Can anyone help with the meaning of Mark 4:11 - 12

[jaypres]

Hi, hope someone can help I am struggling with the meaning of the verses below, it sounds as if Jesus didn’t want certain people to see the truth? I have done some searching (and have read through the notes in the Ignatius Study Bible) but am still confused.

Mark 4:11-12
He told them, “The secret of the kingdom of God has been given to you. But to those on the outside everything is said in parables so that,

“‘they may be ever seeing but never perceiving,
and ever hearing but never understanding;
otherwise they might turn and be forgiven!"

Help!

 

[bmonk]

Hi, hope someone can help I am struggling with the meaning of the verses below, it sounds as if Jesus didn’t want certain people to see the truth? I have done some searching (and have read through the notes in the Ignatius Study Bible) but am still confused.

Mark 4:11-12
He told them, “The secret of the kingdom of God has been given to you. But to those on the outside everything is said in parables so that,

“‘they may be ever seeing but never perceiving,
and ever hearing but never understanding;
otherwise they might turn and be forgiven!"

Help!

A lot of ink has been spilled trying to explain what is meant here.

Some point to Pharaoh in Exodus 7-- 11 (the plagues, especially 7:3,13,22; 8:11,15,28; 9:7,12,34-35; 10:20,27; 11:10. But note 11:9: Pharaoh himself is choosing to be obstinate.) That is, no matter what God does to convince Pharaoh, Pharaoh remains resistant to God’s demand.

In a similar way, Jesus is spreading the Gospel freely and openly–but those who resist it and refuse to accept him will not understand, because they have made themselves blind and deaf.

I think that this verse is also a sign of the early Church’s struggle with understanding why Jesus would use parables, and not teach as clearly as, say the Catechism or even the Creed. But one advantage of using parables is that it leads us to consider what is going on, to use our gifts of intelligence, to keep coming back to the parables and other teachings and engage them again, on a new level. They show themselves the richer the deeper and more often we consider them.

Another point is that the parables are certainly a lot easier to remember. I can recall at least a dozen parables without much effort, and likely get most or all of the details right. I would be hard pressed to do the same for paragraphs in the Catechism.

 

[jaypres]

A lot of ink has been spilled trying to explain what is meant here.

Some point to Pharaoh in Exodus 7-- 11 (the plagues, especially 7:3,13,22; 8:11,15,28; 9:7,12,34-35; 10:20,27; 11:10. But note 11:9: Pharaoh himself is choosing to be obstinate.) That is, no matter what God does to convince Pharaoh, Pharaoh remains resistant to God’s demand.

In a similar way, Jesus is spreading the Gospel freely and openly–but those who resist it and refuse to accept him will not understand, because they have made themselves blind and deaf.

I think that this verse is also a sign of the early Church’s struggle with understanding why Jesus would use parables, and not teach as clearly as, say the Catechism or even the Creed. But one advantage of using parables is that it leads us to consider what is going on, to use our gifts of intelligence, to keep coming back to the parables and other teachings and engage them again, on a new level. They show themselves the richer the deeper and more often we consider them.

Another point is that the parables are certainly a lot easier to remember. I can recall at least a dozen parables without much effort, and likely get most or all of the details right. I would be hard pressed to do the same for paragraphs in the Catechism.

Hey thanks so much for your reply, I get the positive aspects of the use of parables and totally agree with how effective they are, however I still feel none the wiser as to the meaning of the specific statement in the following: 'everything is said in parables so that, “they may be ever seeing but never perceiving, and ever hearing but never understanding; otherwise they might turn and be forgiven!”

Unless I completely misunderstand, it sounds like Parables here are being used in order that certain people won’t understand and for them not to be forgiven? Or maybe I am reading it incorrectly? Please help?

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Hey thanks so much for your reply, I get the positive aspects of the use of parables and totally agree with how effective they are, however I still feel none the wiser as to the meaning of the specific statement in the following: 'everything is said in parables so that, “they may be ever seeing but never perceiving, and ever hearing but never understanding; otherwise they might turn and be forgiven!”

Unless I completely misunderstand, it sounds like Parables here are being used in order that certain people won’t understand and for them not to be forgiven? Or maybe I am reading it incorrectly? Please help?

The original verse that Jesus refers to comes from Isaiah and is a prophetic verse. IOW, the people are fulfilling the prophecy.

Here’s the thing. Any of these people has the very same free will that the apostles and the followers of Jesus has–to come to Jesus and to ask for an explanation of His teachings --the way the apostles did. But some obviously felt that they already ‘knew’ everything that there was to know. I’m pretty sure at least some of the scribes and Pharisees were all gnostic and sure that Christ was addressing ‘other people’ and that the "kingdom’ was all about being a Pharisee or being in power and --this one should resonate to the modern soul-- ‘using one’s reason to make a personal decision’, etc. So they ‘heard’ all right and they were so full of themselves that they never even bothered to try to ask the One speaking to explain --because they were sure they already ‘knew’.

Christ knew that some of these people would NEVER turn to Him, and I’m sure He mourned over them. . .in fact, Scripture tells us how He mourned for "Jerusalem’ which included all those oh-so-sure-they-were-on-the-fast-track people. Prophecy doesn’t say that Christ wouldn’t mourn and that He wouldn’t have ‘let them hear’ if they had only asked Him. Prophecy just notes that some WILL NOT hear, due to the hardening of their own hearts and their own choices. And what the verses say is that it is all due to the free choice of the people, for IF they indeed listened with their ears, they WOULD repent. . .and that’s the tragedy of evil, that at any point until death, evil could repent and choose good and eternal life. . .but won’t. Evil "listens but hears not, sees and perceives not’. . .because evil chooses to do so.

 

[thistle]

Hi, hope someone can help I am struggling with the meaning of the verses below, it sounds as if Jesus didn’t want certain people to see the truth? I have done some searching (and have read through the notes in the Ignatius Study Bible) but am still confused.

Mark 4:11-12
He told them, “The secret of the kingdom of God has been given to you. But to those on the outside everything is said in parables so that,

“‘they may be ever seeing but never perceiving,
and ever hearing but never understanding;
otherwise they might turn and be forgiven!"

Help!

D-R Bible, Haydock Commentary:

Ver. 11. Such as are out of the Church, though they both hear and read, they cannot understand. (Ven. Bede, in Chap. iv, Mark.)

Ver. 12. That seeing they may see, &c. In punishment of their wilfully shutting their eyes, (Matthew xiii. 15.) God justly withdrew those lights and graces which otherwise he would have given them, for their effectual conversion. (Challoner) — These speeches here and elsewhere, we are not to understand as if he spoke in parables to this end that the hearers might not understand, lest they should be converted; but we must learn the true sense from the corresponding texts in Matthew xiii, and Acts xxviii, where our Saviour and St. Paul render it thus: with their ears they have been dull of hearing, and their eyes they have shut. lest, perhaps, they may see, and understand, and be converted, and I heal them. Whereby it is evident, that the speaking in parables was not the cause, (for many besides the apostles heard and understood) but themselves, who would not hear and understand, and be converted: and thus they were the real cause of their own wilful and obstinate infidelity. And therefore also he spoke in parables, because they were not worthy to understand, as the others were to whom he expounded them. (Bristow)