Can God be Void?

[alevanpa]

Originally Posted by Duke of St Paul
In regards to God as our Father, I would say he is like a father and not necessarily a father in the true sense of the word. He relates to us as a father but only is concretely understood as “I AM,” or YHWH; no characteristic can best reflect him beside YHWH. Whatever we know about him he has revealed to us but otherwise we’d know nothing of him. Nevertheless, these revealed characteristics are perfect and thus incomprehensible—we can never measure up. I am not saying he is impersonal but personable because he’s LIKE a father.

If he is not a father, “in the true sense”, then why would he send his son, “…that we may have life eternal?” Why would a stranger, or an aloof and unreachable deity, do such a thing?
In fact we can know a lot about Him: We can know Him through his works.
Certainly, we know that He is eternal (outside time): since He created the universe (initiated the Big Bang or Singularity), He is outside of “time” (which began at the Singularity) and is not a part of it-like us-and the rest of the matter of the universe.
We know that he is creative.
We know He loves life because His universe is configured, specifically, to support it. If, during the Singularity, there was the slightest variation, in temperature or time of development or in any physical development, life (at least as we know it) would not exist-the scientific terminology for this, I think, is “Anthropogenic.”
Nor, by the way, would the physical laws that control us and our world-and the rest of the universe-exist.
We also know that He loves life because he made so much of it-and gave it the ability to procreate itself. If we believe the Bible, He actually tells us to “…go, multiply and fill the earth.”
We know, too, that he thinks pleasure is a good thing, because it’s what the nature He created uses to drive us to multiply.
We know, from creation that He loves life; and, because He created man, and all his ways, He must have a fantastic sense of humor.
We know, too, from considering all this knowledge, that He must be powerful beyond all understanding.
That’s just some of what we can know about Him.

 

[BrunoMaria]

Can God be Void?
This question I only saw now, almost blew my shoes off.
No human being who lived merely some flash 20, 50 or 1oo years (or even the 120 we are supposed to live at the outmost - Gen 6,3) can ever dare to set up such question. How by all means could God, the creator of heaven and earth and all there is, ever be void?! :-(((

We too often hear believers as disbelievers telling how God is, or what God is… - then again the discussion points at the Holy Spirit and at once the question arises “Holy Spirit… what is that?” The invitation for more mystical vocabulary arises, for many think it’s all not truly real, and if at all after all; then explainable in mystical language only. That’s wrong.
How dare we to state at all “how God is” and “what God is”. Aren’t all these attempts utterly void?! We don’t even have to be philosophers not attempt to speak in philosophic terms when trying to parse God, for even children do know God and they do know God in the very right way - simply because they trust in God; and if we don’t accept believe as these Children do, then we’ll never reach God (Mt 18,3).

Though Christianity, belief, connection to God is a mystic thing, believe is not at all esotericism, but as clear as can be - to him who opens himself to God.
Very few of those Jesus met and spoke to, where literate. Most couldn’t read nor writ at Jesus’ time. There was hardly any philosopher among them, but most of them listened and understood, for thus says the Lord GOD’; he that will hear, let him hear; and he that will refuse to hear, let him refuse (Ez 3,27).

None of us will ever fully understand God. Neither in lifetime nor after when we are in beatific view of God. Nor will ever the Angels understand God fully, for God is more than any soul ever is able to comprehend.
But we still can say, that we do know God. For God the Father has revealed Himself to us across His Prophets often enough, and God The Son, Jesus Christ has explained and shown God to us as far as we are able to grasp God. It was Jesus Christ, who gave us further more knowledge of the Holy Sprit of God and that God is The Holy Trinity of God the Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit. Last of whom Jesus had send to us to teach us after Christ’s resurrection (John 15,26 + John 16,7)

God the Father, God the Son and finally God the Holy Spirit enlightened the human perception as far as humanly possible, to actually KNOW God in the way, as a child knows his father, though this little child never really comprehends his father’s ways and means and work etc. Same as our connection to God.

Actually it takes a long lifetime to get all that God has revealed to us about Him and we actually ought to know. But still, we won’t ever even get all this which fills countless libraries. So let’s simply lean back into the loving bosom of our fatherly God, and wait 'til we see Him face to face. The day of our death - which is nothing but the door to God, will be the most exiting and jubilating in our life, which on that day will actually really begin.

Yours
Bruno

 

[alevanpa]

In regards to God as our Father, I would say he is like a father and not necessarily a father in the true sense of the word. He relates to us as a father but only is concretely understood as “I AM,” or YHWH; no characteristic can best reflect him beside YHWH. Whatever we know about him he has revealed to us but otherwise we’d know nothing of him. Nevertheless, these revealed characteristics are perfect and thus incomprehensible—we can never measure up. I am not saying he is impersonal but personable because he’s LIKE a father.

I know about YHWH and “I Am.” The issue is that, with the advent of the Rabbi Jesus, YHWH is no longer an aloof deity who can only be approached on a mountain top while sacrificing an animal.
The point is that he is no longer only YHWH but a father seeking the best for his children (us). That is the message of the Lord’s Prayer, the story of the Prodigal Son, the raising of Lazarus, etc. He is no longer, merely, incomprehensible, He is open to our needs, etc.
I know that you are trying to intellectually resolve the act of creation and have some rational understanding of how and why the universe has come to exist. Why only this universe and no other, etc.?
The problem is that you will never arrive at the explanation that resolve’s all questions with perfect clarity? No one will–and that’s the issue: At a certain point the act of debating itself becomes the focus. The original intent of debating, bringing our brothers and sisters to the acceptance of Jesus, is never realized and, in fact, is forgotten in the maze of proofs and counter-proofs.
So, while it’s great sport to debate these things and pit our knowledge and debating skills against all comers, it is, finally, necessary that we either accept the truth of creation and a loving deity, or just give up the whole debating thing and move on. You know, like Jesus told the 70 He sent to proselytize: I paraphrase: “If they will not accept the good news, then shake the dust of that town from your shoes and move on to the next.” If we don’t do that, what we actually end up engaged in an ego trip: just one more rephrased proof and I’ll have him cornered. I’ll have won.

 

[BrunoMaria]

The original intent of Christian debating, bringing our brothers and sisters to the acceptance of Jesus, has been realized; – for what else does our Church do ever since Jesus founded His Church on St. Peter and Christ made Saul to St. Paul.

This laymen preaching; by some seen as “Great Sport”, rather is heavy work on behalf of Jesus Christ, as He ordered in Mk 16,15 His people to: "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to the whole creation“. This “Great Sport” is a most weary job we have to try and fulfill – mostly with little success, for they closed their eyes and ears and refuse God’s word.

It’s less a question if we win or loose, than a question if God’s word will win. In the end it certainly will. But presently a majority hangs on to the untruth. To him who speaks God’s word, it’s always a win-situation as it was to St. Stephan in Acts 7.

Yours
Bruno

 

[alevanpa]

Bruno,
Thanks for the reply, and I agree wholeheartedly with you: it is our duty as followers of The Christ to proselytize. But, it is also true that at some point we must come to the conclusion that we are in the presence of “Invincible Ignorance”–to use some logic terminology. By that term’s very definition, then, we cannot break through–whether because of hardheadedness, or the respondent is mentally unable to grasp the argument, or that the respondent is simply unwilling to accept–they would have to change their lifestyle, and they are not ready to do that–and we must move on.
In any case, Jesus’ injunction to his deciples–to shake the dust of the un-accepting town from their shoes and move on–stands. It’s telling them, and us, that there is a limit to what we can do, and we are required to recognize that fact, accept it, and act on that conclusion.
Does this mean that we are never to respond to questions about our faith–even from those we have previously spoken with? God forbid! By no means is this true. We must always by ready to explain the reason we believe and what it is we believe–and by using our respondent’s logic system if possible. If you are interested, this site may be helpful: iep.utm.edu/faith-re/.

 

[BrunoMaria]

Does this mean that we are never to respond to questions about our faith–even from those we have previously spoken with? God forbid! By no means is this true

Of course not as we all know. But the cases where we (after we had to turn away because our explanations where responded by blasphemous mocking of God) we actually again have been seriously asked as to belief, are very rare. If indeed an atheist would return and ask again because it made somewhere “click” in his brain, it would be a great victory over stubborness and the Angels in heaven would jubilate about it.

We must always by ready to explain the reason we believe and what it is we believe–and by using our respondent’s logic system if possible

No question about that!

If you are interested, this site may be helpful:…

It would if it would be in German, but it’s in a strange language called “English”
And I hardly speak English
Very similar topic you find here:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=843173

 

[lapis_lazuli]

Your post reminds me of the Heart Sutra: Form is nothingness, nothingness is form.

 

[BrunoMaria]

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heart_Sutra

Totally wrong! What I said has nothing at all to do with it.
I haven’t got the slightest affection to any Buddhist “wisdoms” -for all of this “Religion” is empty philosophy, as Buddhism denies Jesus Christ. Any Philosophy denying Christ is absolutely void. And this proverb of “Form is nothingness, nothingness is form” is especially daft empty words, for “Nothing” remains to be nothing without any shape nor anything behind, whilst form of any kind, will always be documentary for what it represents - be it ugly or nice. (“Nothing” is for instance unable to create a “BIG BANG”)
Pope John-Paul II. said, that Buddhism is a form of atheism. And that’s the point. None of the theories of Nietzsche’s Philosophy is of any value at all, though many study Nietzsche’s and many other atheist’s “cognition” and ridiculous “inferences” seriously. All Philosophies that replace Jesus’ doctrine with the empty “wisdom” of Far-East “religions” such as Buddhist “wisdoms” are simply void and lead away off Jesus’ revelation of the one and only alive God in the Holy Trinity.
God does is not nothingness and God has “form”. He who saw Me, saw the Father Jesus said. When God walked away from Moses, he was allowed to see God from behind Him. Nothingness one can’t see, nor address. We are encouraged to address God the Father in the Lord’s prayer. Really: “Form is nothingness, nothingness is form” is just one more of very many absolutely content-free wisdoms of the incoherent and confused “Religion” of Buddhism, sadly enough so many in our Western hemisphere nowadays hook up to, because they lost the real meaning of life, which can only be found in Jesus Christ, for He alone is the way, the truth and the life.

Yours
Bruno

 

[Michael_Mayo]

I haven’t got the slightest affection to any Buddhist “wisdoms” -for all of this “Religion” is empty philosophy, as Buddhism denies Jesus Christ. Any Philosophy denying Christ is absolutely void.

Buddhism is pre-Christian apophatic approach to living.
It doesn’t deny Christ or God so much as it refuses to talk about them.

 

[BrunoMaria]

As you think you know better than Pope John-Paul II it’s no use to answer