Can he be a Catholic Priest?

[Colt]

So if the calling comes from God but the Church does not verify it, does it exist? How can you know?

If a man is not called then there is no calling, a calling does not exist without the Church.

Again, the calling is from God. You ask how I would know without Church verification and my answer is that I wouldn’t unless perhaps I myself was called. But again, just because I don’t known when a given man is called does not mean God did not call them to be ordained.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Again, the calling is from God. You ask how I would know without Church verification and my answer is that I wouldn’t unless perhaps I myself was called. But again, just because I don’t known when a given man is called does not mean God did not call them to be ordained.

No one here is denying that the call is from God.

Without verification we can not know that a call is present. Even if it is you who are the man involved.

I feel that I have a call to religious life and the priesthood. That feeling is not evidence of a call. I know of people who feel a calling but it is impossible for them to have such a call. So we can not use the feelings of the individual in determining a call. The call must be verified by the Church, until it is verified we can not say that a call is present.

 

[Colt]

No one here is denying that the call is from God.

Without verification we can not know that a call is present. Even if it is you who are the man involved.

I feel that I have a call to religious life and the priesthood. That feeling is not evidence of a call. I know of people who feel a calling but it is impossible for them to have such a call. So we can not use the feelings of the individual in determining a call. The call must be verified by the Church, until it is verified we can not say that a call is present.

Human/practical verification of God’s call to the priesthood is not necessary for His call to exist. Further a bishop could well refuse to ordain someone for a non-righteous reason that he himself knows is non-righteous. His choice of not ordaining a man for a non-righteous reason does not mean the vocation does not exist.

 

[Mrs_Sally]

Human/practical verification of God’s call to the priesthood is not necessary for His call to exist. Further a bishop could well refuse to ordain someone for a non-righteous reason that he himself knows is non-righteous. His choice of not ordaining a man for a non-righteous reason does not mean the vocation does not exist.

Colt, you are arguing against what the church teaches. In 2000+ years, there have probably been many instances of a bishop not ordaining someone for a personal reason, or possibly ordaining someone because he was a friend. Nevertheless, the church still teaches that it is the bishop who calls a man to priesthood through ordination and that there is no other way to verify if a vocation exists other than that him is called to ordination.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Human/practical verification of God’s call to the priesthood is not necessary for His call to exist. Further a bishop could well refuse to ordain someone for a non-righteous reason that he himself knows is non-righteous. His choice of not ordaining a man for a non-righteous reason does not mean the vocation does not exist.

Again, reasons are irrelevant. Do you deny that God works through His Church?

Practical verification is necessary because without it there is no way to know that a call is present.

And to use your idea, a choice of not ordaining a man for a non-righteous reason does not mean that the vocation does exist.

 

[Colt]

Again, reasons are irrelevant. Do you deny that God works through His Church?

Practical verification is necessary because without it there is no way to know that a call is present.

And to use your idea, a choice of not ordaining a man for a non-righteous reason does not mean that the vocation does exist.

Again, God is obviously never irrelevant. The fact that a bishop refuses to ordain a man does not necessarily mean the man did not have a vocation to the priesthood or permanent diaconate. It means that unless something changes, said bishop will not be ordaining said man to the priesthood or permanent diaconate. The bishop’s action (or inaction) does not magically mean that the man did not have a such a vocation from God.

Many men have taken action including moving to other dioceses, joining religious orders and societies and even changing rites of the Church at least partially so they could fulfill their call from God to the priesthood or permanent diaconate. Others have been patient and waited until their diocese received a new bishop, while a limited number of other men with the means have been fortunate enough for their bishops to change their minds and be ordained without moving, etc.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Again, God is obviously never irrelevant.

Please point to where I said that God is irrelevant.

 

[Ohana]

Seems to me that even Thomas Merton had a rocky road to the prieshood. Wasn’t he rejected by a couple of monasteries? He certainly seemed to have a vocation. I will have to re-read 7 Story Mountain

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Seems to me that even Thomas Merton had a rocky road to the prieshood. Wasn’t he rejected by a couple of monasteries? He certainly seemed to have a vocation. I will have to re-read 7 Story Mountain

As I said before, just because one bishop or religious superior (or even more than one) rejects a candidate, that does not mean that they do not have a vocation. What it does mean is that they do not have a vocation to serve in that diocese under that bishop or a vocation to that religious institute under that religious superior.

They may go on to be called to religious life and/or the priesthood at a later date.

But we must keep in mind that it is the Church that does the calling. The Church recognizes the vocation of the man in question. If the Church does not Call then no calling, by definition, exists. One can not have a call without being called.

All this misinformation that is being provided leads to an unrealistic view that a man may have a calling that is not actualized. No one can be sure of a calling until the Church calls (again this is by definition). It is also unhealthy as it creates an opposition and may lead someone who feels they have a calling but the Church does not call them. They can (and some do) run around saying that they have a calling and eventually leave the Church over it.

It is important to remember that God does not call for the impossible. God does not call a man to a place where he can not serve. God would not call a man to serve in a diocese under a bishop who refuses to ordain that man.

I think I have gone as far as one could be expected to go on this topic.

If anyone has a question as to what I have said please feel free to ask about it but please do quote the post that you are asking about. Other than that I feel I am now http://www.ryanmcbain.com/forums/images/smilies/beatdeadhorse.gif and there is nothing more that can be said.

I will pray for you, please pray for me.