Can Catholics attend a Protestant service?

[PietroPaolo]

I can’t speak for UMC (United Methodist, I assume) although I’ve heard they tend to be very liberal. Like I said earlier, your experience is not typical of any protestant church I’ve ever attended, although my experience is limited to Assembly of God most of my life and Presbyterian in my formative years. Assembly of God churches are very pro-Life, but I have also attended Southern Baptist services at a point earlier in life when my kids went to elementary school at a Baptist-affiliated school and my wife taught at the school and church attendance was required. They were very conservative on social matters, too.

By the way, I don’t encourage Catholics to attend protestant churches on a regular basis, either, but if people like the OP want to do so once in a while, I don’t see any evil in it, either. I just find it very disingenuous to paint all protestants with the same brush or that Catholics are going to find abundant errors when they attend a protestant service. I trust that is not what you are doing.

I didn’t say it was evil, I just said I couldn’t recommend it on a regular basis (which is what the OP was asking - going “every few months”). Honestly, it seems to miss the entire point of going to church (which is about worshiping God, not hanging out with friends). I would encourage the OP to keep up with his old Protestant friends, but to do so by attending their services seems to be disingenuous - using the Protestant service to catch up with old buddies. Further, (and this is the only “broad bush” with which I’ll paint Protestants) the OP is bound to encounter many theological errors, which ought to be avoided if at all possible. If he goes, he’ll need to have those “filters up” to avoid falling into error himself. I’d support going if by so doing he is able to help convert some of his old friends, but otherwise I’d stick to the Mass (which is the worship God Himself established, just as He established the way we are to worship Him in the OT). Finally, I couldn’t recommend attending to any Catholic who isn’t very well grounded in his Catholic Faith. It is far too easy to fall into religious indifferentism in these days.

 

[WingsOfEagles]

I’m not overstating it, you’ve understated it. They support abortion in more than just situations where the life of the mother is at risk. They are a member of the “Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice” which describes itself as follows

We are a national community of religious organizations and faithful individuals dedicated to achieving reproductive justice. Through education, organizing and advocacy, we seek to elevate religious voices wherever faith, policy and our reproductive lives intersect.

They also state, on their own website, the following about their abortion stance
*
Our belief in the sanctity of unborn human life makes us reluctant* to approve abortion. But we are equally bound to respect the sacredness of the life and well-being of the mother, for whom devastating damage may result from an unacceptable pregnancy. (emphasis added)

Ask yourself, is being “reluctant” to approve murder enough? and What exactly is an “unacceptable pregnancy?” You’ll also note, not just the life of the mother, but her “well-being” is grounds for abortion, as is “devastating damage” (whatever that amounts to is left undefined).

Also, from same page…

“We cannot affirm abortion as an acceptable means of birth control, and we unconditionally reject it as a means of gender selection.”

 

[PietroPaolo]

Also, from same page…

“We cannot affirm abortion as an acceptable means of birth control, and we unconditionally reject it as a means of gender selection.”

Yes, and I applaud them for that. There stance, however, is still very “pro-choice” and is a far cry from only allowing abortion if the mother’s life is endangered (your claim). The UMC allows for abortion for any number of reasons, including the ever vague “psychological health,” and belong to (and fund) a group that outright advocates for “reproductive justice” (aka abortion on demand). I’m glad they put some limits on their nearly unconditional support of abortion, but it is still an outright support of evil (my original point).

 

[manualman]

“Ecumenism” does not consist of Catholics attending Protestant services. All these warnings about “keeping up filters” and whatnot is sketchy. Why even put yourself in that situation. My advice is to have dialogue with your Protestant friends outside of their service - that’s ecumenism too but without the risk of scandal. When Sunday comes around just go to Mass.

I might be more inclined to agree with you if the situation were a cradle catholic just starting to embrace his faith and genuinely learn about it for the first time, but if you read the OP, he came FROM this church and converted to Catholicism after coming to believe in her status as the actual church Christ founded and intended his followers to be one in. His motivation to attend WEDNESDAY (read the post!) services there is to maintain friendship with members there that he otherwise doesn’t have opportunity to keep up with.

It’s a known environment, and he already knows his faith well enough to come home in spite of FIRST encountering Christ in that other faith community. The risk of them successfully proselytizing him (if they even try) is little compared to the benefits of mutual Christian dialogue and bridge building. Ecumenism can be done badly or naively. This just isn’t one of those times. Catholicism is a faith, not a tribe or a gang. We don’t have to defend our turf or consider anybody outside as the enemy.

 

[Contarini]

Yes, and I applaud them for that. There stance, however, is still very “pro-choice” and is a far cry from only allowing abortion if the mother’s life is endangered (your claim). The UMC allows for abortion for any number of reasons, including the ever vague “psychological health,” and belong to (and fund) a group that outright advocates for “reproductive justice” (aka abortion on demand). I’m glad they put some limits on their nearly unconditional support of abortion, but it is still an outright support of evil (my original point).

I agree that “life or well-being” is extremely vague, but that’s still a far cry from “unconditional support.” You’re overstating the case grotesquely.

The UMC’s support for the Coalition for Reproductive Choice is very disturbing. Apparently there was an attempt to end it in 2012 which was killed before it reached the floor and was never voted on. The trend is definitely in a conservative direction, though.

Edwin

 

[PietroPaolo]

I agree that “life or well-being” is extremely vague, but that’s still a far cry from “unconditional support.” You’re overstating the case grotesquely.

The UMC’s support for the Coalition for Reproductive Choice is very disturbing. Apparently there was an attempt to end it in 2012 which was killed before it reached the floor and was never voted on. The trend is definitely in a conservative direction, though.

Edwin

Perhaps on that one issue (perhaps!) but they are also ever nearing approving gay “marriage.” I’ll be shocked if they don’t during the next general conference (2016 I believe). But really that is beside the point. My original point stands - yes there are elements of sanctification and truth in the Protestant world, but there is also error and evil. The elements of truth and goodness can also be found in the Church - without the officially sanctioned error. For this reason, I find Miriam the Leper (Numbers 12) to be a great parallel to modern Protestantism. Which I write a bite about HERE, if interested. There is nothing new under the sun, after all.

 

[christus_vincit]

I might be more inclined to agree with you if the situation were a cradle catholic just starting to embrace his faith and genuinely learn about it for the first time, but if you read the OP, he came FROM this church and converted to Catholicism after coming to believe in her status as the actual church Christ founded and intended his followers to be one in. His motivation to attend WEDNESDAY (read the post!) services there is to maintain friendship with members there that he otherwise doesn’t have opportunity to keep up with.

It’s a known environment, and he already knows his faith well enough to come home in spite of FIRST encountering Christ in that other faith community. The risk of them successfully proselytizing him (if they even try) is little compared to the benefits of mutual Christian dialogue and bridge building. Ecumenism can be done badly or naively. This just isn’t one of those times. Catholicism is a faith, not a tribe or a gang. We don’t have to defend our turf or consider anybody outside as the enemy.

Fair enough. I do see your point regarding the OP’s particular situation.

It is also true that many times actions done in the name of “ecumenism” (such as attending a Protestant service) have good intentions, but only end up causing more harm than good. As I said before - I don’t believe that real ecumenism takes place in the pews of a Protestant church (be it on Wednesday night or Sunday morning). However, I think concessions can be made (although I still do not see the OPs actions as ideal) in light of specific circumstances such as those presented by the OP. For example, if the OP had forged authentic friendships, why is there no option of meeting outside of church setting, at a restaurant or a cafe?

 

[getysbg]

I agree that “life or well-being” is extremely vague, but that’s still a far cry from “unconditional support.” You’re overstating the case grotesquely.

The UMC’s support for the Coalition for Reproductive Choice is very disturbing. Apparently there was an attempt to end it in 2012 which was killed before it reached the floor and was never voted on. The trend is definitely in a conservative direction, though.

Edwin

Being pro-choice is like being pregnant - you either are or are not. The only support pro-choicers offer is in defense of the mother. Who speaks for the unborn?

 

[phil19034]

[christus_vincit,
I can only speak for myself, but if a Catholic were to attend a worship service in my church I would be more apt to listen and have an open mind to what they had to say in return because I knew they at least respected my beliefs enough to attend my church and experience it for themselves instead of having preconceived notions about it.

For example, I joined CAF in May to learn more about Catholicism and I have learned a lot from where I began. I was even invited in a friendly way by someone on CAF to attend a Catholic Mass, which I did out of respect for that person. In keeping with the subject of this thread, I attended the Mass on a Saturday night so that I wouldn’t miss *my

Sunday obligation. I am an usher at my church.

I went to Mass with an open mind and heart and liked it and felt God’s presence there. I may go back some day but I also like my church and feel God’s presence there, too, and see God touching and working in the lives of many people at my local church.

While there are many nice, respectful and decent Catholics on this site, I also run into my share of those who think that it’s only Protestants who should do the bending and go to Catholic worship services but Catholics shouldn’t ever attend a Protestant church unless it is for the sake of a protestant family member or spouse.

Otherwise, they contend, (even on this thread) if you go you should wear your “filters” or wear a proverbial closepin on your nose because there’s going to be a lot of “errors” to sift through. I find very that very disrespectful.

While some protestants have misconceptions of Catholicism and are prejudiced against it, it is obvious to me that some Catholics are prejudiced about protestant beliefs and churches and paint all of them with the same brush. Regardless of whether it is Catholics or Protestants doing the talking, it is wrong to lump every member of a group or a faith tradition together.

Personally, I don’t like it when protestants do that to Catholics and I don’t like it the other way around, either.

There is nothing wrong with what you describe and it’s very good. The only issue is that it takes a very special person to do that on a weekly basis. Doing this for time to time with a friend is very good for the reasons you mention.

But for a Catholic to do this every week, he/she must be strong in their Faith, be very patient, and able to evangelize without upsetting other members of the Protestant church.

Unfortunately, a lot of Catholics are not strong enough to (1) defend their Faith or (2) not get lead away; or if they are strong enough, may not have the patience.

But for the people who can do this, it’s a very good way to teach about the Faith.

Another good way is to exchange books.

 

[Contarini]

Perhaps on that one issue (perhaps!) but they are also ever nearing approving gay “marriage.”

No. Quite the reverse. The liberals lose by a larger margin at every General Conference, and are extremely frustrated, to the point of considering leaving the UMC.

I am frustrated by the fact that UM conservatives seem to see homosexuality as the primary battle and abortion as a secondary issue, whereas in my view the situation is exactly the opposite. The UMC’s official position remains staunchly conservative on homosexuality, while it is confused and ambiguous on abortion.

I’ll be shocked if they don’t during the next general conference (2016 I believe).

I’ll be shocked if they do. More likely they will start talking about dividing the denominational assets and separating into two denominations, so they don’t keep butting heads every four years to no purpose. I hope they don’t do that, but it seems that more and more folks on both sides are talking about it as a lesser evil to the present gridlock.

But really that is beside the point. My original point stands - yes there are elements of sanctification and truth in the Protestant world, but there is also error and evil. The elements of truth and goodness can also be found in the Church - without the officially sanctioned error.

Unfortunately, in practical, empirical terms this is obviously not the case. The “fullness of truth” claim is only tenable in this form: that the Catholic dogmas are compatible with all truth. That is a believable, and indeed compelling claim. The claim that all elements of truth are currently expressed and practiced in the Catholic Church is patently false, and you simply discredit the case for Catholicism when you expect people to believe something so absurd.

Furthermore, the primary reason for attending services of another Christian body is to express fellowship with believers of that tradition. Conservative Catholics seem to think of worship in solely vertical terms, excluding the importance of fellowship among believers. This is one of those elements of truth which is not well expressed in Catholicism as currently constituted, particularly in its most aggressively “orthodox” forms. (Many American parishes do try to foster fellowship, but usually in clumsy and heavy-handed ways, which more traditional Catholics understandably resent.)

Edwin

 

[Contarini]

Being pro-choice is like being pregnant - you either are or are not.

Do you mean that anyone who does not support abortion on demand in all circumstances isn’t really prochoice? In that case, the original claim about the UMC is flatly false.

If you have actually read the UM statements, you can see that this isn’t the case–they express concern for the life of the unborn. Not enough, I agree–the statement on “responsible parenthood” is particularly horrible in my opinion.

Edwin

[/QUOTE]

 

[getysbg]

getysbg;12278173:

Being pro-choice is like being pregnant - you either are or are not.

Do you mean that anyone who does not support abortion on demand in all circumstances isn’t really prochoice? In that case, the original claim about the UMC is flatly false.

The problem is that you cannot be partially in favor of abortion and still consider yourself pro life. If you do, you become judge and jury over a life, one who has no way to advocate for his/her self. Anyway, we are both straying from the topic of this thread.

 

[Brandall]

“Ecumenism” does not consist of Catholics attending Protestant services. All these warnings about “keeping up filters” and whatnot is sketchy. Why even put yourself in that situation. My advice is to have dialogue with your Protestant friends outside of their service - that’s ecumenism too but without the risk of scandal. When Sunday comes around just go to Mass.

I’m not afraid of being thrown off target by another church. If I’m not friendly enough to go to their service, why should they come to mine?

 

[Brandall]

You know as well as I do that (aside from disagreeing with the Catholic Church) there is pretty much nothing Protestants agree on. I was counseled by a UMC minister to have pre-marital sex, to use birth control, and to get myself a copy of the karma sutra (all before I was Catholic, of course). As you might know, the UMC also supports abortion. Other Protestant communities support other evils (gay marriage is increasingly popular, e.g.) And, of course, theological errors abound. Thus, while elements of truth are found in other religions, I personally can’t recommend a Catholic regularly attending a non-Catholic Church.

Honestly, elements of truth are found in Islam and Hinduism, would you (in the name of inter-religious dialog) recommend a Catholic attend Mosque each Friday? If not, why not? Probably for the same reasons I can’t, in good conscience, recommend regular attendance at a Prot. service.

You know as well as I do that there isn’t a lot that Catholics agree on too. Look at all the factions in Catholicism. Something about people in glass houses…

 

[Brandall]

I’m not overstating it, you’ve understated it. They support abortion in more than just situations where the life of the mother is at risk. They are a member of the “Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice” which describes itself as follows

We are a national community of religious organizations and faithful individuals dedicated to achieving reproductive justice. Through education, organizing and advocacy, we seek to elevate religious voices wherever faith, policy and our reproductive lives intersect.

They also state, on their own website, the following about their abortion stance
*
Our belief in the sanctity of unborn human life makes us reluctant* to approve abortion. But we are equally bound to respect the sacredness of the life and well-being of the mother, for whom devastating damage may result from an unacceptable pregnancy. (emphasis added)

Ask yourself, is being “reluctant” to approve murder enough? and What exactly is an “unacceptable pregnancy?” You’ll also note, not just the life of the mother, but her “well-being” is grounds for abortion, as is “devastating damage” (whatever that amounts to is left undefined).

try googling the percentage of Catholics that support abortion. Catholics are the ones that are allowing abortion supporting politicians to stay in office. If Catholics could be counted on to vote against pro abortion politicians, it would be difficult for abortion to exist.

 

[Brandall]

I grew up in a Baptist Church and loved my time there. A very good friend of mine is now pastoring that church and I visit when I can. Last week was one of those times.

I love the Catholic Church and there are things there that I can find nowhere else. I’m more comfortable now, than I ever have been being in a body of believers where their doctrine was more like my own.

There are things about my old Baptist Church that are unique too. They are very friendly and outgoing, they love God and it’s a shame that there has always been a doctrinal wedge in between me and them. However, if you went to a Baptist Church for a month, there would be very little you would hear there that you would dispute. The sermons are better, the Baptist Hymnal is better and the Baptists actually sing the songs. I’ll visit again and it will be enjoyable. It’s not the Catholic Church but it is certainly an honorable worship.

 

[manualman]

The claim that all elements of truth are currently expressed and practiced in the Catholic Church is patently false, and you simply discredit the case for Catholicism when you expect people to believe something so absurd.

Wait! Are you calling me a flawed and imperfect sinner??!

Put 'em up!

 

[johnnyc176]

That’s called Ecumenism. Catholicism considers it rather good. You may take some flak for it from certain types of folks in the EF catholic community though. IMO, they’re just being snobs.

You will find many differing opinions across the whole spectrum of Catholicism. For instance here is one from a CAL apologist…

In the first place a Catholic has no business attending Protestant church services even occasionally. To participate in a heretical worship service and especially a communion service can be sinful for a Catholic because such an act is an affirmation of what we believe to be untrue. To attend an ecumenical service or a wedding or baptism is allowed, but Catholics are not allowed to attend such churches for the main reason of worship. Now if there are no Catholic churches in the vicinity on a Sunday, Catholics are allowed to participate in the Liturgy of Churches whose clergy are validly ordained such as the Eastern Orthodox Churches—including the reception of the Eucharist. Although we consider them to be in schism (not in union with the Pope) with the Catholic Church, such Churches are not heretical and share our basic beliefs.

Fr. Vincent Serpa, O.P.

I think the ecumenical benefit that the Catholic Church is talking about is a prayer service as Fr. Serpa is alluding to not an actual worship service in a protestant community.

 

[Brandall]

You will find many differing opinions across the whole spectrum of Catholicism. For instance here is one from a CAL apologist…

I think the ecumenical benefit that the Catholic Church is talking about is a prayer service as Fr. Serpa is alluding to not an actual worship service in a protestant community.

I’ve read Fr. Serpa’s opinion on the matter and disagree with him.

 

[manualman]

You will find many differing opinions across the whole spectrum of Catholicism. For instance here is one from a CAL apologist…
…
I think the ecumenical benefit that the Catholic Church is talking about is a prayer service as Fr. Serpa is alluding to not an actual worship service in a protestant community.

You will note that the reason the OP cited for wanting to attend is NOT because he misses their services or wishes to worship as they do, but because he misses the PEOPLE who all happen to be there in one place at one time.

So while Fr. Serpa’s opinion has significant merit, I’m not sure I’d always agree with him and I don’t think the context of his opinion is directly applicable here.

To the OP, don’t mind us. We like to examine issues for the mental sharpening it provides. We’re not arguing. Really!