Can doing something right be morally wrong?

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Sir_Knight

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Per scripture and the CCC, we know that the ends does not justify the means – meaning that we can not do a wrong thing even for a good reason. Without getting into the specifics, what about doing the right thing for the wrong reason? Would that be morally right or morally wrong?
 
Sir_Knight said:
Per scripture and the CCC, we know that the ends does not justify the means – meaning that we can not do a wrong thing even for a good reason. Without getting into the specifics, what about doing the right thing for the wrong reason? Would that be morally right or morally wrong?
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could you give an example?
 
Sure it can… if a rich person gives $10,000 to charity for the purpose of publicity and so everyone can see what a great guy he is, then his narcissism becomes the sin of vanity, despite the good that the $ can do for the charity.
 
I would say yes. Jesus warned about doing things for show.
MT 6:3
"Beware of practicing your piety before men in order to be seen by them; for then you will have no reward from your Father who is in heaven.

Peace
James
 
I would add though that sometimes there can be sort of “mixed motives”…like one knows there is a bit of self seeking in the good you do for the Children at some hospital…but one really is basically doing it for good. For them …for God above all. One should not scruple here for many can struggle with such.

And one could have various unreasonable fears…scruples…temptations that keep some from doing good. When they need to dismiss such …and do the good.

I remember one story regarding a Saint I think…who was giving a very moving sermon…and the Devil tempted him during it…“your just doing this to be praised…and for pride…you had better stop”. To which the Priest replied to him…I did not begin this sermon for you and I am not going to stop it for you either!
 
Both the ends and the means must be okay. So, if you have a neutral or good means and a bad end (a bad intention), this is a no go.
 
surritter said:
Sure it can… if a rich person gives $10,000 to charity for the purpose of publicity and so everyone can see what a great guy he is, then his narcissism becomes the sin of vanity, despite the good that the $ can do for the charity.
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Do you think the charity gives a darn why someone donated money? If I give money to a pro-life group because I want my name out there, does it really matter as long as they stop abortions with it? Motives and intentions are, for the most part, totally irrelevant.
 
Rascalking said:
Do you think the charity gives a darn why someone donated money? If I give money to a pro-life group because I want my name out there, does it really matter as long as they stop abortions with it? Motives and intentions are, for the most part, totally irrelevant.
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Not thinking in terms of what the Charity experiences. Such is not in question.

Not in terms of the morality of the action on the part of the person giving. See Catechism links above.

Especially this line:

“On the other hand, an added bad intention (such as vainglory) makes an act evil that, in and of itself, can be good (such as almsgiving).”
 
Bookcat said:
Not thinking in terms of what the Charity experiences. Such is not in question.

Not in terms of the morality of the action on the part of the person giving. See Catechism links above.

Especially this line:

“On the other hand, an added bad intention (such as vainglory) makes an act evil that, in and of itself, can be good (such as almsgiving).”
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Whatever you say. It’s legalistic and slightly disturbing. No wonder so many Catholics seem neurotic.

Maybe God doesn’t care why you do something. Perhaps He would rather you give money to charity and doesn’t care why you do it.

Beats me, I can’t read the mind of God.
 
Rascalking said:
Whatever you say. It’s legalistic and slightly disturbing. No wonder so many Catholics seem neurotic.

Maybe God doesn’t care why you do something. Perhaps He would rather you give money to charity and doesn’t care why you do it.

Beats me, I can’t read the mind of God.
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I certainly can understand the desire to see charities supported. And they should be. And yes we can all struggle at times with various motives perhaps. But thankfully God works on us.

But it is important that one does not do something for a bad intention. Our interior intention etc is very important.

Jesus made this clear in the Gospels and the Church makes it clear in the Catechism. It is not “legalistic” or neurotic. Quite the opposite.

It is part of the Gospel.

Our lives are not to be just mere legal observance or approach or mere external action.

We are t have right intention…a right heart put into our actions. Our actions are to be good not only in what is done but the intention with which it is done and the circumstances too are to be good. Goodness inside and out.

And thankfully we have the Holy Spirit to transform us and to work on the inside 🙂

(even if like I noted above one may experience some “ad mixture” …that one works on with the help of the Grace of God…we all experience such from time to time)
 
Bookcat said:
It is not “legalistic” or neurotic.
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It is actually legalistic, and it can make people neurotic, like I said, whatever you say.

Just tell kids with cancer that the money that is coming in to them is no longer available because the giver wants his name on the hospital wing.

Likewise, I’m no longer donating to pro-life charities because it makes me feel good. They’re losing a ton of money.

Some dude at church died and gave the parish a huge amount of money. He got a shout out in the bulletin.

Why in the world do motives matter in this? Who cares why you doing good acts, just do good acts.

The way your thinking basically gives people an excuse not to help others and not help charities.

When you die, God might ask you, “So, you didn’t give money away that helped people because you were going to get attention? Umm…”

Like I said though, whatever you say. I disagree with you though.
 
Rascalking said:
It is actually legalistic, and it can make people neurotic, like I said, whatever you say.

Just tell kids with cancer that the money that is coming in to them is no longer available because the giver wants his name on the hospital wing.

Likewise, I’m no longer donating to pro-life charities because it makes me feel good. They’re losing a ton of money.

Some dude at church died and gave the parish a huge amount of money. He got a shout out in the bulletin.

Why in the world do motives matter in this? Who cares why you doing good acts, just do good acts.

The way your thinking basically gives people an excuse not to help others and not help charities.

When you die, God might ask you, “So, you didn’t give money away that helped people because you were going to get attention? Umm…”

Like I said though, whatever you say. I disagree with you though.
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It is not legalistic but actually the opposite forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=8301110&postcount=11

as the Sermon on the Mount tells us.

Your post here is though mistaking what is being said though.

It is not that one has to avoid any credit necessarily. Such can not always even be avoided. Nor is the fact that some hospital wants to name something after you …necessarily make ones donation bad.

Do good …give money…help out…yes! Feeling good about doing good is a good not an evil…it is a good effect that happens at times when one does good. One is not usually focused on “I am going to go do x just to feel good”…No one usually thinks…Hey that kid needs my help…I am going to go help him.

Jesus went around doing good. He did not stop it all the time cause others noticed it.

Jesus tells us to give …to love etc!

He counsels us though not let our left hand know what our right hand is doing when we do so. Read the 6th Chapter of Matthews Gospel Matt: 6:1-4)…very important for this.

But yes God does care why you do an good act. If you go help some family so you can later more easily steal from them…that is not a good act.

Or as the Catechism notes in 1753:

“On the other hand, an added bad intention (such as vainglory) makes an act evil that, in and of itself, can be good (such as almsgiving).”

It should though be noted that person though who donates say a cancer wing …is not necessarily doing so for vainglory…even if they do end up naming it after him.

Though it he does do it for the purpose vainglory …the object was good…but not his intention. Hopefully he will rectify his intention as he visits the kids there and comes to see that it should have been done for them…not him…

Let us give…and do so with love and for the good of others. Let us be generous.
 
Bookcat said:
I
But yes God does care why you do an good act. If you go help some family so you can later more easily steal from them…that is not a good act.
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That would negate the “good” act because it’s part of grand scheme to steal from the family, it has nothing to do with giving to a cancer ward and getting it named after you because of it.

The “why” in this case is irrelevant.
 
Rascalking said:
That would negate the “good” act because it’s part of grand scheme to steal from the family, it has nothing to do with giving to a cancer ward and getting it named after you because of it.

The “why” in this case is irrelevant.
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It is not irrelevant. It is an extreme example for illustration.

The CCC gives this one:

“On the other hand, an added bad intention (such as vainglory) makes an act evil that, in and of itself, can be good (such as almsgiving)”
 
Bookcat said:
It is not irrelevant. It is an extreme example to make the teaching of the Church clear.

The CCC though gives this one:

“On the other hand, an added bad intention (such as vainglory) makes an act evil that, in and of itself, can be good (such as almsgiving)”
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Like I said, whatever you say.

I’m canceling that check I wrote to my parish. Maybe my intentions were wrong when I wrote it. You can tell the priest why Bookcat! 😉
 
Rascalking said:
It is actually legalistic, and it can make people neurotic, like I said, whatever you say.
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I do think people can make themselves nuts over many things. For example, I could easily see a person with the right thought patterns have the sudden thought that the only reason they are going to mass is to look virtuous in the eyes of their parents, so they start thinking they have to not go to mass until they fix their heart up perfectly. Oh yes, people get like this, and it causes them much anguish.

But what is the right thing to do remains the right thing to do, and what is the teaching of the Church remains the teaching of the Church, even if there are a few out there who have a way of thinking that can torture themselves over it. Confession of mortal sins is one such teaching like that, too. We continue to teach the truth, but the scrupulous need special care and help.

If your intention, your real intention, is mayhem, evil, harm, etc., if what is in your heart in choosing some action is truly wrong, then one ought not do the action. One ought to repent of the thoughts in their heart, and then do the action with just intentions if it is otherwise a good action, or else choose another action.

Just because someone gets their name on a plaque when they give money does not mean the real reason they gave the money was to get their name on a plaque.
 
Was it Paul that said anything done without Love is done for the wrong reason?
 
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