Can Catholics be pro choice?

[stina]

Well, as Catholics we are obligated to vote to support/reject a lot of things. All I know is that I’ve looked everywhere and have yet to find a Canadian politician that completely follows the church in all aspects.
Also, I really don’t think it is really obvious who we should vote for, because as I said before, no politician is perfectly inline with the Church. politics are not that black/white because then you’d think the pope would say something about who we should vote for if there was one obvious candidate.

 

[estesbob]

Well, as Catholics we are obligated to vote to support/reject a lot of things. All I know is that I’ve looked everywhere and have yet to find a Canadian politician that completely follows the church in all aspects.
Also, I really don’t think it is really obvious who we should vote for, because as I said before, no politician is perfectly inline with the Church. politics are not that black/white because then you’d think the pope would say something about who we should vote for if there was one obvious candidate.

He has-you can not vote for a pro-abortion canidate UNLESS they are running against another pro-abortion canidate who would do more harm on life issues than they would.

*2. The Church teaches that abortion or euthanasia is a grave sin. The Encyclical Letter Evangelium vitae, with reference to judicial decisions or civil laws that authorize or promote abortion or euthanasia, states that there is a “grave and clear obligation to oppose them by conscientious objection. …] In the case of an intrinsically unjust law, such as a law permitting abortion or euthanasia, it is therefore never licit to obey it, or to 'take part in a propaganda campaign in favour of such a law or vote for it’” (no. 73). Christians have a “grave obligation of conscience not to cooperate formally in practices which, even if permitted by civil legislation, are contrary to God’s law. Indeed, from the moral standpoint, it is never licit to cooperate formally in evil. …] This cooperation can never be justified either by invoking respect for the freedom of others or by appealing to the fact that civil law permits it or requires it” (no. 74).

1. Not all moral issues have the same moral weight as abortion and euthanasia. For example, if a Catholic were to be at odds with the Holy Father on the application of capital punishment or on the decision to wage war, he would not for that reason be considered unworthy to present himself to receive Holy *
   Communion. While the Church exhorts civil authorities to seek peace, not war, and to exercise discretion and mercy in imposing punishment on criminals, it may still be permissible to take up arms to repel an aggressor or to have recourse to capital punishment. There may be a legitimate diversity of opinion even among Catholics about waging war and applying the death penalty, but not however with regard to abortion and euthanasia.

*Cardinal Ratzinger

 

[stina]

Well then I have no clue who I would vote for in Canada (2 more months, then I can vote) There are 2 major parties in Canada I’d consider. The one is “pro-life” yet its leader says he will never neglect a woman of her right to choose and never push for laws to change. To me, that is pro-choice. I think he just calls himself “pro-life” to humour the catholics. The other party is pro-choice, but I feel they have a better handle on many many other issues.
Alright, since I don’t have a great understanding of what exactly the Church wants me to do here, then what do you all think I should do? I just think if in this case the answer was so obvious, the Pope would have said “If you live in Canada, vote ____”

 

[estesbob]

Well then I have no clue who I would vote for in Canada (2 more months, then I can vote) There are 2 major parties in Canada I’d consider. The one is “pro-life” yet its leader says he will never neglect a woman of her right to choose and never push for laws to change. To me, that is pro-choice. I think he just calls himself “pro-life” to humour the catholics. The other party is pro-choice, but I feel they have a better handle on many many other issues.
Alright, since I don’t have a great understanding of what exactly the Church wants me to do here, then what do you all think I should do? I just think if in this case the answer was so obvious, the Pope would have said “If you live in Canada, vote ____”

We may very well have that situation in the US next year. if so I wont vote for either.

 

[Tim_James]

There are 2 major parties in Canada I’d consider.

The one is “pro-life” yet its leader says he will never neglect a woman of her right to choose and never push for laws to change. To me, that is pro-choice. I think he just calls himself “pro-life” to humour the catholics.

Well, it sounds like you have a dilemma. I would like to help. Can you PM me with the name of this guy?

The other party is pro-choice, but I feel they have a better handle on many many other issues.

Hmm, it seems that this one may be off the list due to the importance of the sanctity of life. But please PM me his name too, or the party’s.

Alright, since I don’t have a great understanding of what exactly the Church wants me to do here, then what do you all think I should do?

I appreciate your concern and laud your effort to do the right thing. I await your PMs.
Keep up the good fight.

 

[Petergee]

Well then I have no clue who I would vote for in Canada (2 more months, then I can vote) There are 2 major parties in Canada I’d consider. The one is “pro-life” yet its leader says he will never neglect a woman of her right to choose and never push for laws to change. To me, that is pro-choice. I think he just calls himself “pro-life” to humour the catholics. The other party is pro-choice, but I feel they have a better handle on many many other issues.
Alright, since I don’t have a great understanding of what exactly the Church wants me to do here, then what do you all think I should do? I just think if in this case the answer was so obvious, the Pope would have said “If you live in Canada, vote ____”

Contrary to popular impression, the pope has neither the time nor the desire to give absoultely specific instructions to every single Catholic about every single moral choice he faces in his life. The Church reminds you of the moral principles to help you to form your conscience, and it is up to you to decide what is moral in your situation. Re voting, you need to consider the personal moral stances of each individual candidate who is standing for election in your local constituaency, as well as the official positions of the major national political parties. You should investigate whether your local parish priest, bishop, bishops’ conference, and your local pro-life organisation, have issued any specific advice re voting morally and pro-life in Canada and in your local area.

 

[revelations]

read my sig…that’s the way i see it…

 

[stina]

The PM who pretends to be pro-life is Stephen Harper, the current Prime Minister. The other party I was referring to are the Liberals.

Many people have been saying that if a politician stands for something against Catholic belief, we shouldn’t vote for them, even if a lot of theirs beliefs are alright. Well then, there is no completely Catholic-happy politician (@ least in Canada) because many parties tend to combine their own personal views with what the general population wants. So then, is everyone on this forum saying that if you are Catholic and live in Canada, you should just not vote? because I don’t think I could just stand aside and let secular society decide how my country is going to be run.

 

[Tim_James]

Many people have been saying that if a politician stands for something against Catholic belief, we shouldn’t vote for them, even if a lot of theirs beliefs are alright.

Well, that’s absurd. If a Catholic was morally obligated to vote for candidates who were only thoroughly Catholic then we could only vote for perhaps 2% of the available candidates.
What a Catholic’s moral obligations are in this case are predominately revolving around the sanctity of life and marriage. Those are the ‘critical’ topics.
I will do some research on that guy and get back to you. When are your next elections?

 

[Naztakuan]

My teacher used to say that
“the best is often the enemy of the good”
Sometimes the best is not available and yiu have to settle with something with at least some benefit.
The way I see it both sides don’t seem to have a viable candidate that is trul prolife. Not yet anyway

 

[estesbob]

My teacher used to say that
“the best is often the enemy of the good”
Sometimes the best is not available and yiu have to settle with something with at least some benefit.
The way I see it both sides don’t seem to have a viable candidate that is trul prolife. Not yet anyway

Actually all but one of the candidates on the Republican side is truly pro-life. Every candidate on the Democrat side supports taxpayer-funded abortions up until the momen tthe head fully exits the womb. There simply is no comparison between the two parties on life issues.

The church says when one is faed with two pro-choice candidates one should vote for the one you would do the least harm on life issues. Accordingly the Republican candidatewoulget the nod regardless of who is nominated. From a personal standpoint I will never vote for a po abortion candidate no matter which party they represent.

 

[NonDenom]

Actually all but one of the candidates on the Republican side is truly pro-life. Every candidate on the Democrat side supports taxpayer-funded abortions up until the momen tthe head fully exits the womb. There simply is no comparison between the two parties on life issues.

The church says when one is faed with two pro-choice candidates one should vote for the one you would do the least harm on life issues. Accordingly the Republican candidatewoulget the nod regardless of who is nominated. From a personal standpoint I will never vote for a po abortion candidate no matter which party they represent./

 

[NonDenom]

Actually all but one of the candidates on the Republican side is truly pro-life. Every candidate on the Democrat side supports taxpayer-funded abortions up until the momen tthe head fully exits the womb. There simply is no comparison between the two parties on life issues.

The church says when one is faed with two pro-choice candidates one should vote for the one you would do the least harm on life issues. Accordingly the Republican candidatewoulget the nod regardless of who is nominated. From a personal standpoint I will never vote for a po abortion candidate no matter which party they represent.

Huck is the man!

 

[Newbie2]

Devil’s advocate (literally!) might say that a person doesn’t forfeit their Catholicity if they take a “pro-choice” stance, same as if they divorce and remarry without an annulment.

Or, perhaps, a Catholic who never goes to confession but has commited a mortal sin…can he or she still be a Catholic?

Just another way of looking at it. The answer to the OP would be that a Catholic cannot be in line with Church teachings and be “pro-choice”. Maybe it’s a matter of semantics. , but the prinicple is the same.

 

[Sean_Boyle]

Devil’s advocate (literally!) might say that a person doesn’t forfeit their Catholicity if they take a “pro-choice” stance, same as if they divorce and remarry without an annulment.

Or, perhaps, a Catholic who never goes to confession but has commited a mortal sin…can he or she still be a Catholic?

Just another way of looking at it. The answer to the OP would be that a Catholic cannot be in line with Church teachings and be “pro-choice”. Maybe it’s a matter of semantics. , but the prinicple is the same.

A person who supports abortion in any small way separates himself/herself from God. In fact they are making themselves their own god by claiming to know more or better than God. They serve two gods, one being themselves.

They may be Catholic or christian in name only. That wouldn’t help them much in the eyes of God at the end of their earthly life, if they haven’t repented by that time.

No a “faithful” Catholic can’t be pro choice. That is the only label that matters “faithful” Catholic.

No a Catholic can’t be admitted to the communion of heavenly saints as a pro-choice soul. Isn’t that the ultimate question? Who cares what you call yourself on earth, it won’t help you when you go before the presents of God.

 

[AndyF]

NonDenom:

No. (See signature)

To Catholics doctrine forms the only accepted precepts to every conscious choice and every developed code. In fact God insists civil code be formulated with Doctrine as a foundation.

AndyF

 

[blueoval]

According to Church teaching. No. A Catholic cannot be pro-choice. For 2,000 yrs the Church has always condemned abortion and its even written in the Didache (Teaching of the Twelve Apostle 40-50 AD).

Your in laws are out of touch with the teaching of the Catholic Church. You can point out to the Catechism of the Catechism, and Papal Encyclicals which condemned it. If a Catholic believes there is nothing morally wrong with voting for a pro-choice candidate, he finds himself at odds with the Church.

I do held Catholics more accountable than I do Protestants since Protestants are not bound on Magisterial Teachings. Catholics on the other hand are. They claim to be Catholic but they aren’t. They are only Catholic by name, what makes a Catholic a Catholic is someone who adhere and is completely obedient to all the teachings of the Church.

I also like to add that I find the top candidates for the 2008 Presidential Election unworthy for my taste. So there is no way I am going to vote this coming elections. I cannot see myself voting a Democrat or Republican candidate who are apparently pro-choice. Not to mention, these individuals favor same sex union.

Let’s see: John McCain (R), Dennis Kucinich (D), Bill Richardson (D), and Joe Biden (D) are all Catholics (to the best of my knowledge) and I believe all are pro-choice, but I MAY be wrong on McCain’s views. There are no pro-lifers on the Democrat ticket. Just about all of the remaining Republicans are pro-life. However, best to check the candidate’s voting record BEFORE voting, just to be sure.

 

[mary_bobo]

Let’s see: John McCain (R), Dennis Kucinich (D), Bill Richardson (D), and Joe Biden (D) are all Catholics (to the best of my knowledge) and I believe all are pro-choice, but I MAY be wrong on McCain’s views. There are no pro-lifers on the Democrat ticket. Just about all of the remaining Republicans are pro-life. However, best to check the candidate’s voting record BEFORE voting, just to be sure.

McCain is not a Catholic. There is a candidate that has a pro-life voting record, but we are not supposed to talk about candidates.

 

[blueoval]

McCain is not a Catholic. There is a candidate that has a pro-life voting record, but we are not supposed to talk about candidates.

I sincerely beg to differ! McCain is most assuredly a Catholic! I’ve heard him say so, in fact. Not allowed to talk about candidates??? How do we learn about who is whom and what is what, if not allowed to talk about individuals?

 

[mary_bobo]

I sincerely beg to differ! McCain is most assuredly a Catholic! I’ve heard him say so, in fact. Not allowed to talk about candidates??? How do we learn about who is whom and what is what, if not allowed to talk about individuals?

If that is true, I stand corrected. Forum rules have prohibited discussion on candidates. Oh, I just googled McCain and it says Episcopalian.