Can anyone recommend some books refuting Eastern Orthodox theology that conflict with Catholic theology?

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Holly3278

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Hi everyone. Can you all please recommend some books on things like the filioque, papal infallibility, papal supremacy, the Great Schism, and other such things that the Eastern Orthodox disagree with Catholics on? I’d appreciate your help. I’m doing research on the Eastern Orthodox but I want the Catholic point of view too.
 
I am going to keep my response simple and as charitable as I can. You state you are looking for refutation in your topic, but then you state you are studying. Are you studying objectively or subjectively? If you want to start with a book to read, try the Bible. Specifically start with Mark 9:38-40.
 
gelsbern said:
I am going to keep my response simple and as charitable as I can. You state you are looking for refutation in your topic, but then you state you are studying. Are you studying objectively or subjectively? If you want to start with a book to read, try the Bible. Specifically start with Mark 9:38-40.
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I am studying subjectively I would suppose. But it doesn’t really matter how I am studying. The point is that I have read the Orthodox Christian’s point of view on these matters and now I want the Catholic refutation of them.
 
I can’t recommend any becasue I don’t know that anyone has ever bothered to publish one. If you would like to review some material that reconciles Eastern and Latin theology I recommend:

east2west.org/index.htm
 
Holly3278 said:
Hi everyone. Can you all please recommend some books on things like the filioque, papal infallibility, papal supremacy, the Great Schism, and other such things that the Eastern Orthodox disagree with Catholics on? I’d appreciate your help. I’m doing research on the Eastern Orthodox but I want the Catholic point of view too.
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I can’t really help you because I am of the opinion that there are no essential differences between the apostolic Churches. There are theological distinctions (theology being man’s attempt to express Divine Truth), which some (or many) on both sides of the fence may use as causes for separation.

It’s not a matter of refuting each other’s theology, but of understanding each other’s theology. I’ve found that those who try to “refute” on either side inevitably end up merely misrepresenting the other side.

Having said that, I do often find myself refuting misconceptions of Catholicism. As I’ve often stated, my own journey to the Catholic Church did not consist of a repudiation of my own Faith as an Oriental Orthodox, but merely of repudiating the misconceptions I had about the Catholic Church.

I also commend you for looking at both sides of the matter openly and honestly.

Blessings,
Marduk
 
Holly3278 said:
Hi everyone. Can you all please recommend some books on things like the filioque, papal infallibility, papal supremacy, the Great Schism, and other such things that the Eastern Orthodox disagree with Catholics on? I’d appreciate your help. I’m doing research on the Eastern Orthodox but I want the Catholic point of view too.
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Howdy! I’ve often looked for such books before. I have to defer to the other posters when it comes to the Theology side of the issues. However, on the issue of Papal Infallibity, I found a book that specifically deals with issues raised by our Orthodox brethern. The book is called “Saint Peter Lives In Rome.” The author is Robert Stackpole. I found it at my local Catholic Bookstore in Virginia. It is wonderful, and it includes the great witness of the early Church fathers (both Greek and Latin) to the issue of the Papacy. It also refutes some arguments that supposedly contradict Infallibility. I hope you check it out.
 
Kiechlin said:
Howdy! I’ve often looked for such books before. I have to defer to the other posters when it comes to the Theology side of the issues. However, on the issue of Papal Infallibity, I found a book that specifically deals with issues raised by our Orthodox brethern. The book is called “Saint Peter Lives In Rome.” The author is Robert Stackpole. I found it at my local Catholic Bookstore in Virginia. It is wonderful, and it includes the great witness of the early Church fathers (both Greek and Latin) to the issue of the Papacy. It also refutes some arguments that supposedly contradict Infallibility. I hope you check it out.
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Hmmm, ok. I 'll have to look that up on Amazon.com or at my local Catholic book store.
 
Holly3278 said:
Hi everyone. Can you all please recommend some books on things like the filioque, papal infallibility, papal supremacy, the Great Schism, and other such things that the Eastern Orthodox disagree with Catholics on? I’d appreciate your help. I’m doing research on the Eastern Orthodox but I want the Catholic point of view too.
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So you want books on where Catholics disagree with Eastern Orthodox from a Catholic point of view?

While I completely disagree with the author and reject his view. He does present the Catholic point of view on the issues with the Orthodox. It is an old book and can be down loaded as a pdf for free. The Orthodox Eastern Church By Adrian Fortescue, Second Edition London: Catholic Truth Society, 1908. Yes there is newer writing on the subject, but this book covers it. You want Chapter 11 The Orthodox Faith. It will begin a bit slow, but as the chapter progress you will find what you are looking for.

books.google.com/books?id=UPr1ZCxPW6QC&printsec=frontcover&dq=The+Orthodox+Eastern+Church+By+Adrian+Fortescue&lr=&ei=VA66SszxCoXgywSgscnvDg#v=onepage&q=&f=false

You can also find detailed books from reading the footnotes of “Byzantine theology: historical trends and doctrinal themes” By John Meyendorff. He does makes reference to Catholic authors and views. You can follow the trail of his footnotes to some classic Catholic books on subjects. His book is a classic defense of the Orthodox. Fr. Meyendorff presents the point of view of my faith.
 
hobbitofny said:
So you want books on where Catholics disagree with Eastern Orthodox from a Catholic point of view?

While I completely disagree with the author and reject his view. He does present the Catholic point of view on the issues with the Orthodox. It is an old book and can be down loaded as a pdf for free. The Orthodox Eastern Church By Adrian Fortescue, Second Edition London: Catholic Truth Society, 1908. Yes there is newer writing on the subject, but this book covers it. You want Chapter 11 The Orthodox Faith. It will begin a bit slow, but as the chapter progress you will find what you are looking for.

books.google.com/books?id=UPr1ZCxPW6QC&printsec=frontcover&dq=The+Orthodox+Eastern+Church+By+Adrian+Fortescue&lr=&ei=VA66SszxCoXgywSgscnvDg#v=onepage&q=&f=false

You can also find detailed books from reading the footnotes of “Byzantine theology: historical trends and doctrinal themes” By John Meyendorff. He does makes reference to Catholic authors and views. You can follow the trail of his footnotes to some classic Catholic books on subjects. His book is a classic defense of the Orthodox. Fr. Meyendorff presents the point of view of my faith.
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Hmmm, ok. Thank you! 👍
 
Try the author “James Likoudis”. He has several good books on the East. He is a convert from the Greek Orthodox Church. Also, try the book “The Russian Church and the Papacy” by Vladimir Soloviev. I believe Catholic Answers sells it on their website.
 
Holly3278 said:
Hi everyone. Can you all please recommend some books on things like the filioque, papal infallibility, papal supremacy, the Great Schism, and other such things that the Eastern Orthodox disagree with Catholics on? I’d appreciate your help. I’m doing research on the Eastern Orthodox but I want the Catholic point of view too.
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I think this is probably the book your looking for Holly. It really covers all the major talking points you listed and more.

The Divine Primacy of the Bishop of Rome
and Modern Eastern Orthodoxy: Letters to
a Greek Orthodox on the Unity of the Church
By JAMES LIKOUDIS

credo.stormloader.com/letters.htm
 
Tradycja said:
Try the author “James Likoudis”. He has several good books on the East. He is a convert from the Greek Orthodox Church. Also, try the book “The Russian Church and the Papacy” by Vladimir Soloviev. I believe Catholic Answers sells it on their website.
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Well he has a trilogy on the subject with a few other miscellaneous articles. The first one that covers Soloviev actually I thought was a bit weak… The Second one, on the papacy, Orthodoxy apologetics etc. is hard hitting and definitely worth the money. The third one is pretty good, has some nice supplementary info, but not a must like the middle book.
 
Tradycja said:
Try the author “James Likoudis”. He has several good books on the East. He is a convert from the Greek Orthodox Church. Also, try the book “The Russian Church and the Papacy” by Vladimir Soloviev. I believe Catholic Answers sells it on their website.
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Ah ok. Thanks for the suggestions! I’ll have to see if I can get those books on interlibrary loan.
Addai said:
I think this is probably the book your looking for Holly. It really covers all the major talking points you listed and more.

The Divine Primacy of the Bishop of Rome
and Modern Eastern Orthodoxy: Letters to
a Greek Orthodox on the Unity of the Church
By JAMES LIKOUDIS

credo.stormloader.com/letters.htm
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Ah ok thanks! I’ll have to see if I can get that book on library loan! 👍
Addai said:
Well he has a trilogy on the subject with a few other miscellaneous articles. The first one that covers Soloviev actually I thought was a bit weak… The Second one, on the papacy, Orthodoxy apologetics etc. is hard hitting and definitely worth the money. The third one is pretty good, has some nice supplementary info, but not a must like the middle book.
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Hmmm, ok. Thanks for the information Addai! It is appreciated! 👍
 
I agree with Marduk’s post above.

My personal recommendation would be the Byzantine Liturgy and the Greek Fathers, especially St. Basil the Great, alongside the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

In most of my reading the Orthodox have argued against an incorrect presentation of Catholicism and then argued for a theology which seems to me identical to the Catholic Faith - including on issues where we supposedly disagree, such as the Filioque. Hence all we really need to do to “refute” them is understand our own Faith.

For the infallibility of the Pope, I would recommend Soloviev’s “Russia and the Universal Church”, except for the weak 3rd section where his Hegelianism gets the better of him. I don’t know which book of the trilogy it is.
 
You might want to use Archbishop Hilarion’s The Mystery of Faith. An Introduction to the Teaching and Spirituality of the Orthodox Church (Darton, Longman and Todd, 2002) to compare with your the Catechism of the Catholic Church. His is the best summary of the Church teachings in English.

Vladimir Sergeyevich Solovyov was not Orthodox in theology. He teachs Sophia. I do not think it is Roman Catholic. However you best judge that by reading his encounters with Sophia in his works the Three Encounters and Lectures on Godmanhood.

The one book of his excerpted in English you listed might please you. However, his teaching on Sophia have been deemed a heresy by the Orthodox. An educated Orthodox will not listen to you use his works. If you were to reference his works in a talk with me, I think you also believe in his Sophia heresy and you would get no where with me. He might defend the Roman Catholic stands, but you do not want to be associated with his Sophia heresy?

I suggest you read Solovyov with the same care you would read Nestorius’ Bazaar of Heracleides. You might get some good things from Nestorius’ work, but would you use it with a non Roman Catholic? You might try, but a person might think you are Nestorius’ follower.

Use Solovyov if you want, but if I think you are a follower of his teachings do not expect me to listen. I do not listen to Nestorius nor will I listen to Solovyov. One because he rejected the two natures in Christ. One because he teaches Sophia.

It is best to use your Roman Catholic authors and not rely on Solovyov. However you are free to do as you wish.
 
One thing about Adrian Fortescue: in his books about Eastern Christianity (Catholic, Orthodox, and Non-Chalcedonian), he takes the point of view (common at the time) that the Roman Church is inherently superior.

Vladimir Soloviev’s works should be seen against their historical and social backdrop. He was arguing for the freedom of the Russian Orthodox Church from state control, and at the time it seemed to him the best way was to go in union with the Pope.
 
Cluny said:
One thing about Adrian Fortescue: in his books about Eastern Christianity (Catholic, Orthodox, and Non-Chalcedonian), he takes the point of view (common at the time) that the Roman Church is inherently superior.

Vladimir Soloviev’s works should be seen against their historical and social backdrop. He was arguing for the freedom of the Russian Orthodox Church from state control, and at the time it seemed to him the best way was to go in union with the Pope.
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Fortescue’s superciliousness regarding the “Uniates” combined with his blatant disregard for reality when it comes to painting the Orthodox as black as possible drives me through the wall.

I would read Soloviev instead. His writings on the Church are generally separated from his Gnostic/Hegelian tendencies - when they exist in the same work (such as Russia and the Universal Church), they are in separate chapters and there is a quite radical disjunction between the two parts of the book.

His teaching on Sophia is pretty unclear (as are the teachings of Florensky and Bulgakov); it could be taken in an orthodox sense, I think, if you stretched it enough. But it requires some pretty active re-interpretation on our part in order to avoid heresy.
 
hobbitofny said:
You might want to use Archbishop Hilarion’s The Mystery of Faith. An Introduction to the Teaching and Spirituality of the Orthodox Church (Darton, Longman and Todd, 2002) to compare with your the Catechism of the Catholic Church. His is the best summary of the Church teachings in English.

Vladimir Sergeyevich Solovyov was not Orthodox in theology. He teachs Sophia. I do not think it is Roman Catholic. However you best judge that by reading his encounters with Sophia in his works the Three Encounters and Lectures on Godmanhood.

The one book of his excerpted in English you listed might please you. However, his teaching on Sophia have been deemed a heresy by the Orthodox. An educated Orthodox will not listen to you use his works. If you were to reference his works in a talk with me, I think you also believe in his Sophia heresy and you would get no where with me. He might defend the Roman Catholic stands, but you do not want to be associated with his Sophia heresy?

I suggest you read Solovyov with the same care you would read Nestorius’ Bazaar of Heracleides. You might get some good things from Nestorius’ work, but would you use it with a non Roman Catholic? You might try, but a person might think you are Nestorius’ follower.

Use Solovyov if you want, but if I think you are a follower of his teachings do not expect me to listen. I do not listen to Nestorius nor will I listen to Solovyov. One because he rejected the two natures in Christ. One because he teaches Sophia.

It is best to use your Roman Catholic authors and not rely on Solovyov. However you are free to do as you wish.
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Catholic teaching on Sophia is the same as Orthodox teaching - liturgically and Scripturally (both from Proverbs and the Wisdom of Solomon), there is such a concept, but it’s never been defined or thought about clearly, and attempts to make it some sort of hypostasis are certainly heretical. Most Latin Catholics would probably feel uncomfortable with icons and churches named after her; Wisdom is generally thought of only in terms of typology. I wish that a theologian could develop a sophiology along more orthodox lines than that of the Protestant sophianists, and that of Bulgakov et alia.
 
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