’t, then you sure as hell shouldn’t be making any accidents

 

[ASimpleSinner]

The question here isn’t “can he break the seal” but “can he be punished for breaking the seal… if the seal has been broken in this way.”

Personally, I just use the confessional.

And honestly, the last time I slipped into a parish for their “weekly 15 minute window” to go to confession, there was no line. The last time I made it to a parish that supposedly heard confessions from 4:30 - 5:00, I got there at 4:18 and was told “Father left 10 minutes ago.”

Which got me thinking, maybe THAT is the parish I need to belong to. They are so holy there, no one has anything to confess ever!"

 

[S_V7]

Can you please give an example of what you are thinking about?

Betsy

Let’s say a young man goes to Confession, and from it, the priest notices a great deal of potential in this person to become a religious. The young man also expresses some interest in becoming a priest someday during the Confession.
Let’s say the confessor belongs to a religious order and after hearing many Confessions from this young man, he tells his superiors that he knows a potential candidate for the priesthood and sets up a meeting between them. Would this be a violation of the seal? If so, would he be excommunicated even if he had no idea that he violated the seal?

Thanks and God bless