Can Atheists be in a state of Grace?

[HabemusFrancis]

Can atheists be in a state of grace, or perhaps be saintly in their own way?

I mean can an atheist do God’s will and be kind, doing pleasing actions to God, without necessarily believing He exists?

 

[STT]

Can atheists be in a state of grace, or perhaps be saintly in their own way?

I mean can an atheist do God’s will and be kind, doing pleasing actions to God, without necessarily believing He exists?

I call that super grace since believer acts because of the gifts or punishment but nonbeliever acts because of act only.

 

[HabemusFrancis]

I think they would find it difficult to be in a state of Grace.

Because contrary to what they say, atheists tend not to be concerned with morals, or really what the right thing is aside from whatever is most convenient for them.

 

[Ubenedictus]

Can atheists be in a state of grace, or perhaps be saintly in their own way?

I mean can an atheist do God’s will and be kind, doing pleasing actions to God, without necessarily believing He exists?

State of grace means sanctifying grace\habitual grace, it flows from Christ death and is usually for those who believe. It will be hard for an unbelieving atheist to stumble upon that type of grace though not impossible.

 

[HerCrazierHalf]

Stupid question here. Does this imply that the Catholic view is that acts of charity, kindness, etc are a product of grace rather then a way to obtain grace?

Perhaps your hypothetical atheist is attempting to subtly change the world through acts of kindness and so forth that happen to be compatible with what you may call God’s will.

 

[Vonsalza]

Extraordinary grace is extraordinary - rare. It is also grace.

Thus it’s unlikely, but certainly possible. As to whether it may apply to a particular person?

“Above my pay-grade”.

 

[boomerang]

I recall James saying that Abraham and Rahab the prostitute were justified by their works. Jesus Himself tells us that when He judges mankind, the ones who do works of charity will go to heaven and the ones who don’t do works of charity will go to hell.

That said, all of us will sin at times and all of us has original sin as well. Whereas the atheist must rely solely on his good works and absence of sins, the believer relies on his good works, but he can also ask forgiveness for his sins. This puts the believer ahead, all other things being equal. So it is much harder for an atheist to be in a state of grace, perhaps even impossible. :twocents:

 

[dshix]

Can atheists be in a state of grace, or perhaps be saintly in their own way?

I mean can an atheist do God’s will and be kind, doing pleasing actions to God, without necessarily believing He exists?

It is difficult for an atheist to be in a state of grace, for the following reasons:

Firstly, the only way to obtain a state of grace is to be baptised and obtain sanctifying grace. That sanctifying grace must be kept by not mortally sinning, and then if one does sin mortally, one must go to confession to regain the state of grace.

This means that in the case of an atheist, either 1: he was never baptised and never obtained grace in the first place, or 2: he was baptised and then repudiated the faith by the sin of apostasy. Either way, the atheist is not in a state of grace.

I’m not exactly sure if this makes it objectively impossible for an atheist to be in a state of grace, or if there is some odd case where it would be possible.

 

[Bradski]

Can atheists be in a state of grace, or perhaps be saintly in their own way?

I mean can an atheist do God’s will and be kind, doing pleasing actions to God, without necessarily believing He exists?

We can’t be in a state of grace as I understand the Catholic definition: ‘Condition of a person who is free from mortal sin and pleasing to God. It is the state of being in God’s friendship and the necessary condition of the soul at death in order to attain heaven.’ catholicculture.org/culture/library/dictionary/index.cfm?id=36634

A mortal sin would be not taking mass and I haven’t taken it for many years (or at least the Anglican equivalent). So I’m out. But if you simply want to know if an atheist could do God’s will and be kind etc, then obviously yes. There are very few things that God seems to want with which I personally disagree, but there must be some people who are in complete agreement but simply don’t believe He exists in the first instance.

It seems an odd question in any case. If I listed everything that would be pleasing to the FSM (helping old ladies across the street, always leaving the toilet seat down, making sure you buy your round etc) then wouldn’t it seem strange if I suggested that you couldn’t do any of those things because you didn’t believe in him?

 

[boomerang]

It seems an odd question in any case. If I listed everything that would be pleasing to the FSM (helping old ladies across the street, always leaving the toilet seat down, making sure you buy your round etc) then wouldn’t it seem strange if I suggested that you couldn’t do any of those things because you didn’t believe in him?

Do people suggest that atheists can’t do good things? That would be wrong. Of course they can do good. But I have found, from my own situation, that I do much more good and much less wrong-doing now that I “found religion” so to speak. Your religion should be a giant motivator to do good. It doesn’t always work that way, though. People will always find ways to justify their own behavior.

 

[jaimeleglise]

I believe that to be in a state of grace, one must be baptized, be a believer, be free from mortal sin. We will also be judged by our good works and the love we have for each other.

 

[Vera_Ljuba]

I wonder if the title of this thread contains a misspelled word? Should it not be: “Can Atheists be in a state of Greece?” And the answer would be a resounding “yes”. Of course if there would be a “grace-o-meter” then the original question would also be meaningful.

 

[goout]

Can atheists be in a state of grace, or perhaps be saintly in their own way?

I mean can an atheist do God’s will and be kind, doing pleasing actions to God, without necessarily believing He exists?

Yes of course that is possible.
God is not bound by the sacraments.
I suppose the degree of militancy against God would have something to do with this.

As a Christian, I try to keep in mind that “to whom much is given, much is expected”. And so our degree of response (aka “faith”) is one of totality. That is very difficult for me as I suspect it is for other Christians. If I know God and what God asks of me, the question that comes to mind is “**am I **in a state of grace”. That is daunting enough without worrying about the disposition of those who do not believe in Christianity.

 

[fisherman_carl]

Can atheists be in a state of grace, or perhaps be saintly in their own way?

I mean can an atheist do God’s will and be kind, doing pleasing actions to God, without necessarily believing He exists?

Being in a state of grace has nothing to do with good works or being a ‘good person’. The only way for a Catholic (or anyone) to be in a state of grace is through the gift of God’s forgiveness which occurs normally through the Sacraments like Baptism and Reconciliation. No one can earn being in a state of grace. We can not earn forgiveness. It is a gift. We are not pelagiasts. It would be pride to think we could do it on our own apart from God’s grace. It is pretty hard for an atheist to receive this gift if he denies the existence of the giver. That is why atheism is dangerous for the soul.

 

[ffg]

‘State of Grace’ is being IN relationship with God.

Being in relationship with God has it’s requirements, which for someone who rejects the concept of God, or is unsure, seems a bit hard to reconcile.

Since the unbaptized (and not validly baptized) don’t go to confession before being received into the Church, I don’t really see a point in time where ‘State of Grace’ is the case.

For the validly baptized who are coming into the Church, if they called themselves Atheist, I don’t think they would do so between their reconciliation and reception into the Church.

 

[o_mlly]

Can atheists be in a state of grace, or perhaps be saintly in their own way?

I mean can an atheist do God’s will and be kind, doing pleasing actions to God, without necessarily believing He exists?

All goodness comes from God. No one can perform a good act unless God first initiates the action. We call this actual grace. All God’s children receive this gift.

There are two conditions in which humans can exist Those who are presently God’s lovers and those whom He continues to woo. We all are His beloved children; some just do not know Him yet.

 

[Charlemagne_III]

God’s grace is constantly available to all who seek it. Just turn the spigot to ON.

To those who deny its existence, it can hardly be said they seek it or even want it.

God does not force us to accept his grace.

That is why hell exists.

We want nothing to do with God but still require an eternal home for our immortal soul.

There we get to meet Satan, that other rebel who desired nothing more to do with God.

 

[Hicks]

An atheist cannot be in a state of grace by definition. A person is in a state of grace when they have received baptism and they retain the state of grace as long they are without mortal sin. Denying the existence of God is a mortal sin. Therefore, an atheist cannot be in a state of grace by definition

 

[porthos11]

Can atheists be in a state of grace, or perhaps be saintly in their own way?

I mean can an atheist do God’s will and be kind, doing pleasing actions to God, without necessarily believing He exists?

If the atheist is not baptized, not a chance.

If the atheist is baptized, then this is possible, but unlikely.

 

[Hicks]

I call that super grace since believer acts because of the gifts or punishment but nonbeliever acts because of act only.

I know this is from way back on the first page, but this went unaddressed and I think it needs an answer.

The distinction between natural and supernatural is one that is extremely neglected in our day, we have to recover it. A believer in God will increasingly act in a way that pleases God, because it is just and without thought for “gifts and punishment”. Such motivations are typical when our relationship with God is very new, but they give way to serving God for His own sake.

To say that it is “super grace” for a nonbeliever to do good acts without reference to God is inaccurate on at several levels, two of which I shall elucidate.

First, grace is not something that we ourselves generate. If the nonbeliever does not have a relationship with God, then no grace is present there. None whatsoever. The nonbeliever could perform outrageously heroic acts, but if the person performing them does not have sanctifying grace, then his acts are entirely without merit in God’s eyes. They are purely natural acts, and good as such. But if they are not united to God’s life through grace, then it is as though God doesn’t even “see” them, so to speak.

Secondly, it is very difficult to understand your meaning when you infer that an act has greater merit when the person performing it does not take God into account than an act where the God is taken into account. How could such a thing possibly be?