Can a Protestant convert directly to Eastern Catholicism?

[x1980x]

Can a validly baptized Protestant convert directly to an Eastern Catholic Church, or do they first need to convert to EO (then ask to be received into EC communion with a confession of faith in the authority of the Pope), or convert to RC and then request a transfer?

I do understand that most, if not all, apparent good faith requests to transfer from RC to EC are granted as a matter of course. My question concerns whether it is possible to convert directly to the Eastern church (affirming belief in the Primacy of the Pope, of course), but specifically being received directly into the Eastern church and its canon law. Is there a Melkite, Greek, or Ruthenian RCIA?

PS: It would seem that converting first to EO with intent to convert to EC could be seen as a bad faith move if they already believe in the authority of the Pope.

 

[jwinch2]

Can a validly baptized Protestant convert directly to an Eastern Catholic Church, or do they first need to convert to EO (then ask to be received into EC communion with a confession of faith in the authority of the Pope), or convert to RC and then request a transfer?

I do understand that most, if not all, apparent good faith requests to transfer from RC to EC are granted as a matter of course. My question concerns whether it is possible to convert directly to the Eastern church (affirming belief in the Primacy of the Pope, of course), but specifically being received directly into the Eastern church and its canon law. Is there a Melkite, Greek, or Ruthenian RCIA?

I would certainly believe you could. I am recent convert to the Latin Rite, but I cannot think of any reason at all why you could not join the Eastern Rite. I would assume they have something equivalent to RCIA or heck, it may even be that they have exactly the same thing.

 

[Montalo]

I am no canon lawyer, but the canons that might apply

[QUOTEname=“CLC”]857 §2. As a rule an adult is to be baptized in his or her parish church and an infant in the parish church of the parents unless a just cause suggests otherwise.

i would guess from that canon that, if the eastern church is your parish church, then you would be able to do so
also, from the CCEO

Canon 30
Anyone to be baptized who has completed the fourteenth year of
age can freely select any Church sui iuris in which he or she
then is enrolled by virtue of baptism received in that same
Church, with due regard for particular law established by the
Apostolic See.

intratext.com/IXT/ENG1199/_PU.HTM
vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/__P2V.HTM

like i said, im no canon lawyer, but it looks like it should be allowed

EDIT: i jsut realized that, being already baptized, this does not apply to you. I will leave the post as is, just in case anyone whom this applies to needs their question answered

 

[jwinch2]

I should have added that the best thing to do is simply talk to your local EC priest and see what he says. He will know what to do and how to proceed.

Peace, God Bless and Welcome Home!

 

[ConstantineTG]

Yes you can, I know someone who grew up in a Baptist family and is now Ukrainian Catholic.

 

[Vico]

Can a validly baptized Protestant convert directly to an Eastern Catholic Church, or do they first need to convert to EO (then ask to be received into EC communion with a confession of faith in the authority of the Pope), or convert to RC and then request a transfer?

I do understand that most, if not all, apparent good faith requests to transfer from RC to EC are granted as a matter of course. My question concerns whether it is possible to convert directly to the Eastern church (affirming belief in the Primacy of the Pope, of course), but specifically being received directly into the Eastern church and its canon law. Is there a Melkite, Greek, or Ruthenian RCIA?

PS: It would seem that converting first to EO with intent to convert to EC could be seen as a bad faith move if they already believe in the authority of the Pope.

In this case the ascribed Church is Latin. One must petition to transfer, regardles of where received, if a different rite is desired. (See: Comparative Sacramental Discipline in the CCEO and CIC, Canon Law Society of America, p. 255) When the CCEO code was written it was proposed to add a clause for free selection of the Church sui iuris, but this proposal was not added.

CCEO Canon 35
Baptized non-Catholics coming into full communion with the Catholic Church should retain and practice their own rite everywhere in the world and should observe it as much as humanly possible. Thus, they are to be enrolled in the Church sui iuris of the same rite with due regard for the right of approaching the Apostolic See in special cases of persons, communities or regions.

 

[Peter_Mogila]

Vico is right. I have a friend who entered an Eastern Catholic Church from Orthodoxy. But, because he had been baptized a Protestant in infancy, it was ruled that he was canonically Latin Rite – even though he’d never been in a Latin parish.

Peter

 

[5Loaves]

Can a validly baptized Protestant convert directly to an Eastern Catholic Church, or do they first need to convert to EO (then ask to be received into EC communion with a confession of faith in the authority of the Pope), or convert to RC and then request a transfer?

I do understand that most, if not all, apparent good faith requests to transfer from RC to EC are granted as a matter of course. My question concerns whether it is possible to convert directly to the Eastern church (affirming belief in the Primacy of the Pope, of course), but specifically being received directly into the Eastern church and its canon law. Is there a Melkite, Greek, or Ruthenian RCIA?

PS: It would seem that converting first to EO with intent to convert to EC could be seen as a bad faith move if they already** believe in the authority of the Pope**.

The first thing would be to become active in a Catholic parish. Is the person already worshiping in an Eastern Catholic parish? If they are and know they want to continue there then speak with the deacon and/or the priest about their interest in coming into the Church. Some parishes have an RCIA and in others the deacon, pastor or another catechist would provide the catechetical preparation for reception into the Church.

Assuming they have a valid Baptism, if they are allowed to be Chrismated in the EC parish they are active in then the chrismation record in that parish would indicate they are canonically Latin. The priest can answer these questions, and if not then he can refer to the local tribunal where the canon lawyers would have the appropriate information and could assist.

Someone enters Holy Orthodoxy who feels called to be Orthodox. It’s not a transfer station. Also, the Orthodox all believe in the authority of the Pope. They believe he is the Bishop of Rome and the Patriarch of the West, tho HH Benedict XVI dropped that title.

I transferred from the Latin Church to an ECC with no difficulty. One should expect to have lived fully in an ECC parish for a number of years first. At least one person on this forum, or maybe another forum I’m on, has been refused the transfer West to East.

I see you are Menonnite. I had happy ties with Mennonites when I was active in the middle to late 1970s in a group called New Call to Peacemaking made up of the historic “peace churches”, Quaker, Brethren and Mennonite. One of our gatherings was at Goshen College. I was living and studying in Richmond, IN.

 

[Aramis]

If you’re background is Mennonite, one has to ask about the method and wording used in your baptism; if invalid, then the choice is straightforward - be baptized in the rite of your chosen parish. If valid, then be chrismated, and apply for transfer to that rite at time of chrismation.

No stopoff in the Orthodox Communion is needed.

 

[nightranger]

No you can’t. To join the catholic church, eastern rite or otherwise, you must go through RCIA.
If you are talking about the eastern orthodox church, then i don’t know. But I suspect the answer is still no.

 

[WetCatechumen]

Can a validly baptized Protestant convert directly to an Eastern Catholic Church, or do they first need to convert to EO (then ask to be received into EC communion with a confession of faith in the authority of the Pope), or convert to RC and then request a transfer?

I do understand that most, if not all, apparent good faith requests to transfer from RC to EC are granted as a matter of course. My question concerns whether it is possible to convert directly to the Eastern church (affirming belief in the Primacy of the Pope, of course), but specifically being received directly into the Eastern church and its canon law. Is there a Melkite, Greek, or Ruthenian RCIA?

PS: It would seem that converting first to EO with intent to convert to EC could be seen as a bad faith move if they already believe in the authority of the Pope.

Regardless of what canon law says, one of my friends, who is a convert, has pretty much no idea how to act or what is going on in a Roman Catholic Mass, but he serves at the altar every week at our local Ruthenian Catholic Church and is one of the strongest Catholics I know.

He’s a Byzantine Catholic, regardless of what the rules say.

 

[x1980x]

If you’re background is Mennonite, one has to ask about the method and wording used in your baptism; if invalid, then the choice is straightforward - be baptized in the rite of your chosen parish. If valid, then be chrismated, and apply for transfer to that rite at time of chrismation…

I am almost certain that I have a valid Father, Son, and Holy Spirit Baptism according to Catholic teaching.

…Someone enters Holy Orthodoxy who feels called to be Orthodox. It’s not a transfer station. Also, the Orthodox all believe in the authority of the Pope. They believe he is the Bishop of Rome and the Patriarch of the West, tho HH Benedict XVI dropped that title…

I agree. What I meant by “authority of the Pope” was the supremacy of the office of Peter over that of other bishops. I do know that the Orthodox recognize the Pope as a valid Bishop.

 

[twf]

As a former Evangelical Protestant I find that notion that Protestants must automatically be ascribed to the Latin Church absurd. I understand the reasoning when it comes to Protestants of the “high church” tradition (Anglicans, Luthernans, perhaps Methodists)…but evangelicals and pentecostals? They have no more in common with the Latin Church than with the Eastern Churches. How can one be more “Latin” than Eastern when one explicitly rejects:
-Structured liturgy of any sort
-Priestly ministry of any sort
-Celibacy/monastic life of any sort
-Marian devotion of any sort
-Communion of saints
-Sacraments/mysteries (beyond baptism and communion as strictly “symbolic” acts which convey no grace whatsoever)
-Apostolic succession
-Most of the Fathers
-Sacred Tradition
-etc etc etc

I’ve heard some EO claim that Latin Catholics have more in common with Protestants than with the East. I have read the arguments, but completely and utterly dismiss them. I can tell you that coming from an Evangelical background, the faith, theology, devotions, and worship of the Latin Church was completely alien to me. I would have been no more at home at a reverently celebrated OF mass 6 or 7 years than at an English Ruthenian DL. In fact, as an evangelical, I think I would have been more comfortable with the devotions of the East than those of the West - I think veneration of icons, for example, would have struck me as less offensive than carrying statues of saints through the streets on feast days. Evangelicals may use certain theological terms which they have inherited from the Latin tradition (such as justification or sanctification), but their understanding is COMPLETELY foreign to any tradition of the Catholic Church - without the correct understanding/theology, these terms are just words. These terms do not in any way suggest that the theology is more Latin than Eastern - at this point, it is so far removed from apostolic teaching that it is alien to both.
The logic baffles me.

 

[Alexander_Roman]

Yes, this “logic” is truly baffling to me too!

Unless the Roman Catholic Church is basing this logic on a kind of “western jurisdictionalism” where western Protestants 'naturally" belong to the Western Catholic Church.

(And in that case, the RC Church shouldn’t be too upset by similar claims of jurisdiction by Orthodox where RC missionaries work . . .).

I know Protestants who have been in contact with Roman Catholicism all their lives, but who became Eastern Catholic almost immediately when they experienced Eastern Christian spirituality.

Surely they should be able to join the EC Church whose spirituality “spoke” to them in the first place!

Alex

 

[Seamus_L]

Some of this rigid legalism makes no sense whatsoever. If a former Protestant want’s to become Eastern Catholic they should be able to without having to go through a lengthy procedure, just as an Orthodox who want’s to become Latin Rite should be afforded the same courtesy.

 

[Hesychios]

Some of this rigid legalism makes no sense whatsoever. If a former Protestant want’s to become Eastern Catholic they should be able to without having to go through a lengthy procedure, just as an Orthodox who want’s to become Latin Rite should be afforded the same courtesy.

I have always felt this way, I agree with you.

 

[Hesychios]

As a former Evangelical Protestant I find that notion that Protestants must automatically be ascribed to the Latin Church absurd.

It appears to be all about turf.

I’ve heard some EO claim that Latin Catholics have more in common with Protestants than with the East. I have read the arguments, but completely and utterly dismiss them…

It’s all about the theology.

The devotions and practices follow theology, and the western churches (Protestant and Catholic) have a certain commonality in their fundamental assumptions that enables them to (if nothing else) clearly disagree.

Like (for instance) the Immaculate Conception of Mary. One may agree or disagree with it vehemently, but neither party can be accused of not understanding what it means.

That is not true for the orthodox, for whom the very meaning of an immaculate conception is not clear, and for whom is the question is not who has it and who doesn’t.

 

[DL82]

It is perfectly possible for a Protestant to be received directly into an Eastern Catholic Church. I considered it back in 2007 when I was enrolling in RCIA - I was talking with a very wise and holy Deacon in the Melkite Catholic Church at the time, and he explained to me how the Eastern and Western patrimony were both contained in the Catholic Church.

At the time, however, he also cautioned me that the Melkite Catholic Church is mostly a community of Arabic-speaking Christians and their descendents, so it would be difficult to make sense of without learning Arabic, and even then could be difficult to find fellowship with people who share my cultural perspectives and background. Also, here in the UK, there are very few Melkite churches, so the likelihood was that I would end up seeking most of my spiritual growth through a Latin Rite parish in any case, and therefore would make more sense to be a Latin Rite Catholic, while maintaining an interest in Eastern theological ideas. I have to say, his advice turned out to be most wise.

If you are serious about this, I would suggest seeking out a Priest, Deacon or catechist of a particular Eastern Church in which you are interested (noting that there is a huge difference between, for example, the Ukrainian, Chaldean and Syro-Malabar Eastern Catholic Churches), attend their liturgies, read up on their traditions, and speak with them about discerning your particular path.

With regard to Protestantism being closer to the Latin Rite, I can see both sides of this - as someone raised in the Scottish Calvinist/Presbyterian tradition, which draws at least some of its liturgical patrimony from St John Chrysostom, I could see some similarities when attending the Byzantine Rite liturgies in Orthodox and Catholic Churches.

On the subject of becoming Orthodox first then converting to Catholicism, that sounds disingenuous. When I began talking with my Melkite Deacon friend, I was still trying to discern which church out of the Catholic and Orthodox had the best claim to be the One Church that Jesus Christ founded. If, on the other hand, you already believe in what the Catholic Church teaches, in particular about Papal authority, then you would be lying in pretending to submit to the authority of an Orthodox bishop, knowing that you were going to convert to Catholicism immediately afterwards.

 

[twf]

It appears to be all about turf. It’s all about the theology.

The devotions and practices follow theology, and the western churches (Protestant and Catholic) have a certain commonality in their fundamental assumptions that enables them to (if nothing else) clearly disagree.

Like (for instance) the Immaculate Conception of Mary. One may agree or disagree with it vehemently, but neither party can be accused of not understanding what it means.

That is not true for the orthodox, for whom the very meaning of an immaculate conception is not clear, and for whom is the question is not who has it and who doesn’t.

This may be the case with some of the “high church” traditional Protestant bodies (Anglican, Luthernan, Methodist)…but I am not convinced that this assessment is correct when it comes to evangelicals and pentecostals - who today, globally, form the vast majority of “Protestants”. They may, in some cases, use similar terminology, but their understanding of the terms is so divorced from the Latin Catholic understanding that we tend to talk past each other. There may be some superficial similarities on certain issues - but not when one looks at the whole picture. As an evangelical, the very idea of structure liturgy, a priesthood, the sacraments, devotions to saints was completely baffling to me - I didn’t understand the reasoning, Scriptural basis or need…I did not understand the questions nor answers… I think you are reaching this conclusion based upon a few issues that played a key role in the Reformation, such as the question of justification - but that is hardly the sum of Western theology/practice. As an Evangelical, I honestly believed that Catholics worshipped the Mother of God in a blasphemous manner - the questions and answers of Mariology were alien to me. As the centuries have progressed, evangelical Protestantism has become more and more removed from its Western Catholic roots.

 

[RyanBlack]

No you can’t. To join the catholic church, eastern rite or otherwise, you must go through RCIA.
If you are talking about the eastern orthodox church, then i don’t know. But I suspect the answer is still no.

I believe this is incorrect. RCIA is particular to the Roman Catholic Church. The Eastern Churches use their own programs of catechesis for receiving Protestants into the Church. Eastern Orthodox Christians, who have been validly baptized and christmated (confirmed), are not required to go through RCIA, whether they are received in an Eastern Catholic parish or a Roman parish.