Can Catholics participate in yoga?

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Hello Edwin,

So, you think going through life (knowingly) displeasing God by participating in pagan rituals is fine- so long as you do with a happy disposition?
Of course not. I’m saying that if you pursue what is good and avoid what is evil, you will not displease God. If you see good in yoga and pursue it unless and until you encounter something evil, you do not run a “risk” of displeasing God. God isn’t like that. It isn’t possible for God to be like that. A being who was like that–who punished people for pursuing the good because they had unknowingly violated some rule–would not be God. Period.
I am afraid you completely misinterpreted what I said

The misinterpretation was mutual! In fact, you “misinterpreted” yourself. Your original claim was that one should not do something if there is a small chance that it is displeasing to God. When I challenged this, you changed the issue entirely by accusing me of saying that it was OK to displease God knowingly
. These are two completely different things. Of course if one concludes that a practice is evil, one should not do it. But you seemed to be suggesting that one should “play it safe” by essentially avoiding any practice in which some hidden evil might possibly lurk.
where did I ever advocate going through life with a hang-dog demeanor?
When you encouraged people to play a percentage game and avoid anything that might turn out to be wrong.

Catholicism recognizes that there is truth in Hinduism. People who practice yoga are looking for that truth. At the point at which yoga involves a practice incompatible with orthodox Christianity, Christians should obviously stop. But the argument that any practice rooted in Hinduism is thereby incompatible with Christianity is theologically bogus and morally corrupting.

Edwin
 
Of course not. I’m saying that if you pursue what is good and avoid what is evil, you will not displease God. If you see good in yoga and pursue it unless and until you encounter something evil, you do not run a “risk” of displeasing God. God isn’t like that. It isn’t possible for God to be like that. A being who was like that–who punished people for pursuing the good because they had unknowingly violated some rule–would not be God. Period.
I am afraid you completely misinterpreted what I said

. These are two completely different things. Of course if one concludes that a practice is evil, one should not do it. But you seemed to be suggesting that one should “play it safe” by essentially avoiding any practice in which some hidden evil might possibly lurk.

When you encouraged people to play a percentage game and avoid anything that might turn out to be wrong.

Catholicism recognizes that there is truth in Hinduism. People who practice yoga are looking for that truth. At the point at which yoga involves a practice incompatible with orthodox Christianity, Christians should obviously stop. But the argument that any practice rooted in Hinduism is thereby incompatible with Christianity is theologically bogus and morally corrupting.

Edwin

Good post.
 
Hello Edwin, (Contarini),

It was NEVER my intent to encourage people to play a percentage game when it comes to committing sinful acts or offending God; I used that 10% argument in an attempt to make a point. I assumed people would be able to recognize that, but evidently, I was wrong and made an *** of you and me.

Now, back to Yoga: a bad tree cannot yield good fruit- someone cannot engage in a heretical religion’s activities, (such as Yoga with its religious ties to Hinduism and Buddhism), and expect to glean good fruit from it. You can run around saying Yoga is good but you are deluding yourself. Pro-Choicer’s believe that legalized abortion is good and that women should have the freedom to do what they will with their bodies- many are content, pleased and even proud of pro-choice beliefs and affiliations and their defense of them- that doesn’t make them right.

Please do not be fooled into believing that some superficial or sensory sense of fulfillment or satisfaction means your actions or endeavors are automatically worthy- that is the “if it feels good then do it” lie that has been perpetrated on us through the Modernist agenda. Please use reason and recall what our dear Lord told us- “You cannot get good fruit from a bad tree,” no matter how desirable it may look or how sweet it may taste or how “good” it may make you feel at the time.

The fruit from the Tree of Life was pleasing to the senses too, (the eye and the palate)- but it was spiritual death. Also remember that ours is a jealous God… “Thou shalt not have strange gods before Me.” This can be true of earthly material fixations- but it is especially true of an “exercise” with heretical origins.

Oremus pro invicem,

Sean C. :knight2:
 
Hello again Edwin,

I do want to clarify one point- since heresies are actually non-approved off-shoots of Catholicism, I cannot refer to Yoga, Buddhism or Hinduism as heresies; so instead, I will say:

It was NEVER my intent to encourage people to play a percentage game when it comes to committing sinful acts or offending God; I used that 10% argument in an attempt to make a point. I assumed people would be able to recognize that, but evidently, I was wrong and made an a** of you and me.

Now, back to Yoga: a bad tree cannot yield good fruit- someone cannot engage in a pagan religion’s activities, (such as Yoga with its religious ties to Hinduism and Buddhism), and expect to glean good fruit from it. You can run around saying Yoga is good but you are deluding yourself. Pro-Choicer’s believe that legalized abortion is good and that women should have the freedom to do what they will with their bodies- many are content, pleased and even proud of pro-choice beliefs and affiliations and their defense of them- that doesn’t make them right.

Please do not be fooled into believing that some superficial or sensory sense of fulfillment or satisfaction means your actions or endeavors are automatically worthy- that is the “if it feels good then do it” lie that has been perpetrated on us through the Modernist agenda. Please use reason and recall what our dear Lord told us- “You cannot get good fruit from a bad tree,” no matter how desirable it may look or how sweet it may taste or how “good” it may make you feel at the time.

The fruit from the Tree of Life was pleasing to the senses too, (the eye and the palate)- but it was spiritual death. Also remember that ours is a jealous God… “Thou shalt not have strange gods before Me.” This can be true of earthly material fixations- but it is especially true of an “exercise” with pagan origins.

Oremus pro invicem,

Sean C. :knight2:
 
Now, back to Yoga: a bad tree cannot yield good fruit- someone cannot engage in a pagan religion’s activities, (such as Yoga with its religious ties to Hinduism and Buddhism), and expect to glean good fruit from it. You can run around saying Yoga is good but you are deluding yourself. Pro-Choicer’s believe that legalized abortion is good and that women should have the freedom to do what they will with their bodies- many are content, pleased and even proud of pro-choice beliefs and affiliations and their defense of them- that doesn’t make them right.
False comparison. Then again, I’m not surprised granted that has always been the habit of yours (as well as those who share your self-proclaimed ‘pious’ way of viewing things).
Please do not be fooled into believing that some superficial or sensory sense of fulfillment or satisfaction means your actions or endeavors are automatically worthy- that is the “if it feels good then do it” lie that has been perpetrated on us through the Modernist agenda.
That’s not really the main argument for Yoga on this thread. The main argument is the separation of physical posture from connotation (as already proven by modern semiotic theory).

As I’ve demonstrated to another poster (whose reply is still due), saying that the simple act of posturing makes one a Hindu practitioner is as ridiculous as saying pretending to make ninja hand signs makes one a Shintoist.
 
False comparison? Really? I disagree.

The real main argument here is whether or not a practicing Catholic should engage in an exercise that stems from a pagan religion. What other people want to make of this thread is up to them; I have always been more concerned with the “big picture” than the trivial minutia that may satellite around it.

You’re primary focus in this life should be on the salvation of your soul and the souls of your family and friends. You should always keep Particular Judgment in the back of your mind whenever you choose to do something or not do something.

Naturally, we have high hopes in His Infinite Ocean of Mercy (and the intercession of Our Blessed Mother and the other saints we pray to everyday); however, we should never knowingly presume upon it. I have been through enough and lived long enough to know the “big picture” is all that really matters because you know not the day or the hour when you will drop dead and be standing before Him in judgment. The pseudo-intellectual tripe that gets flung around in these debates is just so much fuel for an empty fire. I’m not so sure you can appreciate what I’m trying to say, but I really hope you will someday and I hope you don’t have to learn it as painfully as I did.

BTW, you’re comparing apples and oranges with the Ninja bit. There is a big difference between engaging in meditative exercises from a pagan religion and clowning around. You’re comparing playing “air guitar” in a friend’s basement with joining a heavy metal rock band.

Oremus pro invicem,

Sean C. :knight2:
 
It was NEVER my intent to encourage people to play a percentage game when it comes to committing sinful acts or offending God; I used that 10% argument in an attempt to make a point.
Well, I certainly fail to see the point.
Now, back to Yoga: a bad tree cannot yield good fruit- someone cannot engage in a pagan religion’s activities, (such as Yoga with its religious ties to Hinduism and Buddhism), and expect to glean good fruit from it.
Define “pagan religion.” Do you have any idea how hard it is to define what a religion is?

Furthermore, do you have any understanding of the Hindu concept of God? Have you ever actually talked to a devout Hindu about what they believe about God? You seem to have a boilerplate concept of what a “pagan religion” is, but you haven’t supported this with any evidence or argument.

Even more to the point, we do have a classic definition of “pagan religion”–ancient Greco-Roman religion. And yet Christian civilization has all kinds of elements that are deeply connected with Greco-Roman paganism. Our very separation between “secular” and “religious” originates from the fact that early Christians wanted to be able to use some elements of pagan culture while not worshiping pagan gods. And yet, they did continue to study literature which spoke of pagan gods. You can even find Christians performing classical Greek drama, which was an act of worship to pagan gods. Do you have a problem with this? If not, why not, on your own principles?

Your “bad tree, bad fruit” argument, if applied to the form of paganism that gave us the term in the first place, would condemn most of traditional Christian civilization. And yet you think you can apply it to an entirely different culture which itself created powerful criticisms of its ancestral polytheism? You even apply it to Buddhism, which doesn’t regard the Hindu devas as beings worthy of worship at all.

The abortion analogy is, of course, not an argument at all and doesn’t deserve an answer until you can show how the one thing is like the other.

Edwin
 
You’re primary focus in this life should be on the salvation of your soul and the souls of your family and friends.
Well, this is one place where I agree with Calvin: our focus should rather be on the glory of God and the advancement of His kingdom.

Edwin
 
Well, this is one place where I agree with Calvin: our focus should rather be on the glory of God and the advancement of His kingdom.

Edwin
Hello Edwin,

This is a nice sentiment; thank you for sharing it. 🙂

I don’t know if you need to attribute it to Calvin exclusively though, I’m sure there were many Catholic(s) (clergy) who felt the same way. 😉

As far as everything else you said in your previous post; I’ll have to get back to you later- I’ve been awake since yesterday and I’m a little too tired and a little too punchy to give the response to your queries the attention it deserves.

Oremus pro invicem,

Sean C. :knight2:
 
As usual, you’ve missed the point- check out the top of your head; I’m sure you’ll find it there. :rolleyes:

All the best,

Sean C.
 
Hello Edwin,

This is a nice sentiment; thank you for sharing it. 🙂

I don’t know if you need to attribute it to Calvin exclusively though, I’m sure there were many Catholic(s) (clergy) who felt the same way. 😉
I would hope so–I’d love to see some examples from the 16th century, though. I’d expect a Thomist to think that way, for instance. But 16th-century Christians generally do seem to have been very concerned with individual salvation. That is one of the reasons for Protestantism–but paradoxically the Protestants used sola fide to get the personal salvation concern out of the way so people could do good works to the glory of God. (And no, I’m not defending sola fide.)

Calvin was responding to Sadoleto, who had said that assuring one’s personal salvation was a Christian’s most important concern (in the context of exhorting the Genevans to return to the Church).

This isn’t, of course, highly relevant here!

Edwin
 
Modern semiotics would disagree with you and I’d take an expert take on the subject over that of a priest who isn’t.

Following your logic, I practice Shinto every time I do these with my hands.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_BEw4jLlvsa8/RoDYoyvrUPI/AAAAAAAAAAk/mqdR8n5ctSg/s400/seals2nv.png

Well I do the above hand signs every now and then for the lulz. How come I’m not possessed?
Kage bunshin no jutsu! :yyeess::yyeess::yyeess::yyeess::yyeess::yyeess::yyeess:
 
I’m not so sure you can appreciate what I’m trying to say, but I really hope you will someday and I hope you don’t have to learn it as painfully as I did.
I see no value in lack of logic. I’ve already ‘learned’ the useless, obscure ‘spiritual thinking’ long before you and thank God I dumped it and reverted back to reason. The Almighty gave me a brain and taught me to use it. I hope you don’t have to learn it as embarrassingly as I nearly did. Then again, seeing your rhetoric, I guess it’s a little too late for that.
The real main argument here is whether or not a practicing Catholic should engage in an exercise that stems from a pagan religion.
BTW, you’re comparing apples and oranges with the Ninja bit. There is a big difference between engaging in meditative exercises from a pagan religion and clowning around. You’re comparing playing “air guitar” in a friend’s basement with joining a heavy metal rock band.
LOL!!! Do you even know the origins of those hand signs?

Sorry but you, who compare practicing yoga with abortion, have no authority to even use my own argument against me.

Shaping your body into a yoga position is no different from shaping your hands into a kuji-in sign. It’s just a physical gesture and if you even just had a basic idea of semiotics and linguistics, you can see that they have no intrinsic value (regardless of what religious people say).
 
I suppose this means we all must throw away our calendars since the months and the days of the week are named after false gods.
 
Ahh, Gaara fan I see! 😉
Yesh. 😛 (I like Puppet Jutsu too though. :p)
Clap Hands → Boar → Monkey → Rat → Horse → Monkey → Horse → Ram → Horse → Clap Hands.

😛
Okaaay… either that’s your own original jutsu or I need to do some homework…

Either way encloses himself in large, thick-shelled sand capsule You’re not gonna get me!!! DX
 
Yesh. 😛 (I like Puppet Jutsu too though. :p)

Okaaay… either that’s your own original jutsu or I need to do some homework

Either way encloses himself in large, thick-shelled sand capsule You’re not gonna get me!!! DX
A quick google search should suffice. 😉
 
Of all the things that have been lost in our dying civilization; the two greatest losses have been our admitted dependence on God and common sense.
  • Sean C.
 
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